Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: Carson (CMB) on February 10, 2012, 02:07:02 pm
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I was going to make up about a half dozen of these, but so far, only one has made it to completion. Shaft is nootka rose shoot. Elk bone point (~135 gr.) Canada goose fletch (plains style). Cherry bark cresting wrap. Elk sinew for point, fletch, and nock reinforcement. Loctite holding the cherry bark on. Shellack finish (dark flakes). I haven't found the bow that it flies real good out of yet. It is a little weak in spine for my hunting weight bows, unless I had a really wide handle to shoot around.
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Very nice arrow. I love the cherry bark accents. I've used cherry bark for backing but not other things like this. Did you have to thin it? If so, how? I actually like everything about this arrow. 8)
Is the fletch 2 or 3 feathers? I can't tell from the pics. I've made a few 3 fletch like this and really like how well they work.
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now that there is one fine arrow.
love all the detail.
was out shooting two fletched arrows late last nite.
they fly just like they're supposed to!
understand only have one complete. spent hrs out by the fire straightening shafts
and grinding feathers wed.
after all that time only had one arrow complete
but most of the work done on the other 5....
i shoot 40-45# bows, maybe that arrow would work better outta one of mine.. ;D
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Thanks Pat.
The cherry bark was thinned using a cabinet scraper (I love cabinet scrapers). You can get the bark very thin, almost ribbon thin. It looks like cherry bark was also used as a handle wrap too, so I am definitely trying that on one of my paddle bows. Cherry bark wrap with beaver fur strips bordering top and bottom, now that would look good on your little yew paddle bow Pat 8)
Two feathers. I believe this is plains indian style fletch, but I could be wrong. I was originally going for an arrow that was authentic for the willamette valley kalapuyan indians, but I find this style of fletching so much easier than splitting feathers, and it is quite effective at putting some spin on an arrow.
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sadiejane, Thanks!
It probably would fly pretty good out of your bow ;)
I have about a dozen shafts straightened, but most were lighter in spine than this one, so I will just keep collecting, seasoning, debarking (cabinet scraper works great there too), straightening, and eventually I will have some matched dozens for the whole family.
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love those cabinet scrappers. dont have any but have used a pals. one of these days...
do you live in the willamette valley?
i have yet to find much out about the native peoples who lived there.
have a brother who lives outside newberg. grows pinto noir grapes and filbert trees.
could hang out on his place forever
once again great looking arrow!
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CBM, after looking at the examples of NW paddle bows in TBBI I thought cherry bark would be appropriate for a handle wrap too. I've got a little bark left. I'll see if I can make it work.
I love a cabinet scrapper too. I do most of my tillering with one. I usually use a pocket knife for scraping bark from shafts but its the same principle. ;)
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Beautiful arrow! If you are having trouble with it's flight, you might try turning the feathers over, so the dull side is up.
The Cherokee style two fletch is like that, but it flies great with the feathers bottom side out.
Well done!
Wayne
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Wayne, that is the way Steve Parker tought me.
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Hey Sadie just curious, what do you tiller with? I have only used a 4n1 but got a set of scrapers last week.
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Thanks Wayne. I will have to try with the underside of the feather facing out on the next one. Wayne, so the cherokee style two fletch is how I have done it?
Sadiejane, the history of the northwest Indians is pretty poorly documented. In western oregon most tribes had been decimated by disease, prior to the arrival of settlers. The kalapuyans were known for their semi-agricultural way of life. They modified the habitat using controlled burning to increase production of camas (a bulb food) and tarweed (a seed food), and to increase habitat for game.
I am reading a really cool book called oregon archeology that has some good info in it and lost of pictures of points!
Newberg is a nice area. Lots of wine and filberts! Maybe I could live out at his place forever! If it has any problems with deer or varmants I could provide my services.
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CMB_thanks for the heads up on the book oregon archaeology. just read a review of the newest edition-sounds great. will pick it up when i can.
yeah, thats been my experience, finding out much of anything is difficult...except for artifacts left behind
theres a ton of history of the earliest pioneers but not the native folk
what little ii have found is written by those early pioneers and from a very skewed perspective(that of squatter/conqueror/manifest destiny)
now if bill would let me build a shanty on the back of his property i would so be there
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CBM, here are a few different fletching styles I use on primitive arrows...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/09huntingarrows002.jpg)
...and how I make the tangential 3 fletch(I think that is what it is called).
