Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Primitive Skills => Topic started by: BowEd on May 16, 2021, 04:36:53 pm
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The Amish gave me another raw beef hide.From a frozen 80# ball of beef hide I'll make rawhide from it.It's from a 900 pound animal.I just fleshed it on my fleshing beam and framed it.I'll let it dry and dry scrape dehair it later.It should yield over 30 square feet of rawhide.
(https://i.imgur.com/jkdLWjJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/MfVSq8e.jpg)
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WOW now that's a hide, lots of work but will be worth it. :)
Pappy
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Ed, how big is your frame? I have a full cow hide in the freezer to get done, took the hair off, but
I don’t remember if I fleshed it or not- come to think about it, I’m not sure which freezer it’s in (lol)!
Hawkdancer
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I used my elk hide frame for this one made from 2" by 6"'s.Inside dimensions are 6.5' by 5.5'.Large beef over 1000 pounds will require a larger frame yet.Then you'll get into mature buffalo sized hides of over 35 square feet.
Pretty sure you fleshed it before dehairing it or should have anyway.Personally I'm glad to get this one out of the freezer.We need the space for other things edible this summer and fall.
I make many things out of beef rawhide.
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fills that frame up...gut
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Made a little progress with the hide.We finally got some rain free weather.I sanded the flesh side and dehaired a bit.
(https://i.imgur.com/icQbFYU.jpg)
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Looking good 👍 Pappy
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You have a lot more get up and go to tackle the job than I do, then again I am a decrepit old guy.
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Thanks fellas.It's sort of a user friendly type procedure.No time restraints.It'll get done when it gets done.I'm thinking by the end of the week,if it does'nt start raining again.
Your brain tanning some deer hides too are'nt you Pappy?
Instead of just leaving it as rawhide as I have some already I've had some crazy thoughts of bark tanning it.I do pride myself on doing all this myself.I've done that before but I really don't care for the mess and time that it takes.Summer would be the time to do it.
There's a tannery a few hours to the north of me that chrome tans and dyes leather.I was thinking of calling him too to see if it could be tanned cheaper because of my pre prepping work.I've walked around through his tannery before.
I'm 67 but don't really feel that way Eric.Cut and split my own wood yet.Another 10 years could be a little different.....Ha Ha.
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Thanks for posting this Ed. Always enjoy seeing your work. Sure I will learn something.
Could sure use a little of that rain you’ve been getting. It’s really dry here.
Bjrogg
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Ed, I think you will be good for another 20 or so! Just have to raise the splitting block a little higher and get some younger guys to to the toting out! (lol). It does get a bit harder to bend down to pick things up after 80! >:D
BJ, we got 2" of rain this weekend along with a tornado alert, apparently passed northwest of us a few miles in more or less open country. Luckily no hail!
Hawkdancer
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I know it takes a bit more stretching in the morning to feel loose.....Ha Ha.Lower back and hips can get stiff.I think from doing the heavy lifting and shoveling by myself while farming.
Parts of this state are hurting for rain here too.We're ok here for now.
I feel we'll have an extended warm fall again because of all of the cool weather this spring.
This hide I've finally gotten dry.It goes in and out of the garage to get worked on.Tomorrow I'll get more done but by thursday more rain is coming.Probably won't get it done before thursday.
I've got mulberry drying in the house for a couple of bows too.Look forward to those builds.
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It was a picture perfect beautiful day today.Sunny/low humidity and around 80 degrees with no wind.Perfect for dehairing.You can see it shrunk a bit more contorting the 2" by 6" frame.Hav'nt really needed to sharpen my scraper yet.It's made from a mill bastard file.
With a little luck I may finish it up tomorrow.
(https://i.imgur.com/WFrd2VU.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/JmS0ue3.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/y6uTBbs.jpg)
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Coming right along Ed.
Thought we were going to get some rain today. Looked promising on the radar map. Not even a decent dust settler .
