Author Topic: Hazel longbow, UPDATE: some pics  (Read 3183 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #30 on: October 30, 2017, 06:30:07 am »
I downloaded the calculator, read instructions a couple of times and played with it. Really interesting tool and easy to use if you have bought already assembled modern arrows but needs to be calibrated if you make wooden arrows yourself. From what I see, two black boxes should match as closely as possible and they will have number very close to poundage of your bow.

I finished my spine tester and now the new project is arrow tapering jig.

Offline WillS

  • Member
  • Posts: 1815
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2017, 02:53:04 am »
For what it's worth, my advice is to ignore spine testers and also tapering jigs.

They're fine if you're buying arrow shafts that have been selected by weight or rough spine already, but if you're using dowels from hardware shops or better still cutting your own timber and turning them into shafts you should be tapering the arrows differently depending on their weight.  If you run them all through the same jig you'll end up with a load of different weights due to the natural variances of the timber you're using.  You also would need to make different jigs for every different species of wood which is daft. 

Forget spine as well for now, because the simplest method is to finish a large set of arrows without spining, shoot them into a target and group them by where they hit.  Get a feel for each group's spine by simply flexing them in your hands and after a bit of practice you'll be able to spine future shafts based on what you learn.  It's so unimportant if you're not shooting for competition scoring, and all you really need to know is whether the arrow is safe for the bow you're using.

Beech is fine by the way, it's mentioned by Ascham in Toxophilus and works nicely out of pretty much any weight bow.  You'll have to experiment with different tapers to suit the stuff you get, but my initial advice would be to go for a 3/8" size and taper the last 8 or 10 inches down to about 11/32 for a 70-90lb bow.

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2017, 07:53:24 am »
What about 10 mm diameter all way parallel from beech? Too strong? I thought of doing tapering jig so I can make in future torpedo shaped ones, for stronger bows. I read that definition of torpedo is last 1/3 of the arrow tapered.
EWBS lists livery arrow as being suitable for bobtail or torpedo shape with nocks being 3/8" in diameter and near arrowhead being 1/2" in diameter. I would like to try make these type of arrows.   

Btw, I thought of jig as a tool which can be modified for different tapers. I have some ideas for it. It would not be large, since it would taper only that last third of an arrow.


Offline WillS

  • Member
  • Posts: 1815
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2017, 07:58:25 am »
Tapering the last 1/3 is fine, but you will want to extend that sometimes.  It's not very common to only taper the final 1/3, the more common method is to taper the entire shaft from head to nock.  It's not actually historically correct, but then neither is tapering the last 1/3...

My point really was that every arrow should be tapered differently according to it's weight, spine and what you're using it for.  It's up to you though - to be honest, most people just taper from head to nock on every single arrow.

Beech will be fine at 10mm parallel, but will shoot better with a rear taper.

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #34 on: October 31, 2017, 08:59:37 am »
How do you usually do your taperings? Do you have jig or you hold arrow and drill in one hand and sand paper in other? I thought of that as an alternative solution.

So, you actually do the spine testing on parallel shafts and then you proceed to tapering the arrows? How do you determine how much taper do you need according to spine?

P.S. What is historically correct profile of medieval warbow arrow? Barreled?

Offline WillS

  • Member
  • Posts: 1815
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #35 on: October 31, 2017, 12:43:35 pm »
They used all sorts of profiles in order to make each shaft as good as possible.  Some are parallel, some are bobtailed (this isn't a straight taper but more like the shape of a trumpet) some are barrelled, saddled, chested etc etc.  There is no one "medieval" arrow shape.

I do mine with a knife or block plane if I'm turning the shafts by hand the traditional way, or a small belt sander if I'm doing them quickly.  My method with hardware shop dowels is to flex them to get a rough idea, weigh them and group them and then taper them depending on the individual weight and rough spine.  If a shaft is very dense and stiff I'll bobtail them, if it's quite whippy and light I'll keep them full width as long as possible. 

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2017, 05:25:18 am »
My method with hardware shop dowels is to flex them to get a rough idea, weigh them and group them and then taper them depending on the individual weight and rough spine.  If a shaft is very dense and stiff I'll bobtail them, if it's quite whippy and light I'll keep them full width as long as possible.

I will do as you described, although I will use my spine tester as I don't know the feel of spine by hand. Tomorrow I am hopefully buying heat gun and can finally correct the bow.

Would you say that 40 mm of reflex is too excessive? That is what happened with bow, together with going to the side. It lost very little moisture in last few weeks but it still got deformed. Can't say I am happy about it.


Offline JNystrom

  • Member
  • Posts: 57
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #38 on: November 02, 2017, 12:21:05 am »
Look for 25-30cm feathers, those are way too short. I've bought quite a lot of cheap goose feathers from ebay, 18/100pcs or so with free international shipping.

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #39 on: November 02, 2017, 12:55:14 am »
Ah, 10" at least? Look at the turkey ones, they seem to be best suited and look nice. I don't care if they were not used in medieval europe as turkeys weren't imported yet.

Offline JNystrom

  • Member
  • Posts: 57
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #40 on: November 02, 2017, 01:12:18 am »
Why best suited, when goose was used? I don't know was it allowed to link here those... Anyway, you can find 25-30cm goose or turkey there. I would prefer goose. Some of them are colored all funky, but you can pick the white one.

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #41 on: November 02, 2017, 01:58:13 am »
I can't seem to find goose feathers over 5" in length, that is why.

Offline JNystrom

  • Member
  • Posts: 57
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #42 on: November 02, 2017, 02:34:51 am »
Search "goose feathers 25-30".

Offline FilipT

  • Member
  • Posts: 595
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #43 on: November 02, 2017, 05:58:02 am »
Ah thank you, now I found them. Before I put "goose feathers 10 inch" or "goose feathers 25 cm" and didn't get the wanted results, weird.

Offline WillS

  • Member
  • Posts: 1815
Re: Hazel longbow - some questions
« Reply #44 on: November 02, 2017, 08:11:21 am »
I get my goose and swan feathers for free, as I just pick them up every breeding season.  Waterbirds drop their flight feathers at the same time as building nests, so I can usually get around 300 - 500 over a couple of weeks.

If you get geese nesting in your country I wouldn't bother paying somebody else to pick them up