Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: Sidewinder on February 09, 2008, 05:18:44 pm
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I intend to take a buffalo (Bison) in a couple weeks with my hickory stick 55#. It would be nice if it was with all natural materials trade points the exception. Does anyone have a dozen 45-50# made up they might want to trade for a nice osage stave. Draw length not more than 27". Also if its 55# bow at my draw length, which will be more stable 5 or 10# less on spine weight? I would have preferred to make them myself but no time or materials and the bison aquisition is coming faast upon me and too much to do otherwise in the mean time. I didn't post this on the trade post yet because I mainly wanted to get the answer on the 5-10# less question and I thought if there were any takers on the trade they may be located on the arrow forum. If an admini thinks this should be moved than by all means go ahead. Thanks in advance. Danny
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How long a shot you gonna take Danny? I got some of my trade points outa thick stock ,they weigh 260 -275 grains .
Ralph
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Are you shooting it in a pen? If not you might want to consider a little more bow for buff. At least do yourself a favor and get some super heavy arrows. At least 500 gr. They are big tough animals and you want to be as humane as possible. Not to mention a mad buff isn't something you want to mess with. They wont run away if you are close and they get poked. Justin
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Ralph and Justin, I have options on where I can take it. They have an area aprrox 2.7miles fenced they call their hunting pen they will release it in and I can stalk or have someone do a drive for ambush. I think thats the way to go. The shot....15-20yds I spect. I'm a little inexperienced in the arrow setup thing but I normally try and shoot 10-11 grams per # and with 125 head. I suppose if it were a heavier head it would need to be a stiffer arrow right?
I would not normally go for a penned hunt situation however in this case I'm getting the bsion regardless so I might as well make it as intersting as possible. Yeah I have thought about the mad buffalo so I'm gonna have a back up shooter along with a rifle in case she does decide to get even. I'm really doing this because the deal on the meat once its processed will still be under 2.00 a lb and with the price of beef its a no brainer. The fact that they will set you up in the hunting pasture/pen is just a bonus. I originally was thinking I would just try and rustle up a stock trailer and truck and go get her and then have the meat locker do the kill, but the more I thought about it the more I decided that I was missing an opportunity to have the experience of taking a buffalo with the stick and string so I decided as long as I have a good back up shooter to prevent any tragic stories of getting gorred and stomped by a North American Bison that it might be a much more enriching experience this way. In reference to a heavier bow, how much heavier? I only own one right now that I made myself a couple months ago a 55# 64" pyramid hickory that I clocked at 158.5fps at gander mtn. How much arrow speed would I need on a well placed shot? Any suggestions are welcome. Danny
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I don't want to rain on your picnic, but I figure a pen hunt is a pen hunt. If you want to kill it with your bow have them herd it into a 20' pen so you can get her while she is standing still. Shoot quartering away from you right behind the shoulder so it goes up into the chest farther. You will not penetrate the shoulder with that setup. The chances of you/me/anyone making a clean killing shot on a running buff are slim and none. If you gut shoot or hit the hind quarter you can ruin a lot of meat and cause her to suffer. Go small pen or have her hauled to the butcher alive. Just my oppinion, do what you want. Justin
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I wasn't going to say anything but can't hold my peace. What you plan on doing bears no relationship to hunting.
I think you should rethink this and just pay a butcher to take care of it. You still get the meat, hide, bones what have you.
Might as well shoot a cow in the barn.
Just my opinion.
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I won't comment other than to say that is NOT really hunting . I would not even consider a canned hunt of any sort myself. There is no sport in killing a caged animal.
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I have to agree with Dana ,ifn its in a pen,weather its 20 foot pen or a 2 mile pen,it is still a pen.Therfore its not really hunting imho.
Not that I would turn down the meat(bison is sooooo much better than that greasy a-- beef). so i guess to each his own,good luck and watch out for the angry cow.
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Ok ya'll, I read some of these posts and now I'VE gotta put my 2 cents in. Here goes.....
I know everyone says "if it's in a pen, it's not hunting." Well...have any of ya'll ever tried it??