Really look forward to seeing what becomes of that hide in the future.
Bjrogg
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Tomorrow night or thursday night it's supposed to rain.I should get it done before that.My nephews' ground needs rain.He should get some then too.
Update.....Weatherman changed his mind.It'll start raining in the morning now.
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That's looking good, another good day and you should have that done.
Pappy
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Yep I should be able to.Just 1 more afternoon and I'll be done.Bahhhh humbug.It's raining already.Good for some but not for me today.
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Well the rain quit long enough for me to finish it up.After cutting it out I gave it an overall spray of bug repellent.That's always kept the pests away from it here.Rolled it up and put it way to storage.Right around 35 square feet in size.
(https://i.imgur.com/zyVubwU.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/GrizA8k.jpg)
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Nice , lots of projects in that hide. :) Pappy
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Yep Pappy.A persons' degree of imagination is the limit as to the things to be made from this stuff.
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Yep Pappy.A persons' degree of imagination is the limit as to the things to be made from this stuff.
You took the words right out of my mouth Ed.
I was just thinking. Now it’s ready for your imagination
Bjrogg
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I'm exploring my options here to see what is cost viable.I have cow rawhide on hand here already.I gave the tannery a question message as to the cost to chrome tan and dye this piece.Cow rawhide is of a different texture structure than deer,elk,or bison.A lot tighter.If done with them they would shave it to an overall thickness of 4 ounce leather.Something I'm not prepared to do here either.
For brain tanning a lot more work for penetration of brain oils in a beef hide.Freezing and thawing after braining does help but still a lot of work.Waiting till winter time here to brain tan it would be the viable option there.I would need to rope it dry on a suitable temperatured day then too.Ordering perfect weather for something like that from mother nature is a very long shot to happen.A heated shed would be an option to use there and then there is the smoking of to be done too.
I've bark tanned cowhide and elk hide in the past too but that is very time consuming and of course extra work too.55 gallon barrels of tannic water need to be prepared for that and weeks of soaking.Then oiling and softening.
All in all I know what I'm getting into here and will decide.
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Ya done enough big deer hide and a couple of cow elk to know what kind of job brain tanning a cow hide would be to get penetration and then work till dry, that would be a job for sure. I am sure you will come up with something though. ;) :)
Pappy
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Brain tanning mature beef rawhide is different then brain tanning buffalo or elk.The structure of the fibers is a lot tighter.Why that is is beyond me.A lot more stretching and even thinning is needed with them.I've tanned calf hides and noticed this.I just framed and fleshed another deerhide.Piece of cake compared to the beef.Even videos shown doing moose hides show them thinning the moose hides considerably.
I might just brain tan this beef hide yet though.It all depends on how much cherrios I eat.....ha ha.The temptation to have a tannery do it at a lower cost because of my prep work is inviting.
I'll get a price from them sometime when they call back.
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That is a really nice looking hide Ed. Lots of rawhide for future bows.
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Thanks but beef rawhide is a bit too thick for backing bows.I make many other things out of beef rawhide though.
I just got a response from the tannery about the beef hide.They do a chrome tan there.Dye it too.Talked to an office person which is not the most informative.Convoluted response.She said oh you went above and beyond what normal people do when bringing in hides to be tanned.So much so that an extra step is needed now.Rehydrating.I said I did'nt think rehydrating was a step in tanning hides.At least not labor wise and other steps like fleshing and dehairing were already eliminated which does take labor.
Also that their chemicals had gone up in price.More regulations put on them lately too.I was afraid of that.Anyway she said if we piece it out [quartered] it would cost $6.00/sq.ft.If tanned whole $8.00/sq.ft.Way too much.I'd like to speak with the boss myself.You'd think cutting it into quarters takes labor.In short to me just excuses to charge more was her response.
Also she said they had quit doing hair on beef hides but because mine was already dehaired they would do it.They only do exotics like elephant,rhino,and alligator etc.
