Main Discussion Area > English Warbow
Medieval Fletching
Yewboy:
--- Quote from: bow-toxo on July 06, 2009, 05:33:33 pm ---
--- Quote from: Adam Keiper on July 05, 2009, 10:59:01 pm ---I've found information on the net about the size and shape of medieval fletchings, but nothing as to whether they were applied straight or with a helical twist. Nor have I seen reference as to what was glue may have been used to attach the feathers, nor what finish was used to seal the shafts or fletch wrappings. Can anyone provide info?
--- End quote ---
As noted in ‘The Art of Archery’ [you can look it up on ‘Archery Library’], arrows in MR time were either glued or waxed. Those found on the MR were waxed with a mixture of wax, resin and viridian. The mixture is heated until fluid and applied to the shaftment. When cool the feathers are tied in position with spiraly wrapped thread, and then carefully heated to again melt the mixture and fuse everything together. A similar earlier process used birch tar made from birch bark.. This was used in the Nydam arrows as well as in the Viking period. There is an excellent and thorough article on this in the current June/July issue of ‘Primitive Archer’, Glue was probably animal glue, used until fairly recently, or isinglass and Bronze Age arrows are reported to have used bluebell glue. Viking and Alemannic fletching and I think Mary Rose too, were helical.
Cheers,
Erik
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As far as I know the glue used was a Verdigris mixture, this is an animal based glue (Rabbit Glue) mixed with copper for waterproofing, also this glue dries very quickly, the feather was then stuck on straight and not helical, the silk whipping was then put in place and as you can see by the MR arrow below the whipping thread has all but dissapeared so the glue could not have been heated and sealed the thread otherwise it would still be there and you can plainly see that the thread has gone leaving an imprint where it once was. Also to heat the glue to a temperature that it would melt would cause the feather to burn.
bow-toxo:
--- Quote from: Yewboy on July 07, 2009, 05:54:57 am ---
As far as I know the glue used was a Verdigris mixture, this is an animal based glue (Rabbit Glue) mixed with copper for waterproofing, also this glue dries very quickly, the feather was then stuck on straight and not helical, the silk whipping was then put in place and as you can see by the MR arrow below the whipping thread has all but dissapeared so the glue could not have been heated and sealed the thread otherwise it would still be there and you can plainly see that the thread has gone leaving an imprint where it once was. Also to heat the glue to a temperature that it would melt would cause the feather to burn.
--- End quote ---
Hugh Soar writes that the mixture was bees wax, pitch and verdegris, no glue per se.Verdegris is acetate of copper and gives the green colour. If you have better information, I would like to see it.The red silk [some is reported to have been preserved] binding would have been wound onto the feathers over the cooled mixture. You can see the fletching placement and the imprint of the thread left in the reheated fused mixture. Yes, you can heat the wax without burning the feathers. It is clear from your comments that you have not read the excellent article on this topic in 'Primitive Archer' magazine. Try it. You can learn something.
adb:
I think we can all learn (and teach) things along the way, if we're willing, and be gracious about how that happens. Learning is not a contest to reveal who thinks they know more.
As far as glue goes, there are many types, and I think pitch qualifies. Plain old water can be glue. I'm not sure anyone knows definitively what the purpose of the verdegris actually was. Also, if anyone was interested, they could go to the Mary Rose museum and see these things for themself firsthand, and not have to guess.
Yewboy:
--- Quote from: bow-toxo on July 07, 2009, 07:38:25 pm ---
--- Quote from: Yewboy on July 07, 2009, 05:54:57 am ---
As far as I know the glue used was a Verdigris mixture, this is an animal based glue (Rabbit Glue) mixed with copper for waterproofing, also this glue dries very quickly, the feather was then stuck on straight and not helical, the silk whipping was then put in place and as you can see by the MR arrow below the whipping thread has all but dissapeared so the glue could not have been heated and sealed the thread otherwise it would still be there and you can plainly see that the thread has gone leaving an imprint where it once was. Also to heat the glue to a temperature that it would melt would cause the feather to burn.
--- End quote ---
Hugh Soar writes that the mixture was bees wax, pitch and verdegris, no glue per se.Verdegris is acetate of copper and gives the green colour. If you have better information, I would like to see it.The red silk [some is reported to have been preserved] binding would have been wound onto the feathers over the cooled mixture. You can see the fletching placement and the imprint of the thread left in the reheated fused mixture. Yes, you can heat the wax without burning the feathers. It is clear from your comments that you have not read the excellent article on this topic in 'Primitive Archer' magazine. Try it. You can learn something.
--- End quote ---
Hi Bow-Toxo
Look everything I have written comes from 1st hand knowledge, by this I mean I have studied the arrows, Bows and many other artifacts on the MR, not through a glass case but actually holding them, You see I have personal access to all of the archery related artifacts and use a special study room at the Mary Rose Trust to do my research, so please don't tell me to read some article probably written by another academic who has never handled these bows or arrows.
There are far to many so called experts who make statements but have never handled or been up close and personal to the items we are talking about, So please do not quote books at me or authors.
Hugh Soar is a close and personal freind, I very much doubt you have ever met him, So much new information has been gleaned by people like me and Mark Stretton with regards these artifacts that a lot of our previous beliefs about what was and what could be has been updated, research does not stop once someone has written a book about it, things move on like anything else we get better at it.
Mark Stretton and I are now helping medieval historians and academics in getting a better understanding of what they are teaching their students, We have recently done a lecture with Dr Anne Curry at Southampton University and are now booked to do a similar lecture at Reading University on the bows and arrows of the medieval period.
As ADB says this is not a pissing competition, however please accept that their are others out here who know a lot more about the actual artifacts than you do.
adb:
Well said, yewboy.
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