Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Flintknapping => ABO => Topic started by: Spotted Dog on November 10, 2015, 11:41:46 am
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I can't seem to get thinning process dow(http://i854.photobucket.com/albums/ab104/ofiebakoa/DSC01956_zpswmehxw6n.jpg) (http://s854.photobucket.com/user/ofiebakoa/media/DSC01956_zpswmehxw6n.jpg.html)n. I abrade , set up platforms . Still get short flakes
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Bevel your edge so that it is more to one side than in the center. Then abrade and push the flaking force nearly parallel to the plane of the point, removing flakes from the side nearest the bevel.
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Bevel your edge so that it is more to one side than in the center. Then abrade and push the flaking force nearly parallel to the plane of the point, removing flakes from the side nearest the bevel.
Good input
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May be the angle if you are abrading and setting up platforms correctly. The more 90 degree to the edge the shorter the flakes..not saying that's is it, just maybe.
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are you using a dull antler tine?
i believe dull is ok if the diameter of the tine is relatively small, but if you have a medium-sized tine, it may have to be dressed a little to help drive the flakes further.
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I may have to quit for a while. Doing this is really causing problems with the disability I have.
Lots of pain last night. I hate this stuff. Can't work any more. Can't hardly do a bow either.
Feels like my neck slips up against spinal cord.
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listen to your body.
rest up.
and when you're ready to get back to it. there are some knapping jigs out there that might give you the freedom to knap.
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NzY4WDEwMjQ=/$(KGrHqJ,!ioE6I1Wf!JEBOtvUq0y2!~~60_35.JPG)
they use a leverage system to generate the needed energy. it's like using a cheater pipe.
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Hey thank you.
That just might be the ticket. I love primitive things and do not want to give up on learning.
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don't forget the indirect percussion methods either.
go watch a few of patrick's (JackCrafty) videos on youtube.
it may not be for you, but it is an avenue that you might want to test.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9ogJ9AZPW4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9ogJ9AZPW4)
front view:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=capGa8Mr-mU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=capGa8Mr-mU)
good luck!
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Brother,
thank you for the help. I am grateful. I need to be able to stand or sit straight without
dropping my head too much. That and raised backward creates mega pain.
It seems the jigs are for sawn preforms. I am not against that at all. Just
want to learn and use what I make. I may have to go back to copper but
will still strive for abo. Nonetheless I would be knapping.
Grateful Dog
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some advice that I heard and seemed to help me out was to use the thin end of your stone as the back of the point. So when you're narrowing down the tip (thick end) it will thin out at the same time. Good Luck and have fun. Ed
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Beginning to understand more. I have been holding my piece to tight and not allowing the
flake to run farther. The videos JackCrafty are a very big help to see what I am doing wrong.
That in itself will help relieve the amount of pressure I have been doing. That part really hurts.
Do not work harder , work smarter.
If there is someone close to the Kansas City Northland that would be cool too.
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Do not work harder , work smarter.
^^ yep.
i too want to learn his technique. his videos are extremely informative. i suggest watching as many of those as you can. i like his glass point videos too.
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I was out in the garage and remembered a long straight antler tine. Indirect work. :laugh:
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^^ you'd laugh if you could see what tools i'm practicing my indirect work with.
i'm getting the hang of it. man do you get some good results and you can easily clean up those problem areas.
needless to say, it's still dangerous. i completely missed today and came down on my thumb nail with my striker, hah hah.
if you haven't already done so, check out these videos:
part 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzjsg1gXLC8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzjsg1gXLC8)
part 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVPQtavdsNQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVPQtavdsNQ)
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I understand the hitting . My stud driving hammer is a 4 pounder. Glance off and hit your hand
with that. Yellow stuff on the floor :P
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^^ hah hah.
it doesn't look like much, but it was enough to keep my thumb from working for a few minutes.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/cnvOp7WWExs3ESPlAmDSVwJW-7_cW-QovZnhsvy8Ybvx09xSJnML9LjcPk2RBOkn_PowQuoS4pQ6g13yfrckf64LeGFk6HQgnVTInzg8Bd1mQL1A2IKZw4tfmngb8JXl4qn-rXCmYquoR1l7q4jYsGRetRDaMHMFxwdpkXQYeJ_pq45o4d0w0pYP9bSZPMalqizoCePglIQOFyXYOVXN7LFJxBwYlFqIvWjgKxEL-0BrTsmlQLdpxXl17DULfjLgw1RLVWp2iCTqz0ztY0X_3Mz5q39KN9y4m9wexh-x1HJonVPf7mz08c8EpuBCTqOVWawEsBw1ah2Vhq2-RWBX125bpMiUtU2RYWpYrt4ObvqJhb1DE18ONf2kgDoo5Sz8Oe66kt76gW1vw02550Nm-Fe2cG0ylPrDkhusD10oqUFAaAOx2ZenI-9O8h3Upn9vgVONqY21DTPshcw480Eq5TkfDHlp9VxLavexVHSFBnKq1CPqPCYpqPHHdhTQBgn3jbjOw25sgRArq1ODqDbugH86gkkb5PxN6JckR339YMw=w457-h811-no)
i considered it an alarm to tell me when to put my toys down and head to the office.
