Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: stuckinthemud on November 28, 2018, 08:44:45 am
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Right, first thing first, I hate bows that stack at the end of the draw, and I dislike string angles that make shooting 3-under un-comfortable, I also really enjoy technical challenges but I do not have the time and equipment for glue/lam bows. Baring all that in mind, what would you consider a great design for flight/3-D work for someone with a 24" draw that likes shooting between 35 and 40#? Anything goes, including sinew, horn, r/d, hollow-limb, hooks, sijahs...
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The Bob Martin design in Laubin's book is about as good as you'll find. I'd be curious to know what sort of bow is giving you stack and finger pinch at 24" though.
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I have a 52" ttt, 51" ntn yew character shorty that stacks a lot over the last inch or two of draw, it's fun to shoot just to see the look on people's faces when they see that, first it didn't snap, and then, how hard it punches an arrow, but, I don't enjoy putting more than a few arrows through it at any one time.
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PatM,
Which Laubin book are you talking about? Thanks,
Hawkdancer
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His book American Indian Archery in the chapter on sinew bows
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Simple primitive limbs the shape of Willow leaves, about 1 1/2" - 1 3/4" wide tapering to about 1/4" .
Narrowed at the grip, flat belly, curved back following the shape of the log.
62" or more long. No fancy recurve, flip tips etc.
Clean simple effective.
Del
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Little version of Meare Heath with narrower tips?
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I took the "enjoy technical challenges" part seriously. If you just want to drop that then go with what Del suggested. More like a shrunken Sudbury.
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The technical challenge is important, my interest here is what the Forum opinion is on what makes a good all-round bow with a low draw weight and a short draw-length - the vast majority of bows I see are optimised for over 26" draw length and above 40# draw weight, these designs may or may not be the best suited to my specs, I'd like to know what you all think :D
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A bow more designed along flight lines then.
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The technical challenge is important, my interest here is what the Forum opinion is on what makes a good all-round bow with a low draw weight and a short draw-length - the vast majority of bows I see are optimised for over 26" draw length and above 40# draw weight, these designs may or may not be the best suited to my specs, I'd like to know what you all think :D
Flight/3D work is a complete contradiction in terms.
I've tried shooting flight bows at 3D... hopeless, you want long & smooth for 3D and short sharp & punchy for flight.
Del
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Little version of Meare Heath with narrower tips?
Yup :)
But flight/3D is a contradiction
Del
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I'd err more on the side of 3d then
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The technical challenge is important, my interest here is what the Forum opinion is on what makes a good all-round bow with a low draw weight and a short draw-length - the vast majority of bows I see are optimised for over 26" draw length and above 40# draw weight, these designs may or may not be the best suited to my specs, I'd like to know what you all think :D
Flight/3D work is a complete contradiction in terms.
I've tried shooting flight bows at 3D... hopeless, you want long & smooth for 3D and short sharp & punchy for flight.
Del
Not when you have a 24" draw though. The Martin style of bow was the end product of years of experimenting on living 3D targets and it's a dead ringer in every way for the old flight bows that shot 500 yards.
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The Martin bow in laubin's book is a neat bow ,it always caught my interest , I have a pristine 57 in. osage stave slotted for it been aging a couple years inside when I get around to it ,I think Laubin drew 24-25 in bet that little bow would be fast all though you see few made !
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23" actually. There was an article on Nelson Hoffman (Bob's protégé and friend) on this style of bow about 20 years ago in PA.
It was very interesting that they settled on those dimensions despite not naturally having that short a draw.
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If I remember right in his book he had a short range of lengths he made ,I was going to try 57" & try to get it out a little farther now you got wanting to reread the book with the shorter statics kind of defies most thinking on leaver type bows, but it's a interesting bow !
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Why do the short statics defy thinking? You mean because of the length of the bow or just the tip length?
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I ve been studying that book,, he doesnt like deflex either,, as you can see he has induced reflex in the handle, that seems to not be popular so much now,, but I like it,, and think the bow probably shoots as well as most well designed bows,, I have not made one,,
He mentions quite a few times that the Sioux liked shorter bows, shooting 23 inch arrows,, it takes skill to shoot a shorter bow and arrow,, but there must have been advantages for them to settle on those specs,,,,
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Just the shorter tip length of 6 in" is different but then again it's non working any how,but I like how he pin knocks the bow using all the limb, I did that on my last osage bow , but my guess is if you built his bow at his specs for a short draw it has to be a fast bow I would think !
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I will add,, that the shorter bow may not have been an issue,,and there ability as archers was not effected, or skill level was such that they were effecient with the shorter bow,, some feel is not accurate or more difficult to master,, I have always wondered about this,,,
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I suppose if that the only bow you had was a short draw bow and you shot it a lot you would get good with it , I'm lucky if I get a day a week to practice and I can barley keep up with my 64" hunting bow but it would be fun building that Martin bow I think those short draw short limb bows probably have a lot going for them efficiently ,high return speed & low mass !
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Just the shorter tip length of 6 in" is different but then again it's non working any how,but I like how he pin knocks the bow using all the limb, I did that on my last osage bow , but my guess is if you built his bow at his specs for a short draw it has to be a fast bow I would think !
Different from what? Many static tipped bows had short static sections.
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Just meant different from a longer leaver type bow Pat !
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I would build the bow at least 62" long, take advanatage of a bow not taking set or stacking, I was testing a 28" draw bow at 24" draw yesterday and was surprised that I was getting 165 fps with 10 grains per pound. It would have been faster had it not been tillered out to 28"
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Does someone have a description of or link to a Martin type bow? It would be nice to know what you're talking about. :)
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h ttps://books.google.ca/books?id=xMF4OqmebHEC&pg=PA45&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q&f=false
fix the gap in the link and scroll down the pages.
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Steve,,,
In What style,are your specs,in reference to?
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h ttps://books.google.ca/books?id=xMF4OqmebHEC&pg=PA45&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q&f=false
fix the gap in the link and scroll down the pages.
That just got me to google Books homepage
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It works for me. How about just locating the book on there and going from there?
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Don the book is called American Indian Archery there is no Ebook only soft cover you can get it the big A or B&N ! Its a interesting read !
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DC, mine originally said I couldn't view it either, but then I scrolled down the pages and it loaded.
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All the necessary pages are on there.
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Drawing on page 60? Recurve with a set back handle?
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Yes. Or just straight if not from billets.
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If you look on alibris dot com, you can find some very cheap copies of the Laubin book.