Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: DC on June 23, 2017, 03:15:19 pm
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I've been cultivating some Hazel suckers for a few years. One is oval cross section 2"x 1 3/4" where the handle will be. Is that big enough? How does Hazel do with a high crown? I'll cut it i the fall if it's deemed big enough.
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You would get a bow from that, it is wide enough, but I'd be inclined to leave it grow a while longer; hazel crysals fairly readily, so, wide, flat or rectangular cross sections work well, although hollow-limb design is an excellent option for high-crown hazel
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Old Del and the UK members could help you out here.
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Old Del and the UK members could help you out here.
I spent a productive hour this morning cruising though Del's blog.
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A high crown is perfect for hazel. Hazel chrysals because the belly is working too hard compared to the back. I've only had one chrysal with Hazel and that was where a pesky pin ran across the belly. Hazel is way strong in tension but somewhat lacking in compression strength - I either trap the backs heavily or seek out high crowned staves. Heat treating turns it into something quite special :)
I really rate hazel, tends to grow very straight, very few knots, lowish density but very elastic and a good heat treating brings the bellys resistance to compression right up.
Your stave sounds perfect.
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Thanks for explaining that Mike, I've made a few bows from hazel, and never a crysal but I thought that was 'cos I was a good boy and did as I was told and went with wide designs, although they all had high crowns and were built from staves 3 or 4" diameter at the base. I might try a narrower design next time as I love sapling bows. Hazel is a great bow wood, and like Mike said, heat treating has spectacular results. I tend to slightly hollow the limb instead of trapping but it has much the same effect
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what kind of hazel is it? how old do you think the shoots are?
I am always curious if I could plant trees that will yield bow wood in short order.
G
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Here are two with small diameter:
http://primitive-bows.com/tag/hazel/
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Hazel is one of my favourite woods for very heavy bows. I make them over 130lb and it holds up beautifully. The smaller diameter the better as Mike said - it just saves you having to trap the back. You can push a 2" diameter sapling up to 160lb if so desired, so it will take anything you throw at it.
Definitely heat treat, and if possible malm it (heat treating over a period of a couple days while also impregnating the belly with a pine resin and turpentine mixture) as you'll gain another 30lb or so without making it any bigger.
It's a wonderful bow wood!
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George- I wish I knew. The Bluejays planted the tree in our yard with nuts they got from a house up the street. The people that planted that one are long gone. The Jays plant about a 100 of them a year in our yard. These are suckers that I was planning on making arrows from. I got sidetracked but I kept pulling off any shoots from the bottom 8" or so. They are pipe straight and knot free. As long as the aren't twisted I'm golden
Simon- Yeah, I want to make bows just like that :D, In my dreams ;D
Will- Do you mean heat treat them multiple times. I doubt I'll have to do that because I can't pull over 45# but it's interesting to know. If it's stronger I could reduce the mass and get more speed.
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Yeah, you heat treat it once properly, then do it again in 4" sections, rubbing in the pine resin mix while hot, all the way down the bow. Then you leave it a full day, and repeat about 3 times. Each time you do it, you're forcing pine resin into the wood, and when it cools it goes rock hard, adding loads of strength to the belly.
A guy in Norway came up with it after seeing it done on skateboards apparently, and he used it to take a 160lb elm bow up to 210lb.
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Yeah, you heat treat it once properly, then do it again in 4" sections, rubbing in the pine resin mix while hot, all the way down the bow. Then you leave it a full day, and repeat about 3 times. Each time you do it, you're forcing pine resin into the wood, and when it cools it goes rock hard, adding loads of strength to the belly.
A guy in Norway came up with it after seeing it done on skateboards apparently, and he used it to take a 160lb elm bow up to 210lb.
That's really useful info; never heard of that, thanks Wills 😀 definitely going to try it.
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I spent a productive hour this morning cruising though Del's blog.
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I have spent many a productive hour cruising through Del's blog it is worth the time
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At the risk of seeming to hijack the thread a little, what's hazel like for shorter bows, say 60" ntn?
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Really good! It makes a lovely flat shorty, especially if you flip the tips a little. There's not much it can't do, to be honest. Provided (as with all woods) you design the bow around it's specific properties it'll be good to you. Again, as said by Mike - great in tension, average in compression. Bear that in mind and you won't go wrong.
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Feb. Got a beautiful short hazel stave I've been keeping for something special 😁
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I love hazel! Can handle a lot of different designs as long as you don't overpower the belly. With some narrow recurves, crazy heat treating and light arrows you can get pretty fast bows too!
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Just to let you know that "old" (In my head I'm still about 16) :o Del is here....
Del ;D
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Just to let you know that "old" (In my head I'm still about 16) :o Del is here....
Del ;D
That's funny. In my head I'm 25. Does that mean I'm more mature. 70 today. Anyway I cut one of the Hazel shoots this morning. 5 years old and 11 feet long. I'll try to split it this afternoon just to see if it's twisted or not. It's too slippery to hang on to right now.
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Happy birthday Don! That one on the left looks real nice! Cheers- Brendan
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Don't split them! They always twist.
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It actually has a bit of a bend but that's the way it wanted to stand.
Always twist? Do you saw every one and not concern yourself with the twist? I like to split at least a bit of the stave so I know how much twist there is.
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Yup, it was twisted. A lot. I stopped in time and sawed the rest of it. I'm having doubts about it making a bow. Do sawn, twisted hazel bows hold together?
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It's a bit of a juggling act. You need to accept that some of the twist will be in there, and try to lay out the bow so you're making the best of it. I've made them where I completely ignored any twist, and just drawn a dead straight line down the log and they worked fine, too.
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My normal approach is to use a hatchet to remove all the side wood, leaving me with a very thick stave which is at bow dimensions when viewed from the back. Then if there's enough wood to get two bows I'll do the splitting trick where you drill holes all the way along the line you want and split carefully between each hole. Or I'll saw the line, or half split half saw etc. Usually though, I just make one bow per log, and use the axe to remove everything I don't want.
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Thanks Will. I've read in a few spots that Hazel dries easily, no checking and such. Is that your experience. Stand it in a corner and forget it for ??? hop long?
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Happy birthday Don! At my rate I will be happy to put out in the next 25 years the quantity and quality of bows you have in the last 5! I wish you health and happiness and straight staves and straighter shots...
G
p.s. I bet you can make a shooter or two from that hazel
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I've read in a few spots that Hazel dries easily, no checking and such. Is that your experience.Stand it in a corner and forget it for ??? hop long?
I've debarked and placed outside in a shadowed but very hot place some hazel logs around 3 inchs diam, no sealing, with no cheching and fast dry.
Cannot be sure it is a rule.
I guess you have to try it