Early this past fall, a lady asked me and my friend to try and shoot a deer that was in her 8-acre fence. The deer had been eating her flowers and she wanted the deer out of her property, whether it was dead or alive. She was trying to fence the deer out, but somehow this little yearling had gotten in. Now, only about 3 acres were wooded, the rest was pasture. I was armed with my primitive bow, my buddy had his Mathews compound. We chased that damn deer for over an hour. It ran circles around us and finally found a way outta the fence. Neither of us ever got a shot opportunity.
Here's my take: If it were me, and the buffalo is gonna end up dead anyway, I would probably try and shoot it with my primitive bow, just to see what it could do. Hell, he's using a PRIMITIVE BOW for christ's sake. Of course I wouldn't be reckless and take questionable shots, but when would any of us ever have the opportunity to take a buffalo?
Wild animals still have wild instincts and can run away, and as long as it's over 25 yards away it may as well be 25 miles away. If a patch of woods is surrounded by suburbia and you hunt deer in that patch of woods, then suburbia acts as a fence. If you hunt in a funnel where deer movement is concentrated, then the landscape can act as a fence. If you sit in a blind on a deer trail and pile up brush to force deer near your blind, then you are, in essence, building a fence to make the shot easier.
If you were to hunt in a 2 square mile fenced-in ranch, and you spook a deer, is it gonna run 2 miles, get cornered in the fence and wait for you to shoot it? HELL NO. It's gonna run in circles, circle back, cross its own trail, and confound you to the point that you're gonna look like a bumbling idiot. I don't care what anyone says, just because it's in a fenced in area, it is in no way like shooting fish in a barrel. Try it, then I'd like to hear you say "oh man...that was too easy." I'll bet you won't.
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I agree with Billy, in that it's still an animal , it's not tied up...I think it would also be interesting to see how well primitive equipment did on a Buffalo..........I figure a lot of people on here have hunted hogs and exotic animals on those game farms, no different,, a lot of people use feeders and food plots, those are about the same..............Plus the main thing is, all Danny asked was if anyone would trade him some arrows for a nice Osage stave and if anyone thought his equipment was sufficient to do the job, He didn't ask to be judged about his desire to achieve something he felt would be interesting to him , or if it was ethical.
wvflintknapper
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Your right wv its his call but when you post something on here you also have to expect people to give their opinion especially on something like this.
He also could have just posted asking about arrows for buffalo and left the details out. Show this buffalo some respect and just give it a quick death same as when ya butcher a cow, pig or chicken.
Billiy I don't think you can compare a 50lb yearling deer to a 2000lb buffalo also its apparent that the deer had a chance as it escaped ;D the buffalo is
gonna be dead at days end no matter what. As to him using primitive equipment, so what does that make it right?
Your comparing this to deer hunting, its a buffalo in the open ain't no where for it to hide. And if runs to the corner of the
fence two miles away just get in the truck and go stick a few more arrows in it. >:(
Danny no offense intended just my opinion.
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The circular reasoning used on some of these replies to Danny's post is just astounding ! Also, there is no reason to see if primitive equipment will kill a buffalo. The Indians DID it for hundreds of years ! That being said....... Danny, I hope you will reconsider this for a number of reasons one being I think youre setup is too light for the animal you are trying to harvest. I can see the reasoning about the meat. Take it or have it taken to a processor. I dont think you will be happy with the personal feeling at the end of this "hunt " if you do it, at least I for one hope you wont..................bob
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im with billy . id take the hunt. i wouldnt take backup shooter though. still want it to be a fair fight. i eat him or he stomps me.
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Danny my fellow Kansan
you may have kicked a can of bees with this one..lol. I know you didnt ask for opinions on how you are going to take the buff but you are going to get them anyway. I would assume most people who have taken a interest in primitive archery have learned a little about our native indian tribes and how much the buffalo meant to their daily lives and survival. This may sound dumb but with me its a respect issue i guess, but in the end, either way, you are going to have a dead buff and some meat in the freezer. When i was young the only place i could see buffalo was in a baseball field size pen on Fort Riley. now there is a buffalo farm not 16miles from my house where i can go and buy pre-packaged meat, and man its good eatin. How do they kill their animals, well, i have never asked. does that make me a hypocrite, maybe. If you are doing this just to see "what your bow can do" i would say please reconsider. if not, then you only have yourself to answer to.