This beef hide needs to be thinned to make it easier to brain tan and get good brain penetration..I'm thinking of making a wider very sharp scraper for that.I started doing a couple deer hides now anyway.Got 1 ready for brains.The other will be in a few days too.
(https://i.imgur.com/eyKtMMz.jpg)
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Good work Ed! There are other tanners bud, they sound like they just don't want to mess with it to me. But whatever you decide I know you will make good use out of the entire hide no matter what state it's in.
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That's right Pat.
I dehaired the second deer hide yesterday.Frrezers empty of hides now.Ready for more meat and veggies and more hides this fall and winter.It's why I make so much rawhide.That'll store well outside the freezer.I'll get around to brain tanning and smoking these 2 later this summer.
(https://i.imgur.com/03ZDBh8.jpg)
Right now I've got a plan brewing.I got myself a chunk of leaf spring from junk yard for a blade and some 1" sq. tubing for a handle from my junk pile or replenishable resource.Total cost $1.00.I'll make a wider scraper and make an ultra sharp thinning scraper to thin this beef hide.Might sand it some too.Brain and wring it multiple times.Work it dry in the frame stretching with a dulled wide scraper.Probably rope it some too.Then smoke it to finish it.This hide will take quite a bit longer to do than a deer hide but I'll see what the results will be,
There will be steps to perform with a hide like this.I'll try to explain them as I go.Nothing is guaranteed here but I'm not afraid to fail.It's how I learn I guess.
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+3 :OK
I understand one of the nice things about brain tan is that you can't mess up the hide totally because you can always rebrain until it turns out right.
You could waste work though, that may be worse.
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Yes it could be,but from experience of these things in the past I pretty much know all of the pitfalls or struggles that can occur and the steps needed to take to avoid them.I've been brain tanning since the 1980's.
I very rarely ever need to rebrain and restretch any deer hides any more for years for a superior product.A beef hide of this size could be an exception.If so in the end with success it still won't be a waste of time.Just a bigger project is all.
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Got my hide thinning scraper made.It's made from a typical leaf spring around 3" wide and 4" long approximately.High carbon steel is needed for what I want to do to hold an edge a long time.I was careful not to temper the steel applying the bevel on the edge.A metal file skates across it yet and does'nt bite in.The edge is crescent shaped and sharpened razor sharp with a sharpening stone..I'll see using it whether the shape of the crescent needs to be adjusted.
A 1" square metal handle from some square stock laying around in my small junk pile of metal.Around 18" long.Welded er up and she's good to go.
(https://i.imgur.com/H9iur2T.jpg)
I even painted it black.The shaver I call it does have some heft to it.I wanted some heft to this scraper to help the thinning process.To let the tool do a lot of the work for pressure on the hide.
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I rough out the shape first with a speed grinder slowly while dipping it into water while I do it.I finalize the shape on my wet stone petal sharpener.I finalize the edge to sharpness with a finer wet stone that's sitting on the seat of the wet stone petal grinder.
(https://i.imgur.com/N2sCbpp.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/3fzCtDA.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/TFWIIgc.jpg)
I modified or rounded the corners more.
(https://i.imgur.com/1MbFr00.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/tPNhbdg.jpg)
I want to be able to take off 1"-1.5" wide of a rawhide shaving off each pass or stroke.
PS.....One by-product I intend to keep from this is the rawhide shavings.I'll use it to make hide glue.There should be a substantial amount of it.Being thin shavings it will break down very quickly into hide glue.
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Nice edge! I like that pedal grinder, sort of rare nowadays, at least in working order!
Hawkdancer
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I've had this petal grinder for over 40 years and have used it many many times.Something I'll never part with all of my hide and wood splitting routines here.I made a new frame for it way back then too.