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i just found a way to thin using indirect percussion.
i place the tine on a block of wood, the tip over-hangs the block of wood. then i place my foot on top of the base end of it.
i then strike the tine with another piece of flat antler.
it gives a strong impact without allowing the tip of the tine to travel downward very far before returning to the starting position.
i've been playing with this for about four days and can now take a thick wedge of rock and really thin it down. not super thin, but at least something that can be worked into a point. kind of exciting to be able to thin like this.
i'll photograph this setup and post it back here.
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here are the photos:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Mrh9xUFfoFxd4wUdFC7eomYgZYxjNRSuaBo8KcqTst4QUCGkX7HilgZeksEwfG9Jk14j9jotbpiKeYBWYCPaA4r4c33gD7JW9hEZIoTLl2c-xr5JUjkEC7X80ZzxNM2O7hE_TeJhPVc8gIbXiACG5A_yFqjtuMHoxMaiOWZdyi18xlf2n3iPcEdIroCD2gFRCnBQaa6CQ7DT8vpfKp7MdWJLoL6NdwG-JugdT75H-EcjCLsAkxw1zNP6HIIp-F9ZeqNHaYOADymT4K3bUIaGvOcaV6W7Is7szTRKBtev58dUf_Y_yOyrvzbuniFNtdBMEZh5P0oLBXyURR77hWHn6Znkop7mzLpDyzqhaTUMyk13FeyOXgKYP0zqj9wMMLHyMIfQ_DRqiSIf6N4OI92F2f1ws7Qt1O796Um7bHtH5UPSCjZakCSfy-siGobik0J5MAepJjgOuz9xDo13vn03Y14VR6PQui8EB9omPq2-I_8Yd-AAQox1K9LTgbRPmAm5E1lQtir--035EOa3UveOzsa97071sXrjjhzYtMe7xj0=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2PXYyqtW8MXIjiFn7Pa8vt9EUQXzj7jbJ-I81Z9E6F2SS9pae_QKBRYMLlItG17bUirclL4NecQaUrpjprXMFkbY-VzqRMtUTNRmc-CC5snIsj3Y9G1A7aY1ZvHdpH9uYnEy11mHW9wMXKdobPOAdOzwrpLlHi35H9_7rCkqZyCNpmhLEgnzkQ7JbJBrTXTGvVyXZUtQOG6uYEdzCj-5sltclrUkHQH_t29Ga5uDuDeNVd8ecoyiPdDBx4xsEwGDDFyVy3sqgd6C8rYDHviV-LYK7eA3P78ecncZ-bXheuhGKlnGQRF5W1_9LsooSojf2QvPiuYaCRMJFIOWwvlZT3UWw9q3NOyEVVcS6Mej69y8BO4QCh8EGkbCLCZAQ4MnFCfi3Dm0yLBwiOEHJBCu2qJ3ZX9UeqqucwlQCmHo6i1OVxs36y1seOp4dMDlY4EUmGz6ovIdQE0FyTPmkjRaHy2xmhE8rj3_FBCRRizZakBDte4qo52TuhEtgE4jBOW8nS-m1CnctYIfTRJSxTf5_2l10GweSoPnbHaq3sXYEC0=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Xa8crPHfJsmziEWekZ2wLn0VrMqh8LDSnbs1n4DNYTdpKhk2otlyJpNEaiLatc4wpuEtI73mY-Ls7wi-VFA6eVEfwppOmciFa9Qs6zAxaCJ-LoJXqTSvkNod0caIiPoPEN_G7zf6j5V5O_IFgz5zz9q-nAcKnqE0OIr3Dw4k7CaMcy67hPmLXZjTXUeYi0GYEE3nSGa9QB6GyWpnVMF0DVjjo5IP32ZT_6XVKiPK3qJdp0RGMP3vbrbB7PKRT8CanfMXqyzlUrb647uunjFrariPEmauvDd6GStG0O2RJMWdvkY0Z9tNtXgwPFxspSELuas31R3VmBa2A4jSCoVkPH4Qq2ZAISrNhgA-byxojubNwmAP1AyWNZhElKmsdwuTp37zujXOANbkSjejGzR43Kbrh5yph35zgB-10wppTkskIaWCbpOMrhgagpz25muyfntfWRHrS45Y8V960wxca2NHHRbxSHOIWywWLLrbHXp98mrgqnFRO-cEi4_8fZgsB5VXngY38HW8r0sWn1bNUU-yGXYvKKLBamT9enHRwM=w458-h813-no)