Bishop
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Danny, I'm not gonna comment on the method, thats up to you...but I will say if you don't know that your bow WILL take the buffalo and you don't have arrows to practice with, you shouldn't try it this time! If this opportunity excites you, have your set up ready for the next time around. I would imagine this ranch, and others, have a similar situation every year of so to keep their herd in check. My $.02. Pat
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2 square miles is a big area. I hunt deer in a 1 square mile parcel of land, and they NEVER leave. It is unfenced, however, and they could if need be.
To each his own. If you feel the hunt is ethical, it's you that looks back from the mirror in the morning. Primitive bow vs Buff... sounds like even odds to me. It's not just gonna stand around.
Your bow? If it was me, I'd use something else. I have a 62" NTN, hickory backed osage, 70#@27", tillered bendy handle. I'd use heavy wood shafts, probably fir or ash, and a 2 blade broahead, probably a 190gn Grizzly. You want PENETRATION, not speed. At <20 yards, tragectory won't matter.
I think I'd take a clean pair of shorts, if you go without back-up!!
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I am with Jamie and Billy. A buffaloe hunt excites me a lot and since the chances and expense of a truly fair chase hunt lets me out, then I have no problem with ranch raised animals. There is an outfit here close to my home that puts some animals in a 320 acre fenced in patch of brush and thick forrest and, I undrestand it is challenging even for rifle hunters, as the bison never lose their wildness and act just like deer (leave in a hurry at the first sound, smell or sight of a hunter). Three hundred and twenty acres don't sound like much, but it is one mile by one half mile and can hide a bunch of buffaloe and they always have the option to leave. The only thing holding me back is the 1400 dollars. I also found a ranch in North Dakota that does hunts on fairly large tracts of fenced in native grasslands, would love to go. I would try to set up a blind at the water and get a good shot opportunity or try stalking, I bet there would still be tons of adrenalyn running and you cant argue with the good eating. You might want to read the article in the latest edition of traditional Bowhunter on arrow penetration and lethality and make sure you have arrows that are well tuned to your bow and that are going to perform and penetrate deeply, not some traded for arrows that might not work well in your marginal weight bow. Good luck, have fun, and let us know how it turns out. Kenneth
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If it was me, I'd use a stronger bow and heavier arrows. I don't think the gear you have will do the job. If I was going to hunt it, I couldn't bring myself to do it with a backup shooter. Kinda takes the Primitive out of it. Like ol' Tred hunting in every episode with a pistol on his hip.
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I hear ya Eddie, on the back up and pistol on hip. Oh by the way I finally got your feathers off yesterday. Sorry for being so slow. Kenneth
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I sold a bow to a guy a few years ago who killed a 600# cow buff with it on a penned type hunt. 55# bow shooting in the high 160's with 550 grain arrows, 1st shot was high and penetration was only a few inches with no damage to the animal, second shot was in the bread basket and got both lungs. A 55# primitive bow will not shoot through a rib so you have to hit the animal going away or just hope you hit inbetween the ribs. Steve
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Tatanka! are a very powerfull animal with a whole array of weaponry designed to defend itself against predators. Even a pinned up bison can inflict severe damage on you if the shot placement is not exact, and you will need heavy arrows to insure the best possible penetration with your lighter poundage bow. Although I do not hunt fenced hunts myself or condone them, I do believe the hunt should be a personal choice for each individual. I will not criticise your choice of game hunted or methods used. I do believe we as hunters specificaly bow hunters owe it to the animal to do everything you can to ensure a quick and humane kill with our primitive equipment and I wish you the best of luck in your adventure.. If you do decide to harvest a Buffalo please honor the spirit of the bufalo and the hunt by doing everything you can to ensure a desirable outcome for you as an archer, and the buffalo as a worthy prey I speak from my heart and wish you the best of luck ....Mike A/ho
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Thanks Kenneth, You'll never hear me complain about a gift.