I've resoaked this beef hide to reframe it.I'll cut new lacing holes.I refleshed both sides of the hide on my beam to loosen it up some and give it a thorough cleaning.A few little bits and pieces of flesh side membrane removed but overall pretty good.I'm noticing I'm not getting the proper stretch on this beef hide that's really a requirement to make good brain tan.I'll reframe it today.See if my scraper thinner works best while hide is wet or dry.I'll also see if I can get a good stretch on it while in the frame by prodding into it also.
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Good looking tool Ed, that should get it done. I have never had much luck putting one back on the rack after they were rawhide and original holes have been cut out, seem the new holes in just rawhide always just rip or split out when i try pulling them tight. I would like to know how you keep that from happening, I have done it after they begin to turn into leather but not while they are just rawhide ??? Pappy
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I resoaked the hide in a 55 gallon plastic barrel of water with a cup of bleach added for about a day.
(https://i.imgur.com/U4j3bYf.jpg)
Cut my new holes after giving it a thorough scraping again on the beam.I also twisted it on a pole from a donut shape many times.It was plenty pliable but still rawhide of course.It stretched very good with the lace holes holding well.I let it dry.Nothing special it just worked.Did'nt take any pictures of the scraping process.
The new tool took too much of a bite off.I was afraid of that happening.I think it would work on a frozen hide in the frame though.I'll use it as a flesher in the frame.I went to a scraper made from a disk blade a little narrower and took a few mm of thickness off overall 1/4" wide strips off the hair side.Almost iike dehairing it again but payed special attention to neck/spine/and hip areas to thin.Gave it a thorough sanding on both sides with the palm sander using 40 grit.It is definitely lighter and thinner than it was but still 2/3rds' of it is probably like a 4 to 5 year old buck deers' neck in thickness.The belly of this beef is like the neck of most does.
I normally after cutting a deer rawhide out of frame just brain and rope it dry too.Cutting new lace holes into a brained hide does'nt work.Too much stretch there.Keep original holes it had as rawhide before doing the drying in the frame method.
People that dry brained hides or stake them soft in the frame prepare the hide on the beam.Fleshing and wet scraping hair and epidermis.Then cut holes to frame it and dry it.Then brain it and lace it into frame and stake it dry to soften.
I'll pick and choose the weather forecast to do this beef hide in the frame prodding and stretching it.A person needs to set aside a few days for a hide like this.I'll leave original lace holes on this hide as rawhide before braining it.Here it is after thinning it.
(https://i.imgur.com/rrU0mij.jpg)
This one I'll brain it as rawhide layed out applying the brains both sides to get pliable.Insert it in brain slurry while pulling and stretching it and leaving it overnight.After that I'll twist it/rebrain,twist it/rebrain many times.I may let it dry in the sun I don't know yet and rehydrate it.I won't go through the intermintent smoking process though and never seen a need for it.I will smoke it after it is brain tan.
I may refreeze the hide too after braining and twisting along with the excess brain slurry to save it for later on.Then thaw hide out and reheat the brain slurry and do more braining and twisting before lacing it into the frame to finish.Freezing and thawing has a way of breaking the fibers apart too.
It might be that after it gets stretched a lot in the frame and almost dry I'll have to rope it dry the rest of the way too.I won't cut the lace holes off though.Sounds like a lot of ifs and maybes but I know what I'm doing.It dried in the frame as rawhide in a matter of about 5 to 6 hours in the sun.I won't do that when working it dry after braining.I would'nt be able to keep up with it.I'll work the hide in the shade and it may take quite some time to completely dry.
I'll put it in a plastic bag twisted shut and in a cool place when not roping it.The moisture in the thicker parts will adhere to the thinner parts.Then get roped dry again.Part of the magic that happens.I do this with deer hides all the time and did it with hair on buffalo hides too.
If I need to rebrain it after one stretching session in the frame that's what I'll have to do.A lot of more work than a deer hide but I knew that anyway.I've read many experienced brain tanners have problems with doing beef hides and just plain gave up.
