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Glass: a few follies

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tom sawyer:
David, I typed a post much like your original comments, but wisely deleted it before posting.  Since this is the primitive archery forum I wouldn't expect your comments to be taken kindly, even though they are techniclaly correct with respect to performance and longevity.  If someone wants to think their wood bow is faster than a glass bow, who are we to stand in their way?  A lok at the recent TN Classic results should provide some unambiguous data though.

I don't know that more craftsmen are using glass in commercial construction because it is superior in every way.  I think thats what the public wants, at least those who don't want wheels on the ends.  That and it would be really difficult to produce enough bows of adequate consistency, to fill hundreds of orders.

I don't think Jawge was supposing you were parroting, I think he was saying you pulled it out of your hiney just to be funny.

DCM:
Lennie,

Oh!  LOL

I'm not actually serious.  I just figured folks were cruising for a flame fest.  Somebody has to take a turn in the barrel.  Don't tell George.  Maybe we can get him all riled up and see some real sparks fly.  As regards what bowyers use and the public demands, that doesn't change the reality of it.  Master bowyers still prefer glass over wood, regardless of their rationale but I doubt it's because it sucks in comparison.  Kinda like them fellas that make fancy drawings on the sidewalk in New York City with chalk, masterpieces, but most artists pick a medium with a little more resilience.  I'm actually more like the sidewalk chalk bowyer, but at least I know what I'm doing and take that path with eyes wide open.

George Tsoukalas:
Dana, thanks. I may need all the friends I can assemble after dismantling DCM's arguements. David, naw I don't thinks so. You object to the word 'some". However...
"But that does not imply, and I did not imply that ALL master craftsmen prefer it for their work as you have suggested.  This is where you went astray, and I have to wonder why."
Sure sounds like an implicit "some" there.
"Then you insinuate my idea's aren't my own, as if I were parroting someone elses thoughts, a blind follower."
No, you misunderstand. I do believe these ideas are your own. Where they came from is still the question. I have the same problem sometimes. That's why it gets hard to think when I'm sitting down. LOL.
Yes, this is fun. :)
Jawge

George Tsoukalas:
Ya right. You are going to get me all riled up. LOL, David. It's even better when I am misunderstood. I told my brother the same thing. He's a computer tech. Just passed a very difficult Novel "administrator's" exam. I told him it was because he just finished his colonoscopy and accompanying  prep. Made room for the entry of more knowledge. Jawge

Badger:
      In defense of my own methods as far as being primitve go, I have no clue how to use supertiller or any other computer math oriented program. My mass method is basicaly just based on taking bows that took little set and performed well from a variety of different sizes shapes and styles and then finding the link between them which happened to be mass weight of the bows. I am not particularly bright but not stupid either, after you make a few thousand bows you just start to see links and trends that make sense and hold water. I found out the mass method was used by the turks long before i ever came around so it is not really anything new. Working with demensional formulas based on species was just far too inconsistent for me. I have said over and over that by far the best method is to read the wood as you progress in tillering, throw away the tape measure and the scale. I now use the scale primarily to know when I should back off a bit and not ask too much from the wood, others may tend to not ask enough from the wood and use the scale in an opposite manner. I tend to get a little defensive and slightly frustrated when I see my methods being passed off as tecnical when they are really just experience based. I enjoy for much reading the tecnical repaorts even though I understand very little of it. I appreciate seeing our theories being tested and probed and often challenged.  right or wrong I hold the belief that bowyering is an ongoing trade that we continue to learn and advance at and much like any trade or craft we advance at a level that is in relation to how much we put into it, wether that be shop time or educating ourselves or a combination of both.
     As for wood bows competeing with glass or synthetic materials, I think good wood bows can compete with mediocre glass bows, I think a rare specimen might even be able to match the top glass bows on occassion but never match them in all criteria such as durability, repeatability etc.
    As for David Mimms and Jawge, I hold both these guys in the absolute highest esteem and respect for both their skills and dedication to what we are doing here. I have considered DCM a personnal mentor for most of my time on line and have in the last year come back to Jawges way of thinking in many many ways in regards to building good wod bows. Steve

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