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Thanks Steve for the report on the cow buffaloe and penetration. I think we as a whole expect more from our bows than they will consistantly deliver. What an arrow will do one time is not what it will do the next. I think the article on penetration in the traditional bowhunter should be required reading as many things have influences on penetration, and performance can be greatly improved on. Heavy arrows alone cant ensure bone breaking as that requires energy, and energy goes up much faster with speed than with weight. I think when we go after larger game than deer we should strive to shoot as heavy bows as we can shoot well and that means body conditioning and practice. Kenneth
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A more in depth read is on The website Tradgang. The same author did a good penetration study with different broadheads and bows on African big game. The results is why bow hunting is legal today in a lot of African countries.
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Bring backup! If using a pistol go for the heavy duty stuff like a .50. Best yet, lever action in at least .45-70. At twenty yards if you wound a Bison it can turn on you and turn you into jellied patie de human! These are not deer!!!!
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Bring backup! If using a pistol go for the heavy duty stuff like a .50. Best yet, lever action in at least .45-70. At twenty yards if you wound a Bison it can turn on you and turn you into jellied patie de human! These are not deer!!!!
Backup is a big freaking knife or better yet a spear. >:D Justin
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Hmmm! Justin I think you must have a death wish!!!! Remember Buff. big, you small, go SQUISH!!!! ;D
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You know that is why the Native Americans hunted the young, easier to kill and much less dangerous. Also better eating and nicer hides, the hide from an old bull was only good for making a war shield. Kenneth
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Yup! Plus, old bulls are like old men...grumpy and dang trigger happy!!! >:D
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a little off topic but in my much younger and much much dumber college days, at a rodeo, i tried to ride a Beefalo for 8 seconds to win 10 thousand cash...um, i didnt go home with the money and to top it off that sucker gave me a glancing stomp i will never forget.... ;D
Bishop
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Hey, Little John
I think you have speed/energy, etc., mixed up. We're not talking bullets, here. Question for you? Would you rather get hit in the head with a ping pong ball travelling 100 miles/hr., or a baseball travelling 50 miles/hr.? I know what I'd want. One would hurt, the other would probably kill you. Heavy arrows penetrate better... period. With long, heavy, two blade broadheads... period. Read that article in the latest Trad Bowhunter. It's excellent.
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If you are afraid of getting hurt, stay home or shoot it with a gun.
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Hmmm! Justin I think you must have a death wish!!!! Remember Buff. big, you small, go SQUISH!!!! ;D
David, I think this is where we ask the tough questions. Why do you hunt? What does life mean to you, your's and the buffalo's? He has his tools I have mine, now the challenge is who wins. Justin
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.........David-you dont hunt do you ? Too dangerous isnt it ? :'(......bob
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The idea of hunting is that one challenges themselves to bring home the bacon (or this case Buffalo) without becoming the bacon! I prefer not to be the bacon but to be challenged. Being jellied human Pate is not my idea of fun! ;D Lets all remember that there are bold hunter and old hunter but no bold-old hunters!!!!
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The idea of hunting is that one challenges themselves to bring home the bacon (or this case Buffalo) without becoming the bacon! I prefer not to be the bacon but to be challenged. Being jellied human Pate is not my idea of fun! ;D Lets all remember that there are bold hunter and old hunter but no bold-old hunters!!!!
.....................I luv cliches ! However inaccurate they are ! Ya made my day ! ;D ;D ;D......bob
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The idea of hunting is that one challenges themselves to bring home the bacon (or this case Buffalo) without becoming the bacon! I prefer not to be the bacon but to be challenged. Being jellied human Pate is not my idea of fun! ;D Lets all remember that there are bold hunter and old hunter but no bold-old hunters!!!!
Vegetarian: an old Indian word for bad hunter. He got old while he was home doing squaw work. :'( Justin
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Wow, I just read all the posts. I guess I really did kick a hornets nest did'nt I Bishop. It has been a very stimulating conversasion. I actually appreciate the opposing comments and concerns.