If a person looks at the cree indian way of doing moose hides you'll see it takes days and days to do a moose hide and with multiple people most times.Robert Badine is one who did it alone.He fancys using fabric softener as a softener.I'll use good old tried and true brains.They prescribe to intermittent smoking too.
We'll see how things work out.I'm in the process of acquiring more brains from a grocery store.Might have to special order them.If so I'll get 20 pounds.
PS....Just got word from grocery store they can get me two 12 pound cases tomorrow morning.Don't have them in the house yet though.Should be good to go then.
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I reenforced an old tool onto the edge I used to use when staking hides dry in the frame.I put a steel insert into the end of it.It's app. 3' long overall.I think it's from an old canoe paddle.I call it the staking tool or the finishing tool.
(https://i.imgur.com/8309BcB.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/qbvCTZ3.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/XXjhRlZ.jpg)
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I was able to save a little over half of the rawhide shavings for hide glue.
Oh and BTW I did need to resharpen my scraper a couple of times to get the job done.
(https://i.imgur.com/iF6v9Cl.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/0vWccWk.jpg)
One thickness of shaving was around 1/64" thick.I took off 3 to 4 strokes in each area I scraped overlapping strokes.So a total of around 3/64" thickness removed.Or just shy of 1/16" thickness removed.It is a lot more pliable.
In leather thickness descriptions that's about 3 ounces off.1/64" thickness in leather is equivalent to an ounce in thickness.
I still think it's a bit too thick in the hip areas for garment leather.
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Should make nice glue!
Hawkdancer
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I think we are all rather frugal people on this site.I'm no exception.
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Yep, I'm in the 'use it up, wear it out, make do' school of thought.
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Well I got my brains and will continue the progress of brain tanning this beef hide.Taking some pictures along the way.I'll wait for some suitable weather to stake this hide dry.Right now it's hotter than blazes.Not the most ideal conditions.It'll dry too fast for me to keep up with.
Up till now as a green hide I've fleshed it on the beam/laced it into a frame to dry/dehaired it dry scraping and sanding/cut it out of frame/resoaked it/cleaned it up better on the flesh side on the beam/cut new lace holes & relaced it into the frame to dry/thinned it scraping with my disk blade scraper and resanded it with palm sander and 40 grit paper.Here are the steps.
Currently it was brained both sides with very hot brain solution onto dried rawhide by using a large paint brush/left to bake in the sun a half hour each side while massaging in brain solution.It was around 110 degrees F. in the sun.About 85 degrees F. in the shade.
(https://i.imgur.com/Jphshrf.jpg)
My solution for ambitious little doggies.
(https://i.imgur.com/b2qiBqV.jpg)
On a tarp on the ground while I baby sat it.
(https://i.imgur.com/TDm4nkK.jpg)
Reintroduced into brain slurry in a plastic cattle mineral tub I had while solution was warm but not blazing hot.
(https://i.imgur.com/EjQqJ5c.jpg)
Left to set soaking overnight.
(https://i.imgur.com/mzwMMYp.jpg)
Next day twisted many ways/multiple times and redunked into brain slurry many times.This helps to break the fibers up and drive the brain oils through the hide.
(https://i.imgur.com/Ej0cg7k.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Nc7BJpu.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PC1c3rH.jpg)
Relaced into frame.
(https://i.imgur.com/Hs8Kqvp.jpg)
Retightened and set up on edge.
(https://i.imgur.com/7SkV9yd.jpg)
Staked,prodded, and stretched for about an hour hair side.Thanks to Robin for taking the picture.It stretched pretty good.Some promise there.Focused a lot on the spine/hip/and neck areas.
(https://i.imgur.com/VK9bOvJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/8fy6zdS.jpg)
Folded and put into black plastic bag while wet yet and refroze into freezer along with brain slurry in bucket.
(https://i.imgur.com/FftXsij.jpg)
I'm of the opinion freezing and the ice chrystals formed can help stress the fibers to be stretched farther.Some say it is better done freezing it while stretched onto frame in the winter time.It's all about getting it properly brained.I'll let it get hard as a rock in the freezer.