there was a massive bulb on this flake, i.e., a rock i would never attempt to work:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/XUkxUyLNmMxgdKxOG4luTZYqca2zXrMCQUZCOKpi9b1_JG3ViAG-eCA2OQ9gBxZYmfPcquhsOQDJkwMuvHH6euvZlxBZW35grUkdTkYUtD2Ddgg0ZBne1tlqIch0ZQVFRWrCPTCdfZQeIeRYPjmSSf_U7j2OSgHzy3b-BHLmeLp-D5TFeekMBH8jSO5w9nH5zXRibm2R9gO_bpAQC6bqwV5BsMaZF9ya5bgbFZ0lgxp4Ldib68NPqdVIrZd946X0qZJNF6hUmRpDMnwjMiHA7Krc3RklXzGbRAQma-T2v4fAxrjVjiAHRlTsXoM0URCRvJwMzybgBq3s9C-xA8Z7R1pCrM2hMB0xt1p1wG_JwGWYgEv_xBo8KUJ_QgKW2dahpAq4na2mgK_1CKwZoQjgCM8xZ8aneKKB7PKZD73-1rfnJSYnQNZxgz__RKeiAMy9Psdf7pp7jcsZHhch62MchqL94HMTu61HNRvFA--FocVzriUbY8BnsB52aBGHNG2FkcOzoBpBoKXtAMgbh6djQ2ldUmQMAHGPKDycH34uJpo=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/civqfeSsc7RKk4AVFo_hRY10vXLMWPHFV_fG1Cjgar2nNZM6lw99Kgsb1BPkWFo1PVt7fxmCiCNSIME_Uq9aFdE4_iNibT-k9rAnewGSrA_rsuco0in5lSEHVGFq_Mwukdg7RDHlpZRTZoWyTwKgFSnbm34jpDw2NPgb7ZKpVWvI95ZLQXBPqaDwiatq7_S2o8RrYA1HCwXmB7a2mDPBBVUtw6ioJg2zp9cpaLlQG6Hl2QJ32kpr57eiuyvPPKv_-8YGapzYkOn6kiIJtLWV_07u5vzO8sZhzfvD11rrLNOu8vJX7_kIjXQPJByHLPrdTIOitQI3hSVd25X0NoC2Hx67DEhqcVVaMXBBB51GRTrlO6sMqlU5vSrv4QmZ86xwfEH5aXSJHFJfs8uyzUB49yNto18zlT5G7t2Bb9CvN3_rY1AMTOXNxyFS-jrtHVqT9ezhgLfvwfw7RQeQjA4UDTLAETCLpzLf5w9XQKdTMQjOnpNFBHLlylLablr0sdE-EJKLiLc5PpYyYddYf2oX45Gklt5uZFi4rst2qnxahOQ=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/DepasJUPQ18pu7LQERRR8oY8B64Eyo95mY13N_YIZ9Xr9NoqCYKwJq2NAkpJtwC7E-X96_UBsERJ23JmqJswfS4yMDRIUtskJ9do58lHEbxpCP0t5Pd43f01QPe8PwzJirT-p3G3I3CFxDlTC2iiY8easTNvGJyjvZE795biCAljAXXHbZTfhF_4uaozj-jEdTomkbt77H4xtIcCa4ExrO0LkLKcAvdo7JE8YvGfU-a1fE94RThP1mp1g0Czuf7eksHDBLW7V60Ss2Ew7DBZVawN2Y_I1zbH1bf7wVK1x8zdC9oPXAAovrm0wbH7wz3jZtKykApMf56AKeikr38Y4CntZBb2JBksSF_YVvuWeJYOKCxAZbME-WR0ukRQn7aXVq-rEyOLGyuq8vZHnDfufBlbdcrRu3Up0g7TtYQPARQ7DhPtuP4V8eNu1I1SraxnXPBaD9puBRztq-6QmCiDopy6TIArsa5bballXU6qBcPdfYEX3p5pD7k-cr_txNpLQ7UuM3YP9-_F4V9xffGNfWcSbE6A4-yZr2NJ0rN8Jk8=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/YZCITz1iqDeZz3i39-a5KURIKPEg7e6H2CNeRcGhRwddYVt5Qze2DVuRll1V96Wkjj2VLJQDqQAn6TOtR8qNb3US3CG4U7bKLBV28No5XiRswkMRxBCTONmRdY02ZYv3-CPUHhSKAuRPjXTOdp-Iac0GL92lFLPex53sgpzP6mvb7-44Ds_0-pgS-IboOO7o6ZRrYk09k_JfEP4XFWpQCcaZYBbumGCdBJkiwPaE86nxSh6nEwprG9fk5K7dvWARYRRsfE8syLtWI7dWJCC3d4EnPNf9qgrLSSIjsN3HzFW34_OGqJ63vsprEQIcLCGXKpHuTwjyZZRyGmlw_F95cDj5u2ZquKR7vJj5i1JxpIwEq3ubGygS42sFI5oSsYosK7P-qLzyiRSXNr8l7YYgyxMkjvs5wjGEcRjwJERivRjRCDw31pd92RHoZ-RSz3YZWsUUrBzhsjaIC5nWJztVVDYpdQNFi7JfMageQPX1AP7KuJPtZV0LsIdE4WcKvb_noI7w7LISUrlOgsslim083OqyB3SCeXYEpjL8XZ1E-SY=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/S0nQegYuGUDieFQCxRW5hqXephX9C9zB_e9seYo-9EElurCLRu8TYBSFb7IZ3MQjPTPO042JpoBPO2Kq9BzuF6xls9AjmCKufBHCsVvDtGeZIY2xdaTmnS_BL45ETbnLqiLcyM7_5WSAfBcCfEXfsr43FBRP9drvXKO1oowcC1dNrb9JaXGoMp6faUIW7ILwrS8boaDgAJ7xfUbl-sDfW-yzGhZBlJZK7DYslHfBOzPaEKoeyeY6Bu6qJqvnpOv3SQ8tlmbl3-p7dnN-2atssRXKUEj3GuIwnrq4Ux8o7feaNubTPguhvNzLjlegqjfCTvDr3OtbVURQPSTpTc7HEz5dvblzbmOWgu0aGeOvYWssyvSDQso6QjCxruMhBewZyXkwP4-fi2qWrqGmZKxtl2bRndpflKj2csUVNFBjKjyRxNatyADz03QVdo7OBbmP2UsXRRX3fsUVNlg89N0Z5SV5lwdKtp7bzVuChtwWNszvuZ4i4p__DSIvnOoe8rsb7ZcHqlIbVwzHPC3skZxrHXFdHpy2mvFbdh40QsNLcfg=w458-h813-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/irEQ2fe6P4xjvb8w47x_xy26zf5I2cJKmmQc0vo8dwpONtpqUSgT9-84F9pxsURj932SL9ylYEQhoemZOhkX2cISD-Tu7yWZ0xjUKRneo4dmYuCPUFUWRiz8ioskYGYlQYmacG_taSiUhFE88GjLF5ayctkMjNxfG1qm8WsO_yzM7gd01j_WdQYmzgtj3uPLt525w43DRyaTx2UV19A8g_AxFUXDu2_pZ6_V7AqC09I-qVCurphI9MHyvpym9gHO7ndRMRqPPaMHryOI_sQ0lfKxDxRyLON3ZDT1lNP2bRXIXxfqH5rmJzX-3l8iv4IDOYND1O23iWlKOClNkr8jfIUKmhBHkeG_eJ0NrQWL1b29ihNMSCY5BeHfZjBBZtHTiwRAKnQAzfF5ggk3mquDwQuB8iisGlVSc9j7ktrn7KLlCGPyYilyZb_53cZlucD-oeK7rHEsYsOVftDZDfD2ZRZBn84SJ3J1gGDymOhD-1mHXa3j2XY6nRJc_BGWYEXuGTsRQtSFn1I7AibQwzFFnIVisudG31VfCsYbiq9EI7E=w458-h813-no)
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Hey now that looks like it's working for you!
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yep 8)
i'm able to make nice thinning flakes and i can actually aim them in the direction where i want them to go.
a large percentage is platform setup plus underneath flake support. the antler on antler energy is very fast but very predictable. i'm guessing that the end of the tine moves less than 1/8" downward. for most of the flaking, i actually have my finger in direct contact with the tine when flaking. and even though i'm swinging the striker with a lot of force, the tine barely taps my finger tip because of the restrained movement. i did make the mistake of letting my pinky fingernail touch the tine, that really hurt because it sent a shock through my nail bed.
i still need a lot more practice with this.
also, i'm going to get me another tine to setup for notching.
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Nice! Necessity is the mother of all 'invention', glad you are keeping at it. This looks similar to a rocker punch technique, you may look at 'nclonghunter's thread and watch Mike Dothager's videos for more ideas.
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i looked up mike's videos. very cool, i think i could pull that off.
will look up nclonghunter's later on at the house.
once i get a few pieces in, i'll shoot a video of what i'm doing.
edit: i couldn't wait. i saw and remembered his technique again now. looks like it would work great too. i would have to think it would only increase the knapping bruising on my legs though.
edit 2: i was directed to the 'anter base' technique earlier this morning. it is similar to what i'm doing and i will try it one day ;)