Main Discussion Area > English Warbow
Meaning of 'Piked'
alanesq:
--- Quote from: Papa Matt on August 01, 2008, 03:30:08 pm --- What's the translation of that passage in red? It looks cool.
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I believe this is the way the book was originally written
the printed versions I have has been translated into more modern English but I have found that its best to refer to the original as some times the translated version can be misleading
btw - you can download it from http://www.archive.org/download/RogerAschamToxophilus1545/RogerAschamToxophilus1545.pdf
bow-toxo:
--- Quote from: Yeomanbowman on August 01, 2008, 06:54:52 pm ---
--- Quote from: bow-toxo on July 15, 2008, 11:28:08 pm ---Whipping in this case means thinning the tips To increase the fiexiabiility and to reduce stress on the handgrip area. Mary Rose bows were thinned in the last foot or so. This thinning was thought to increase cast
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The act of cutting shorter is not expressed as a verb but rather a sentence (saying just about that) and mentioned before piking. Pikes, as in the staff weapon, were tapered at the tips and for my money piking was the process of thinning the tips not whipping. I think whipping could well mean something else. It is important to keep an open mind and no state things that are clearly not definitive as such. We may well never fully know what whipping described but can only state our case based on experience and evidence.
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I totally agree that piking would mean tapering at the tips. Ascham recommends "whipping at the endes but with discretion, lest he whippe in sunder, or els freete.". To me, that means thinning the tips, that being thinner are less prone to compression damage, close to the point of brerakage. It seems clear to me. As always, I am willing to be convinced by a more likely explanation.
ratty:
i read and understood the word whipping as gentle recurving the tips.
bow-toxo:
--- Quote from: ratty on August 03, 2008, 04:58:19 pm ---i read and understood the word whipping as gentle recurving the tips.
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None of the Mary Rose bows has recurved ends, gentle or otherwise. Why would a recurve be in danger of "whipping in sunder"? Also , why would Ascham suggest that recurving was normal practice when none of the many MR bows, most probably made in his lifetime, show any sign of recurve ? Maybe you are thinking of that 'Weapons that made Britain" expert ?
ratty:
--- Quote from: bow-toxo on August 03, 2008, 09:21:46 pm ---
--- Quote from: ratty on August 03, 2008, 04:58:19 pm ---i read and understood the word whipping as gentle recurving the tips.
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None of the Mary Rose bows has recurved ends, gentle or otherwise. Why would a recurve be in danger of "whipping in sunder"? Also , why would Ascham suggest that recurving was normal practice when none of the many MR bows, most probably made in his lifetime, show any sign of recurve ? Maybe you are thinking of that 'Weapons that made Britain" expert ?
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Take your bow into the field, shoot in him, sink him with dead heavy shafts, look where he cometh most, provide for that place betimes, lest it pinch, and so fret : when you have thus shot in him, and perceived good shooting wood in him, you must have him again to a good, cunning, and trusty workman, which shall cut him shorter, and pike him and dress him fitter, make him come round compass everywhere, and whipping at the ends, but with discretion, lest he whip in sunder, or else fret, sooner than he is ware of: he must also lay him straight, if he be cast, or otherwise need require; and if he be flat made, gather him round, and so shall he both shoot the faster for far shooting, and also the surer for near pricking.
--- Quote ---make him come round compass everywhere, and whipping at the ends, but with discretion, lest he whip in sunder, or else fret, sooner than he is ware of
--- End quote ---
i read this with the impression he was talking about recurving the tips (but with discretion)
and if they bent them too much while putting in a slight recrve, they would sunder, split/break/.
im sure in these quotes here, that tox is referring to recreational bows, not military.
words can have different meaning depending on the periods they are written for eg.
Etymology: Middle English wippen, whippen; akin to Middle Dutch wippen to move up and down, sway, Old English wīpian to wipe
Date: 14th century
or
Main Entry: 1whip
Pronunciation: \ˈhwip, ˈwip\
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): whipped; whip·ping
Etymology: Middle English wippen, whippen; akin to Middle Dutch wippen (to move up and down, sway,) Old English wīpian to wipe
Date: 14th century
transitive verb
1: to take, pull, snatch, jerk, or otherwise move very quickly and forcefully
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