I did throw a capfull of downy fabric softener into brain slurry too like Robert Badine uses for good luck.....ha ha.
As said earlier I'll wait for more suitable weather to stake it dry and see if I got it properly brained.It still is thicker than I'd like.It is a challenge for sure.
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Is this about how buffalo hides would have been done? That photo of you standing net to the hide makes it look very large. What do you plan to do with it?
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The hair on buffalo I did I just massaged the brains into the flesh side after fleshing and drying in the frame.Let partially dry for a couple of hours.Then layed a wet blanket onto the flesh side to completely rehydrate it.Then roped them dry on the flesh side.
With the epidermis on the hair side yet a hair on hide needs to be scuffed,pulled or stretched and abraided across the rope to break up that epidermis on the hair side.Doing it in a frame does not do that.Your hide may be pliable doing it in the frame but card boardy like and stiff yet.Doing it on the rope by hand makes it robe like and very pliable.
This beef hide has the epidermis removed so it can be done in the frame.
The hide as of now is close to 35 sq.ft.I'm 6'3" tall.Softening it in the frame will actually make it larger than it was as rawhide,and will become thinner overall if done in frame till dry.I'm counting on that.
Roping hides dry will get hides finished that are slightly or around 25% smaller than they were as rawhide and a bit thicker than too.All because it is'nt being stretched as much as in the frame.Regardless if it is brained properly either way will produce velvety soft leather.
"Ai'nt nothing like brain tanned leather".
I've made about everything under the sun out of brain tanned leather and multiple times.With this beef hide I have plans to make another pair of full length pants and then some.As I'm sure Ill have plenty left over yet.Some really thick moccasins come to mind also even though I have 2 pair already.A hard soled and a soft soled pair.I usually don't have any problems thinking of things to make out of this stuff.Maybe a nice beaded vest.
I try not to put the cart before the horse here yet.It has to be suitable brain tan.I'm not there yet.A happy day will be when I'm satisfied and it's getting smoked.
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I got to thinking about Joe Brandl at Absoroka Tannery in Dubois. He is set up to do large hides with the hair on as he does lots of bison.
You are gonna have a nice hide when you are done, Ed. Gotta say, you don't get scared off a big job easy, do ya?
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Always enjoy your comments JW.I've never heard of Joe but there's a lot of excellent brain tanners out there these days.All trying to make money off of books and DVD's.My DVD is in my head.....ha ha.
Back in the 1980's in the basement of my old farm house I had a set up frame I could get to either side of the hide.Staples were hit onto the edges of the 2"by4"'s for lacing holes and onto the ceiling beam and onto a 2"by4" bolted to the cement floor.I had a wood burner and a fan going then too.Very convenient!!!Ahhhh the good old days.
(https://i.imgur.com/mf3zjsQ.jpg)
Here I've got to flip this big frame around in order to stake this hide on both sides.Plenty of time though.No big deal.I keep saying it's not over till it's over.If I've got to rebrain and reframe stretch this hide again that's the way it'll be.I seen a small knife split open up to a small hole just while stretching it the short period of time before putting it into the freezer so I know I'm getting a good stretch on this hide.
I've personally seen first hand brain tanned beef hide articles in a museum.I forget where.It's been done.I think mostly during the early reservation period of times back in the late 1800's.Since I can't get or too cheap to get my own moose or bull elk I'll have to make beef hide work for me......ha ha.
When the weather is right I'll thaw this hide out of the freezer.Brain slurry too.Rebrain and twist it again multiple times.Put it back into the frame and stake it dry.I expect it to take at least 12 hours worth of staking to get this one dry.Hope I'm wrong though.
Were'nt you at John Bybees' place when I did a small deer hide brain tan demonstration there?I think his wife was upset about all of the deer hair in her woods.....ha ha.I keep that under control here by dehairing on quiet days.....ha ha.She might of not liked the brains being cooked on her stove either....ha ha.