To my indian brother.... I have already begun thanking God for the provision and it is with a heart of gratitude that I will accept the sacrifice of the buffalo to feed my family this year. I will in no way disrespect her. I appreciate your willingness to recognize the respect due the buffalos spirit and I intend to honor it as well.
For those that don't like the canned hunt thing, I understand. I didn't go into this with the hunt in mind. I heard about the cull and not being a trophy hunter I'm going for a 4-6yr old cow. Not having a stock trailer I figured might as well kill it there and load it in the back of the pickup and take it to the processor. Then I got to thinking would'nt it be an interesting experience to try and take it with the bow. I visualized shooting it in the pen with the bow and I thought " well then that not very sporting." Thats when I thought about doing the stalk or ambush. I appreciate the purity that you are defending and I appologize if you have been offended by my post. What I just described was the logical progression of my thoughts and I still stand by my reasoning.
In reference to the tackle comments I am all ears. If this had been a planned thing then I would have made my own gear. Call me a romantic if you will but I thought if I was gonna do it with the bow I might as well see if I could procure a good set of arras for the task by offering up one of my fat ringed osage staves. I don't have access to a heavier bow so if I go through with the bow harvest it will have to be with the Virgin Hickory. Obviously there is a certain danger level in this pursuit and I am not trying to prove my manhood. The anticipatiion does get my heart rate up though and I thought it is better to know your limitations and if possible plan for worst. If the general concensus is that the 55# bow is too light then I may need to rethink the weapon of choice.
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Danny....who is yer Indian brother ?..bob
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The idea of hunting is that one challenges themselves to bring home the bacon (or this case Buffalo) without becoming the bacon! I prefer not to be the bacon but to be challenged. Being jellied human Pate is not my idea of fun! ;D Lets all remember that there are bold hunter and old hunter but no bold-old hunters!!!!
.....................I luv cliches ! However inaccurate they are ! Ya made my day ! ;D ;D ;D......bob
I thought you'd get a chuckle out of that one Bob! ;D
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With regards to heavy arrows always penetrating better. Howard Hill states in his book, hunting the hard way that the bow needs enough speed of cast and follow thru to throw a heavy arrow. I think that with out enough speed of cast that a heavy arrow is still just a heavy arrow. Just because an arrow is heavy dosent mean it is magic and will shoot thru bone and grissle with authority. Kenneth
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coo-wah-chobee,
When I was responding to the replies I could not remember who it was that had made the good comment about honoring the bufaloes spirit so I addressed that portion of the response to "my indian brother" . I have since gone back and read who it was and it was Hawkbow I was addressing. I could be wrong about him being my indian brother but he sure made a good point that I thought sounded like an Indian perspective. Why do you ask? Are you Indian? My grandmothers grandfather was either Cherokee or Choctaw I don't know which as we all lived like whitemen and I cannot find out for sure as all the old ones are now gone. Danny
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Little John
Please read the article in the latest Trad Bowhunter about penetration and broadheads by Dr. Ed Ashby. He has dedicated his life to this subject. I used to think like you... all about speed and flat tragectory. I changed my mind. Read it... please.
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yeah I read that article as well adb. I would say Dr Ashby has definitley done the research and his info should be reliable. Heavier arrows are definitley in order. How much heavier I guess is the question? Danny
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Well i'm going to put my 2cents in.
I would never get in a pen with a Buffalo !
When i worked at the butcher shop, farmers would bring in there Buffalo to be processed.
They where in a trailer and when you poked you'r head into the trailer ( the little windows along to the top ) those things would charge you like you wouldn't believe. We would try and shoot them in the ear 3inch slug for a quick kill. This did not always work sometimes it took 2 or 3 shots they are tough animals and i hope who ever you have backing you up with the gun can shoot.
Whatever you decide i wish you luck !
