Main Discussion Area > English Warbow
bow building grain orientation
bow-toxo:
Craig; While it is true that the crown did not require a choice from the suggested list, that list indicated the preferred "meane woods' Edward IV issued a list that included yew for Irish longbows "of yew, wych hazel[wych bieing a Saxon word meaning supple],ash, aubourne, or any other reasonable wood". Emphasis on "reasonable". Cambrensis says the Wellsh didn't make their bows of cornus, laburnum or yew, lndicating that he would have expected those woods. Cornus, a Latin word, could mean either horn or dogwood. The French also used whitethorn for flight bows [Lartdarcherie]. I suppose that most bowyers would stick to the list and leave balsa wood alone.
CraigMBeckett:
Erick,
In your post you said "and a choice was made from a limited list of woods the Crown considered suitable" which I disagree(d) with especially for the periods I mention. Your list from Edward IV does nothing to change that and I would suggest that it is your interpretation that places the emphasis on reasonable. What is the difference between this use of reasonable in this statute and Henry's use of "suitable" in the 1515 statute? They both give the selection of suitable or reasonable woods to the bowyer.
I am puzzled and must ask what has Gerald got to do with this part of the discussion when he was merely a cleric and not a law maker, or are you offering this as an adjunct to the list of woods used in bow making? Even here I have to disagree with your list of woods the two translations of his work I have read say:
1, "They are made neither of horn, ash nor yew, but of elm; ugly unfinished-looking weapons, but astonishingly stiff".
2. "Yet the bows used by this people are not made of horn, ivory, or yew, but of wild elm; unpolished, rude, and uncouth, but stout".
No mention of either dogwood or laburnum however as you say cornus may be either horn or dogwood as it is the name of the dogwood genus, but I question whether it was the medieval Latin name used for dogwood or is merely the modern scientific name which only dates to the last few centuries, perhaps if there are any Latin scholars reading this they can enlighten us as to the use of cornus in ancient and medieval Latin. I lean towards cornus meaning horn, for we know that horn bows were not unknown to the English if by nothing else that the Roman occupation and it would be surprising if Gerald did not use it in his flowery comparison of the Welsh bows. In addition there is definitely no mention of laburnum in Gerald's text.
As for the list from Edward IV can you tell me the statute date and if possible post the text of it, I want to see what the intended purpose was, all I can find from him effecting/concerning archery are :
1464 Aspen that is not fit for arrows may be used for patten making. A partial repeal of Henry V statute reserving Aspen for the manufacture of arrows.
1472 Merchants are to bring into England 4 bowstaves with every ton of imported goods.
1482 The price of yew bows is set to a maximum of 3s. 4d.
The statute you refer to may be one of the above but as I only have notes on the major point of the statute not the full English text of it I do not know.
Craig.
bow-toxo:
Craig In the second half of the fifteenth century, Edward IV issued a curious statute, his fifth act. Referring to Ireland, it specified that "every Englishman, or Irishman living with Englishmen, provide himself with an English bow of his own height plus a fistmele and with twelve shafts of the length of three quarters of the Standard". Apparently the motive was to make the Irish accustomed to longbows even with arrows more suited to their short bows. My assumption is that Cambrensis had enough familiarity with Norman bows to know what they were commonly made of, even though as a clergyman , like Ascham, he was not required to practice shooting
Erik
adb:
I've always wondered why you guys (Erik & Craig) don't have an off forum discussion about medieval longbows. As usual, you guys have dragged this topic (which was grain orientation in bow making) off to a pissing contest about medieval longbows. I, for one, find it annoying. This guy has asked for some advice. Why don't we keep it there?
bow-toxo:
--- Quote from: adb on May 19, 2011, 12:13:04 am ---I've always wondered why you guys (Erik & Craig) don't have an off forum discussion about medieval longbows. As usual, you guys have dragged this topic (which was grain orientation in bow making) off to a pissing contest about medieval longbows. I, for one, find it annoying. This guy has asked for some advice. Why don't we keep it there?
--- End quote ---
Sorry about your annoyance. I thought I might contribute to “I'm interested in building medieval style warbows” once the grain issue had been dealt with. It seemed like a good idea at the time but got sidetracked.
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