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English longbows can be tough!
duffontap:
I think my heavy flatbow is 69" ntn and 1 1/2" wide. It's the crabapple bow which I suppose has a similar density to horn beam. I've drawn it 30" or so. Pretty amazing wood--no set. I'm just finishing another crabapple bow I've been working on for a long time. I'll post it soon. I wish I could get more of that wood. :P
J. D.
mullet:
Hey J D,I wasn't trieing to pick a fight with you.I was just commenting on the same attitude that Hillbilly has seen also.I don't have a problem with ELB's.I like making them myself.The comment about learning new things was your quote.
As far as short bows or bows that are not ELB's which seems to be the issue.There are lot's of different ones.Re curve,RF/DF,and so on.I wouldn't hunt anything here with one of those West coast bows myself.But the Indigenous people probally had to do what was needed to eat.
I know it's illeagle to hunt in alot of foreign countries,the people living there let that happen but that's another issue.If that attitude catches on here I'm sure we could look forward to the same thing.I target shoot also.I'm going to a shoot Sunday as I do every other Sunday when it's not hunting season.I guess I am narrow minded,I build bows to hunt with,I go to 3-D shoots for the camaraderie and to hone my shooting skills for hunting.I don't care about trophies and plaques.Like I said, I wasn't trieing to pick a fight,But it always seems like If somebody doesn't agree about how brilliant the ELB is then the ELB community gets real defensive.
Justin Snyder:
--- Quote from: J. D. Duff on June 27, 2007, 11:18:03 pm --- Steve Allelly has an English longbow in his personal collection and told me not long ago that he had to ditch his Ishi-style bow for his English longbow in the middle of hunting season because the little bow was hurting his elbow and he was having accuracy problems. He prefers hunting with a Native American design but says an English longbow is more accurate and it obviously adapts to his style of hunting.
Generally speaking, there is a cast and power advantage with longer bows. Less stack equates to higher early draw weight and more working length allows for longer draws and fat fd curves. "Short bows perform almost unbelievably slower than longer bows," Tim Baker.
--- End quote ---
Because it does not fit Steve Allelly's (whomever that is) hunting style, don't mean anything. You would never get a shot off with that long of a bow when hunting around here. You have to get to dang high off the ground to draw and will be seen.
While length does add to stability, it does not necessarily add to performance. The additional weight of the long limbs can in fact rob more energy than it gives. Short bows shoot with equal draw length shoot faster, until the string angle becomes an issue. This can be solved with re curves. If we were to compare range and energy, I would be packing a Asiatic Hornbow. Short with high draw weight and no fretting.
Ironically Baker states that Ishi style bows, wide limb narrow handle, D-bows, are the hardest to tiller. I would think the shorter and heavier the less forgiving. But I hate to even compare bows. What is next? Comparing compounds? Justin
D. Tiller:
I'm going to stay out of this one but to say I met Steve at the Black Butes Knappinn. (Nice guy to boot!) He was showing the bow and arrow he just used to take a nice little buck. I believe it was a Maidu style bow but not to sure about it. These short bows do make meat but they are meant for ambush hunting and close in shots. Steve also mentioned he liked bows arround 45# for hunting in this style since they allowed you to hold draw for a while untill the deer was in just the right position for the shot to be taken. He also said that most of the originals were even lighter in weight.
But the cool thing is that the 50# short Modoc bows a few friends I made there, Yep Billy and Dave thats you guys! ;D , had 50# bows arround 50-56" long that were shooting just as fast if not faster and just as accurate as some of the ELB's I've come across in simmilar weight range. Personaly I think you need to judge bows used by past societies not against eachother but against the environments and sittuations they were being used in.
Just my personal two cents on the subject!
David T
Trapper:
I think there has been a mixup on what you all are talking about some say a dbow and I was thinking All english longbows do have a d cross section, thats because they could turn out alot of bows fast, not haveing the big flat surface to scrape made tillering the elb alot faster, by being able to take off narrower strips on the rounded belly, Right? Well I can still make a ALB shoot harder and farther than a english tillered bow, because I have done the testing, and the english were lucky to have yew to do it with because it can stand the compression on the round belly.D crosssection isnt the same as a D tiller. Trappe Or am I just blowing SMOKE
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