FB
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Great discussion. I have hunted hogs is South Texas at many different ranches, some high fence and some not (ranging in size from 400ac-13,000acres). My experience is the amount of hunting pressure on the animals dictated the challenge of the hunt. I have been completely skunked in a high fence environment on more than one occasion, especially on the smaller ranches. The animals were unbelievable skittish, jumpy, completely on top of their game, leaving me wishing that high fence hunting was easy. Last year I hunted a large ranch (13,000 acres w/ high fence around the perimeter). This outfit only let a limited number of people hunt hogs and javelina each year. The hunting was great as the animals weren't so freaked out. Our group harvested many more animals than on the smaller ranches. I will be returning this year.
The thing that would bother me personally about hunting a buffalo in a high fence situation is that it sounded like the animal would be released into the enclosure and immediately hunted. If the buffalo had been raised in the fenced area or lived for some time in that environment, I think it could be very challenging to hunt, as it would have a better idea of how to evade the hunter. In fact, in that scenario, I don't believe an archer would be sucessfull very often. Any animal can put alot of moves on you in a 2sq mi. (1,280acre) area. Especially if it knows what to do, when hunted. Thanks, Love the discussion.
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I have looked on you tube for some video's on the buffalo hunting. Most of the buffalo I saw were buffalo and not bison. It appears to me that hunting a cape or Asiatic or water buffalo is a significantly dangerous proposition. I have seen their aggressive nature. It is my understanding the North American bison while no slouch when aroused does not share the offensive posture of the other species. This does not exclude of course herd bulls flowing with the juices of their primal dominance or protective mothers with their calves in the face of predatory pressure. I do not think there is as significant a risk as the buffalo's. Having said that, I am still trying to make up my mind if the 55# bow with 850 grain 2blade broadhead at 20yds is enough punch to take her as quickly as possible. I have received feedback that ranges the gambit. I wished I had a 65# that I was comfortable and accurate with but I don't and won't by the time I have to make my decision. That has certainly aroused my recognition that I need to make sure I build one of the Osage bows to be at least 65# or a little more and that I work my way up this next year to be comfortable with hitting what I'm looking at. It also appears that most of what I have seen have been glass recurve shooters or cyborgs. I watched a cyborg shooter get a complete pass through on his second arrow and the bull wandered off for about 15min and then finally succumbed to the blood loss and lack of oxygen. One of the things I noticed with all of them is they took extra care not to let the animal see them take the shot. Seemed like a good idea that even though they knew you were there if they couldn't put you as the source of their anguish then you were still not a threat and just part of the landscape. So if I do decide to go thru with it although I will respect the animals ability to defend itself I will try and not let their be any negative anxiety on my part. I have no doubt the adrenalin will be flowing. Comments still welcome on both sides of the aisle so put yer two cents worth in while ya can. Thanks.........Danny
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Bring backup! If using a pistol go for the heavy duty stuff like a .50. Best yet, lever action in at least .45-70. At twenty yards if you wound a Bison it can turn on you and turn you into jellied patie de human! These are not deer!!!!
Don't put two much faith in the 45-70
I did a Buffalo hunt last February. The ranch I hunted on was a 7000 acre open area (I guess its a pen, just alot bigger)where they stock buffalo and elk.
I was talken out to an area and the guide and myself took off on foot. I was using a Pedersoli "Quigley" in 45-70. We started following the track (Realize that buffalo herd tracks look like some plowed the ground about 50 yards wide. We cam up over the hill and found the herd about 100 yards out. I set up and was taking aim when a yearling bull walked out of the brush at about 35 yards. I re-positioned, took aim and put the 405 grain round right in its engine room, thinking the bull would just fall. It didn't. It winced a little like it had been bitten by a horsefly and casually walked back into the brush, where it took almost 20 minutes for it to fall and die. When we got it gutted, we found the heart and both lungs were destroyed, yet it still took 20 minutes for this animal to die
So, in short, dont be too confident that a 45-70 will stop a charging pissed off buffalo; it won't.
Oh, and my 02 cents worth. In some states, all we hunters have to hunt on is private land. As far as killing a buffalo in a pen, let me ask you this; would you rather pay $6 a pound for it processed, or kill it yourself,process it and maybe have $2 a pound into it?
