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Medival iron point question (Re post)

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bdog:
Re posted from the arrow section :
Hey all....been a long time since last post but I ran across something and I'd like the opinion of the board on it. I was at our local Renaissance fair and I saw a guy with a bunch of reproduction medieval points, including one that I'm sure we've all heard refer ed to as a "rope cutter" point. He was of the opinion that the popular idea was incorrect and that these were actually a small game or bird point. The design looks like a crescent moon with the inside radius of the curve sharpened and facing down range (towards the target) it's a common design throughout the world I saw examples from Asian and India as well. What's the general consensus on this point? I looked at the Internet and there was no real conclusive information easily found. Thoughts?

WillS:
Anybody who thinks it's a "rope cutter" hasn't got a basic understanding of how an arrow works - they spin when they fly.  ;)

I think the general consensus is that they're hunting points for game / birds.  I've never heard an intelligent argument against that idea.

bdog:
I accept that the rope cutting theory is a little far fetched. They clearly could cut a rope but the practicality of hitting it seems low. I should point out that Ive used modern turkey guillotine heads that function similarly and they neatly decapitate a turkey. This is with a modern compound bow so the poundage is similar but the accuracy is much higher. It is interesting to note that this design was found on battlefields so it was used in combat. Perhaps archers carried a selection of game points for foraging and shot them in the heat of battle without noticing? There is a video showing styles of iron points found at Jamestown and the historian refers to this point as a game point but states it might also be used against larger game by cutting a tendon. Possibly used as an anti horse weapon? Its interesting that the design is so common but we dont know for sure its purpose.....

WillS:
How common were they actually?  You say some have been found at battle sites, but do you know how many?

The reason I ask it that the Type 16 has been found in various places, and many believe that it was one of the most common types of military head but I'm firmly of the belief that it was far more rare than that.  In fact a couple of weeks ago I had a lengthy discussion with Mark Stretton about that very issue, and the conversation convinced me that the Type 16 was far more rare than people seem to think - not least due to it's complicated construction method (fire-welding the tangs) which simply doesn't make sense for mass-producing military arrowheads.

As for archers shooting various types - I can't imagine that's possible somehow but I do like your idea of shooting a hunting arrow by mistake.  Personally I think that during combat archers would be supplied with sheaves of Type 10 or similar arrowheads (if we're discussing mid 13thC to late 15thC) and wouldn't need to use anything else but I can definitely imagine somebody running out, and grabbing the nearest ammunition available which could well be a personal hunting arrow.

meanewood:
Interesting topic but very hard to find evidence to back up any 21st century opinion.

Many illustrations show the large swept broad heads in use on the battlefield and they were undoubtedly used as horse killers!

Bodkins were developed to penetrate both mail and plate but I think I saw a video that showed the bodkin wasn't all that good against other, more common early protection such as leather and linen.

A cutting edge is better for these, so the development of the Tudor bodkin combined the bodkin point with a cutting edge which gives a more all purpose warhead!

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