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Thanks for sharing this Ed. I always learn something when you document these tan jobs.
It’s a enormous undertaking even without the documenting and posting.
Just want you to know I appreciate it.
Bjrogg
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Joe runs a fair sized commercial tannery. I got some really fine bark tanned deer hide from him and it is BUTTER.
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Thanks BJ.Us country folk think alike.Sure hope you get the rain you'll need up there.It's getting drier and drier here now and the actual summer has'nt even begun yet.These bigger hides are being done by quite a few people actually.I feel like I'm just trying to keep up.
JW....That's cool.It would be interesting to walk through his tannery.The one north of me is too expensive to suit me though.They do fine work too,but not brain tanning.Did Joe do some brain tanning?
I've figured out a way to set this frame up in the shade in a way that I can get to both sides of the hide to stake so I'm good to go.
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I know he has done brain tanning in the past, but he does not offer that as a commercial tanning operation.
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Most tanning operations are aware of brain tanning.So much so that they try to imitate it's likeness looks wise with chemicals.Tanning operations continually try to disguise their product proclaiming look alikes.Charging higher prices for their look alike product.Although they do proclaim it to be a look alike product but not really true brain tan to stay away from any lawsuits.
Facts are it does'nt have the same feel or ease of applying quillwork or beadwork.I don't think it's as tough either.In short it's a fraud IMO.Facts are they realize it's a lot more work to do it the natural way.Not a viable money making enterprise for them to get into now or ever has been.Although I've made thousands of dollars selling brain tan myself,but not on the grand scale tanning operations want to make money.
That's why I say "Ai'nt nothing like brain tan leather".
It has it's place of use where it is the best type of leather to have like say garment type leather.For something relatively thin but stiff enough to hold its' profile like say a pistol holder it is not the best type of leather to use then.Other types of natural tanning has it's place of best use too.Like bark or vegetable tan for instance where stiffer thicker leather is the best choice for the service needed.It can be more more supple too but then it is very thin leather but not as supple thin as brain tan yet.
For many in the public it does'nt really matter to them.Their satisfied just that it's leather.No matter how it came to be.There lies the difference between those who follow the old ways and those who it does'nt really matter.
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I decided to heck with waiting for cooler weather because the forecast is for hot days for 2 weeks for sure so I took the hide and brain slurry out of freezer to thaw yesterday.Rewarmed brain slurry and rebrained the hide.Let it set overnight again.
Next day I needed to go to a 3D shoot in the morning.I left hide in brain slurry all day today.
This evening I will take hide from brain slurry.Rewring and twist it multiple times.Frame it and stake and stretch it at least an hour on both sides but leave it damp and not completely dry.Rewarm brain slurry again and reinsert hide into brain slurry and let it set in brain slurry overnight again.Then tomorrow morning remove hide.Rewring and twist it multiple times again.Then reframe it and stake it till dry to see how soft it will get overall.I have a feeling sometime along the way I'm going to need to unlace it as it's drying and begin to work it on the rope too.
All these multiple rewarming of brains/twisting/stretching/and rebraining part time steps are done to try to get a first time staking and roping on this hide in the frame to a soft overall product.It will take a long time to completely dry.I figure a good 12 hours plus.
I figure to take breaks putting it into a plastic bag sealed occasionally while I'm roping it.
A thick hide like this leaves nothing gauranteed for a first time soft product.This is where big thick hides take more time to do.Not really constantly working them but doing part time steps along the way.I still may need to rebrain it again and stake it again.
Some time Sunday I will know I figure.
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Awesome posts Ed. Doing this in warm weather, is there any worry of the brains starting to spoil?
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Yes Morgan there is.Good that you brought that up.I'm watching or smelling it to be sure....ha ha.A person does'nt want them to go rancid.That's for sure.It would'nt be good for the future leather either.It's ok yet.