Texas Pete
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Pete,
I'm thinking the $2 a pound is a no brainer. 20 minutes with heart and lungs gone huh? Yeah, I would say they have been fashioned by our Creator to be durable haven't they. I'm thinkin if she is charging a head shot would be the only chance of derailing the freight train bearing down on ya. Anyone else with an idea on shot placement? Danny
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All i can say, is i've seen slugs bounce off there skulls go through the trailer and through the wall of the blast freezer. They have tuff skulls :o I'd go for a lung and heart shot with the bow and in the ear with a gun.
Good luck !
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I'll keep that in mind. Danny
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I would go for a lung shot with the bow and keep quiet. If she don't know where you are she cant get you. ;) Justin
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The title of the post is "BUFFALO ARROWS !" Can we stop talkin' about guns, their effectiveness, preferences of calibers and stories about gun hunts ? This is NOT a discussion about "the microcosm is indicative of the macrocosm !" (pens ) Like I said in another post the circular reasoning is amazing !.....bob
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Good point Bob.
How heavy are the cane arrows you made up for buffalo ? I know you told me already , but @#$ I forgot. Only part I remember is you said the trades after sharpening are 268 grains .
Heck post a few pics of them here , so we can get this thread back on track.
Ralph
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Hmmm! How about shot shell tipped arrows? Its been done! >:D
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Take it easy now fellas. No need to get grouchy. I personally have found the discourse to be interesting. Insight into the experience of others is helping me to formulate my decision and I have not settled on it yet. Since I started the thread I would hope it is my position to determine if the thread is off track. As most of it seems relevant to the overall objective I see nothing wrong with it thus far. I would like to see the arrows Ralph was referring to. I think that could go along way to bringing us back to the orginal post although you know how these topics can be. They sometimes tend to take on different directions than we originally intended. For instance, when I originally posted this I did not ask anyone what they thought about what I was thinking about doing and yet I got alot of opinions. Thats fine with me because it helps me to consider differing positions my little pea brain may not have considered. So lets keep the discussion going and if you have something productive to say, say it. If not then don't. Its your choice.
I would like to see the arrows that Ralph mentioned though. Danny
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No matter what you decide on just be carefull! (Jeesh! I sound like my mother!) :D
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Danny, be sure you read Dr. Ashbys article in one of the latest Traditional bowhunter mags and incoororate all 14 of the penetration enhancing subjects discussed into a set of bison arrows. Take a close shot from a blind, maybe at a water hole or on the trail to the water hole to get the perfect shot. Use the wind and never let the animals know where the arrow came from. Worst case the animal can be finished off later with a rifle later if the arrow dosn't do the trick. If you can't get the Ashby article, I can fax it to you.Have fun and I am jelous. Kenneth
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Thanks John and Tiller. Yeah John that all sounds like good info. I believe I gave that issue to a freind to read and I can't remember which one...lol you know how it is. If I didn't needed it I would have it. This would be a good time to have some arrows made from hickory or some other heavier hardwood thats heavier. We shall see this week what I can come up with. I am talking to the ranch today and also my brother to see who all we have coming with me for the adventure. I will most certainly take care. Danny
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You can read the complete Ashley report on TradGang. Pat
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Hua.. Sidewinder.. I think it is simple .. practice until you are confident .. use heavy arrows for optimal penetration and do your best to make as quick and humane a kill as possible.. taking any animal with a bow no matter the poundage or arrow type is never a certain thing .. once the arrow leaves the bow it is in essence, out of your hands.. looking at it on the bright side, for thousands of years buffalo have been falling to arrows and I am certain you will make meat with your bow.. looking forward to a post of Tatanka pics after your adventure.. MikeA/ho
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Thanks Pat I will read it today. Danny
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Could someone post the link to the Trad Gang article? I went to tradgang.com, didn't see it.