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/tangential3fletch004.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/tangential3fletch005.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/tangential3fletch006.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/primitive%20archer/tangential3fletch007.jpg)
this series of pics is just a teaching aid and not on an arrow.
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Pat B, Nice diversity of fletch styles there. I am going to have to try that three fletch you just showed, I like how the faethers lean on eachother, looks pretty solid.
I want to do some fletching with split feathers too, as it appears that is how the natives here in oregon did it. I have split and ground turkey fethers for traditional arrows, but i want a more authentic look for the replicas. How do you split yours? How did the indians split theirs? I have tried my hand at hand-splitting enough to decide I don't want to waste any more feathers. What is the trick?
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I've used an Exacto knife or box cutted type knife and split the quill(sharp obsidian chip) down the center then ground the quill thin and flat. On the tangential 3fletch I just tapered thebasr of the quill so it laid flat and reduced the size for wrapping.
You can also strip the feathers from thr quill. This way you have a very thin membrane for the feather base. Lots of folks do this. Stripping works best on fresh feathers but you can hydrate dry feathers first then they strip just like new ones.
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Ok, Maybe I just need to hydrate my old dry feathers. Thanks Pat!
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You can seal them up in a plastic bag with a damp(not wet) paper towel in it and give them a few hours to rehydrate. Do a test run and hydrate more if necessary.
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Pat, I got the idea for the Cherokee two fletch from one of your postings. I had Mullet (Eddie) help me with it. I made two arrows for the boss of Friend of mine. The Boss had under gone prostate surgery, and my Friend told me that he was into arrow heads, and stone tools, and such, as he had found quite a few artifacts in the strawberry fields, so I made a traditional cane arrow with three fletch,and one primitive cane arrow with the two fletch style. I had Eddie help with it, as I was not sure about the little tab on the end of the feather. He helped me put some pitch glue, and some sinew on it. Both had stone points, and Eddie was really nice, and donated a point he made from Washington agate or something like that, and an original point, either a Noonan or a Hillsborough, but the stem was broken, and he gave some other neat stuff that he had gotten out of the river, also. The Friend of mine showed some stuff he had, and he some heat treated chert, and told me of some really neat finds, and that one guy had found a "Perfect condition Hillsborough"! Well he sold that for quite a substantial amount! As I would have! ;) But anywho that is where I got the info on the two fletch. I know Eddie really likes them. I am going to make some with target points, and see if they really do fly like darts! ;)
Wayne
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CMB-
are you familiar with this book?
Naked Against the Rain: The People of the Lower Columbia River 1770-1830 by Rick Rubin
saw it at powells on hawthorne.
really wanted to grab it up.
its a huge thick book and seemed to be well done from the few minutes i sat down and looked thru it.
just didnt have the cash to take it home that day.
if you are familiar please let me know if you think it is worth my time
(can be found on amazon for less money than powells)
thanks
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That is one beautiful arrow! Well done! :) :) :)
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thanks for that tip Pat,
didn't know about rehydrating older feathers, to get them to split. do you just soak them for a day or so?
i'll try it on some older turkey feathers.
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thanks for that tip Pat,
didn't know about rehydrating older feathers, to get them to split. do you just soak them for a day or so?
i'll try it on some older turkey feathers.
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looks like i'm repeating myself...looks like i'm repeating myself...
ok!
just got the info about putting dry feathers in a sealed bag with something damp.
we also strip feathers for making our traditional headdress. (((we have a lot of dry feathers)))
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sadiejane, sorry, but I am not familiar with that book. I just started researching local native american history/archeology. That looks like it is worth reading, maybe purchasing. I don't have much time to make runs to the library, but just discovered that they will ship a book to my door for $2.00. It is pretty nice.
Thanks for the compliment Will.
Richard, do you split a lot of feathers? I am trying to get my hands on a couple hundred feather "shafts" (rachis, or rachi)
(http://askabiologist.asu.edu/sites/default/files/feather_anatomy.jpg)
If anybody else wouldn't mind saving these for me after pulling feathers off the shaft, please PM me. I would be looking for those shafts that are pretty much left in tact and not to damaged from pulling the feather off.
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there are times we strip alot of feathers,
but there usually isn't much left of them to save...usually one side strips better than the other.
to strip them? grab a feather at the very end tip with both hands and start right at the top and pull it straight down the shaft.
one side will peel first.