Just got finished staking it in the frame.It has grown in size quite a bit.I've put it back into the warmed up brain slurry tub for overnight.
I brained the 2 deer hides in that slurry too.I'll freeze those for later after twisting/wringing them and rebraining them.
Then I'm pretty sure I'll need to throw this brain slurry away sometime tomorrow.
Total that will be used then is 9#'s in 4 gallons of water for 2 deer hides and 1 beef hide.I know that sounds like a lot but I wanted to be sure and you can't harm it any overbraining the hides.I'm pretty sure it'll be brained good enough now.
Big day tomorrow and the next.
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This beef hide rawhide still feels different than deer.
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Well after about 6 hours staking in the frame I saw that it needed to be roped and scuffed.Edges were beginning to be dry in frame but not as soft as I'd like.
Now after roping off and on for another 5 hours I'm seeing this beef rawhide does not have the nice stretch to it that deer and buffalo hide has while roping.In fact his beef rawhide even though thinned a fair amount is still a lot thicker than the hair on buffalo I did.
I believe the fibers in beef are a lot tighter than deer or buffalo.I don't believe another braining is the problem solver or solution either.I had serious concerns about the stretching ability of brained beef rawhide prior to doing this.I guss my suspicions were right.As I said earlier about doing hair on beef calves [aluminumsulfate tan] they ended up a lot thicker than deer and harder to stretch.
I'll find some use for it though.Plenty big yet and thick too.
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So are you calling it good Ed , or do you plan on doing something more to it. :)
Pappy
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Yep Pappy it's a done deal far as I'm concerned.I always find a use for it somewhere.
The fiber structure of beef rawhide [at least the very thick stuff] is just not suited for stretching enough for me to make good brain tan out of it.Too tight.
On another thread I've shown multiple uses for this beef hide rawhide.
I'll do my 2 deer hides later as they are a lot easier.They've been brained and are froze at the moment.They're ready to be roped dry.Got another shirt to put together.Got the sioux lazy stitch beadwork done already to put on it.Got an elk leg possibles bag and another coyote possibles bag to make too.
I've moved to finishing up on some bamboo backed mulberry bows for now.2 other naturally deflexed/reflexed self bows of this mulberry to do yet too.
By then it'll be deer hunting season.
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Is it still just rawhide on just a harder leather even if not really soft but still leather ?? Sometimes I have older deer hides that will have a spot in them that won't seem to take the brains,on soften, not sure if it is scare tissue , but won't seem to get soft no matter what I do, even had 1 that had a spot in the back bone area about the size of a base ball that stayed wet rawhide, once the hide was tanned and soft I just pulled it out, soft all around it but it just wouldn't take, not sure why but seems to be like wood bows, every hide has something challenging about it. Guess that's why I love doing them , always learning something on each one. ;)
Pappy
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Yes it'll be a more pliable type rawhide now.
Scars on some deer sometimes are better to be cut and resewn.Some can have some doosies in the flanks etc.They never take the smoke on good.I cut and sew them up after braining and before roping sometimes.Baseball stitch on the flesh side.Then after roping and soft I restitch it up with real sinew that's wet or damp.I keep some backstrap sinew around for that.Shrinks tight and won't come out.No need to tie knots with real sinew either.Makes for an invisible stitch line after smoking.
like so.This was an arrow hole.
(https://i.imgur.com/9IolZhW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/HC9fWXr.jpg)
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Like everything you do, your attention to detail is incredible. You would have probably made a heck of a surgeon if you were interested in becoming a doctor. Seriously. I'd feel confident with someone like you putting me under, knowing no scalpels or surgical sponges getting sewed up inside...and the scar would just disappear!
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Ha ha.....Hope you and I never need a surgeon in our lifetime.Tooo much schooling for that profession [I could'nt stand school] and the call never came to me either although I've stitched up quite a few coondogs in my time and a lot of holes in fox pelts.