EWBS? Not a scientific organisation of which I'm aware and therefore can't comment on what they've discovered. I hear wonderful - almost magical things from them but without scrutineering or any authentication, can't possibly comment. I will say this though - get the facsimile arrows even a bit wrong, and the equipment you need to drive them will inevitably sky rocket.
Hello Chris,
I wonder if you could clarify some of your points, please?
I don't think any archery group is also a scientific organisation or am I wrong? The EWBS is the only group to differentiate between different period bow woods and non-period bows so it's data is very valid.
Secondly, you raise scrutineering or authentication. When I shot with the BL-BS, Pickwicks (Simon Stanley's Military arrow) and shoot with GNAS I was not aware of any outside scrutineering from another body. Was this the case? Actually at Batsford it could be argued that this happens, however perhaps you have a point. Al and I are putting on a shoot on the 29th August and it would be great if you could come down and verify the distances. Why not post the results here? It's an open shoot so no worries about insurance. You can shoot too, I'll pay your entry fee. I'll send you a PM with the details, you will have fun I'm sure.
Finally, have you seen our Livery Arrow specification? Here are links to it in more depth.
http://www.englishwarbowsociety.com/EWBS_ARROW_SPECIFICATIONS.html
http://www.englishwarbowsociety.com/tudor-livery-arrow.html
Given that not even the MR arrows were of one design and we can never know every detail for absolutely sure I wonder what you think is amiss and what society's arrow spec' is better?
Cheers,
Jeremy
Edited due to spelling
Jeremy (and Alistair)
You're right, other archery associations don't class themselves as scientific organisations either- but then I don't remember the Pickwicks or anyone involved as claiming 'discoveries' about the MR bows or anything else. True, the JH competition was an attempt in the direction of data collection but you don't get it bandied around on any forum (not even on the closed one which I participate in).
I agree with you that the issue of scrutineering really does need looking at - not only for the satisfaction of the archery community but also for the enhancement of the good reputations of the archers who achieve what they do. The example below
The record was set at around 430 yds but this was not a recorded world flight record
The actual distance was recorded at 438yds, shot by Alistair Aston, this is an official record with the EWBS and a world record, just because it wasn't shot at a FITA event doesn't mean it isn't official. It was measured with laser range finders by Mark Stretton and the bow was checked by both Mark Stretton and Steve Stratton, both commitee oficials within the EWBS, this shot was witnessed by over 50 other archers from around Europe
Illustrates my point. Yes it is scrutineering, but no it isn't independent - although I don't doubt that the best possible was done on the day. A flight shoot is basically a speed test. In any speed test of which I'm aware, the scrutineering is done by a different organisation to the organiser/participants. The FIA for example is separate from FOTA or the team owners in F1 motor racing. Thus the highest standards are maintained - and if this was done, you wouldn't get the squawking that goes on each time the EWBS announces a NEW WORLD RECORD.
Its kind of you both to invite me to your shoot on 29th Aug. I'm due to be out of the country then but I wouldn't attend in any case as a scrutineer, I'd like to shoot - I can think of a number of appropriate people to do that who have never weighed in in any part of the debates between the heavy bow interested parties and are therefore properly independent and of stature in the field. I would like to attend one of your open shoots however and if there is one between about mid Sept and mid Oct, please pm me. After that, all bets are off for me for now and perhaps for some time as I will be awaiting the imminent birth of child no 2 and my archery may be stuffed for a bit.
All the best to you both.
Chris