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Look in the index. I believe it is there. I'll check it out and see. Pat
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When you come to the "main forums" go down to the 11 forum..."Dr Ashby's reports". Pat
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Thanks Pat, I'd have never found it. -m
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Ok an update is in order. I have decided that I do not have the time to get the arrows tuned and shot in before I go and since I am getting it for the meat and the experience of taking it with the bow was secondary I have decided that I will take one next year with the bow. I will build a 65# Osage this year and get comfortable shooting it and get my arrow setup in the 8-900 grain range and do the animal justice with a clean kill with the right equiptment. Having said all that I want to thank everyone for the stimulating conversasion and information. I will still get some paleo experience in that I intend to gun kill it on sight and will have to be the one that guts it. Having never done that it should be a worth while experience none the less. I also intend to use as much of the animal as I am capable of and will probabley post on some other threads my experience and progress. Danny
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Danny, get a bunch of that gut out and stick a hose in the end and flush it. Then stretch it out and dry it. There are a lot of uses for gut. And make sure you get the backstrap sinew before you let it go to the butcher. Justin
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I'll do just that Justin, thanks thats just the kind of direction I need. Anyone else? Danny
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I am 42 years old bad knees sore joints one arm a little longer than the other ,Used to rodeo rode bulls, greatest sport on earth time stands still when your looking for eight, I know what its like to be chased by a 12 to 1500 pound animal looking to give you a horn enema sat in a chair for two weeks because a hoof caught me where it shouldn't have when I was getting up to run for fence thank god for bull fighters! I would go for the2.7 pen long way for the fence make first shot count . or prey chases predator RODE a Buffalo once for $5.00
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Danny, personally. I think that's a wise decision. If you want I'll send you some 200 grain,thin, raw, coral points for next year.
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Thanks Eddie. I'm thinking I want to go with hardwood or heavy cane shafts if possible. I'll bet the coral points rock. Pun intended. I decided last night that I will make a Osage takedown with buffalo horn handle assembly gonna shoot for 65# @ 60"n2n to take it with. I will make a buffalo hide quiver and hopefully have gut string etc... This is going to be a neat experience. I think I will start another thread laying out the componenets and begin the assembly soon. Danny
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Good luck, looking forward to seeing it.
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HEy Sidewinder,
I have complete confidence in your tackle's ability to bring down a buffalo, especially if you are using 800-900 grain arrows. You've just gotta make an accurate shot within a reasonable distance, and I believe that buffalo will be yours.
I have a copy of Traditional Bowhunter magazine that is several years old and in it is an article about women and traditional bows. In it are several women who shoot traditional bows that pull 45-48 pounds and they have killed deer and elk with them. They use reasonably heavy arrows, between 485-550 grains.
There is also a woman who hunted in Africa and used a 43-pound recurve to bring down a kudu bull. She was shooting 680 grain maple arrows and had complete pass-throughs on the largest animals (kudu and gemsbok). She took shots at 18 yards or less, but only if the angle was perfect.
If you have any doubts about what arrows are capable of, keep your eyes out for my article which should be coming out in the next issue or two of Primitive ARcher. It's titled "Putting Bird Points to the Test". I think ya'll will enjoy it.
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sounds like a good article billy ;D
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This one is just too hard to keep quite on. I just couldn't shoot it and then post with the Bison (don't suspect it's a buffalo) like I got it on a hunt....and I like to do that. You want to go primitive but you want to trade for a bow and arrows? I'm not following that too well, but if you're going to borrow I'd borrow a 60-70# bow and sling some 600 grain arrows from it. If you hit shoulder with a 55# bow that "may" shoot 55# at your particular draw length you may not get 3" of penetration. If you hit a rib it may bounce off. Anyway, if you want to shoot it go heavy and get a still shot so you hit vitals and put it down clean. Just my .02 brother
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i be verry dissapointed in anyone who would hunt anything in a pen. (unless if it is killing something that u/someone els dosent want on their propertie. then it is more like extermination that hunting. im suprised huntertraper hasnt already stated the same.
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I'ml tell y'all what. After having gone and harvested that bison, I am convinced that it will not be easy to get close enough for a good shot without ambushing it.
Thanks for the encouragement Billy. I will be sure and try and read the article.
Danny