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This was a is very beautiful arrow. I am curious, how long did it take from start to complete?
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Very cool arrow, love everything about it. definately one to be proud of.
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came across another book that i thought some of you might be interested in.
i have not read it yet-but got it one the way from a friend
"cedar:tree of life to the northwest coast indians". by hilary stewart
came with high recommendation from someone i really respect.
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I tried the rehyrdating them old feathers and wow! What a difference. They zip right off now. Nice and uniform. I just placed a couple dozen feathers in a long plastic zip loc. (fish fillets from grocery store) and placed a damp paper towel in with them and then placed the bag in a warm car for an afternoon. Let them air out for a day or two in the garage, and when i got to them. I was excited with the results. Now i need to get to prcoessing some of these feathers I got stashed.
Dictionary, thanks for the compliment. I would say the arrow did not take more than an afternoon to make, excluding the shafting. Hard to say how long the shaft takes. After seasoning a bit I skin them, then season some more, then scrape the nodes/buds down and clean them up, then straighten with heat, let sit for a couple weeks, then straighten again, if needed. then i cut notches in the ends for nock and point. Once that is done, the rest is not too much work. Cut and shape the point, thin the cherry bark, wrap the feathers, mount the point, sinew, sinew, and glue on cherry bark. Finish with shellac once sinew is dry.
Sadie, I have not heard of that book. I must check it out. I have been wanting to learn various uses of cedar bark, and how to use it. Thanks!
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Wow! Absolutely incredible arrow! Great photography too.
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That is really beautiful man! I saw about 5 things on that arrow that I thought, "man I gotta try that". ;) As for the bone points; what bone do you use? Do you have any good references on that? Not to sound to girly but that is a mighty pretty arrow. Well done mate! ;) :laugh:
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Thanks for the compliments guys. PAhunter, the bone point is elk bone. But you could just as easily make one from cow, or any sizable beast really. Specifically it is from one of the leg bones. I cut elk leg bones up on the band saw, following general contours of the bone. Cutting along ridges and maximizing the size of pieces from the "flat" areas on the bone. I dig through my pile of pieces with a point shape in mind, and when a piece fits the bill, I shape it further on the band saw, carefully. Then, I used an angle grinder to taper the edges of the point blades. A belt or disc sander might be a better choice here, but I don't have one yet. I then used a cabinet scraper to finish the blade shape and smooth the lines out. The scraper also allowed me to put a pretty good edge on it. I am sure there are better ways to go about making a bone point. I get to wondering how the natives did it. ??? I plan on making a lot more soon. Hopefully, I will improve and refine the process.
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CMB-peeled some cherry bark this morning and wanted to ask you(and any other on the list who have worked with cherry bark) a few questions about using it.
never worked with cherry bark before
first i took off just the very outer layer which is paper thin.
it is redder on the inside tho i could see a light, very very light, sanding or scotch brite would bring out the red on the outside.
is that what you do or do you take the entire bark and work it down
was planning on using some for decoration on my trade bow.
you and pat b spoke of using cherry bark for handle wrap-would assume you would need more material that the outer paper thin layer??
what glue do you use?
was going to experiment with a few pieces of bark, some titebond II and a piece of osage to see how things go
but thought id ask a few ?s first
unfortunately the cherry i have to work with has a kazillion little branches and nothing very large around(1" or so) that i can access without harming the tree
my neighbor has numerous cherry trees on his property and he gave me pretty much free rein to try some things
headed back over right now
just sharpened up one of his pruners as a thank you for letting me gather stuff from his property
gonna see if there arent some suckers for arrows too
thanks!
another observation-the outer paper thin bark nearly falls from the rest of the bark. is this the wrong time of year?
or do you let the branches dry some before removing the bark?
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Sadie, I get my cherry bark off the trunk of trees 12" in diameter or more when I can. It yields longer pieces and these older trees tend to have less branches and knots on the trunk to contend with. With a pocketknife I cut a vertical line on the trunk that will be the butt end of the strips. The cut only needs to be 1/8" deep or less. I just pull off as wide a strip as I can, usually about 2" wide. These strips are about as thick as 2-4 oz leather. I take them down mainly on the backside with the scraper, then lightly cleanup the outer-side with the scraper. You can get it paper thin or leave it slightly thicker, depending on the use. Hope that helps.