Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: DanaM on January 02, 2009, 07:16:34 am

Title: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 02, 2009, 07:16:34 am
I'm going to attempt a bow from Tag Alder(Alnus rugosa). Generally considered as completely useless.
I like to try different woods, I'm going to be really surprised if this one works out, the wood is really soft.
The stave is about 70" long and 1.5" wide and has a high crownand a few knot also. Not much width to work with but I'm going to
aim for 40#@ 26" and no longer than 68" NTN :) If it survives it will join my other garbage wood bow the sumac I built.
Here's a few pic to give you an idea of what I'm working with.

One question I have id with the high crown you guys think a flat belly is best? or maybe go for a rounded belly?

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: cracker on January 02, 2009, 08:06:59 am
Hi Dana
  That's enough to make me want to try a piece of china berry.
Ron
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: islandpiper on January 02, 2009, 09:11:08 am
Dana, hey, I recognize that stick!!   It's one that hit me in the face when I was surveying a line in Dickenson County!!   Right?

Man, if Tag Alder works, you have bows for the multitudes in every creek bottom in the UP. 

Good luck  with it, we'll all be interested.    Piper
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Marc St Louis on January 02, 2009, 09:35:18 am
Dana
I've been meaning to try Tag Alder for several years.  Last Fall while I was cutting some firewood I came across a really nice one.  It was about 4" in diameter, no branches for 7' and pretty straight, those that are familiar with Tag Alder know that is big for one of them.  It came back home with me and is drying in my wood shed. 

Personally I think Tag Alder should make a decent bow, it is after all a member of the Birch family
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 02, 2009, 09:45:26 am
4" mark that is a honkin big one :o As for it making a bow we shall see eh. wish I had a more width to work with though.
Oh well if it even remotely works I will keep my eyes open for something bigger as piper said it literally grows everywhere around here :)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Pat B on January 02, 2009, 10:50:24 am
Dana, If anyone is crazy it you, my friend! ;)  This will be interesting. Tag Alder as quite common here as well. Can't wait to see how it turns out. I hope your safety equipment is up to date.  ;)   Pat
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: FlintWalker on January 02, 2009, 01:33:31 pm
You can do it man!  Daaa-Nuh!  Daa-Nuh!  ;D
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: ricktrojanowski on January 02, 2009, 07:34:14 pm
You made a beauty out of that Sumac.  This will be another challenge for ya.  Good luck.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: nailbender on January 02, 2009, 07:51:30 pm
  Tag Alder...Hmmm...

 Does that stuff Have kind of a glossy gray brown bark, leaves like a birch tree, and grow in swampy, low moist areas, usually only 2-3" in diameter?
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 02, 2009, 08:30:27 pm
  Tag Alder...Hmmm...

 Does that stuff Have kind of a glossy gray brown bark, leaves like a birch tree, and grow in swampy, low moist areas, usually only 2-3" in diameter?

Yup dats da stuff :) Thanks for the vote of confidence guys, now the pressure is really on 8)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Jesse on January 02, 2009, 08:33:22 pm
After you make that one Dana I'll cut some black ash for ya. Cant wait to see if it holds up. Good luck.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 02, 2009, 08:35:20 pm
Hey Jesse I'll take ya up on the black ash, go ahead and cut me 3 or 4 decent pieces :)
If nothing else I can beat it apart for basket weaving eh ;D
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: nailbender on January 03, 2009, 01:25:42 am
 I was wondering what that stand of trees behind my house was. I thought it was some kind of river birch. I actually have a couple of staves of the stuff drying, was going to see what it amounted to.

   Dale
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: AKAPK on January 03, 2009, 02:09:37 am
Dana, there is so much Alder around here, if ya do it I need the secret. :) whata i mean if, I know you will.PK
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: stonecarver on January 11, 2009, 08:46:12 pm
Here is a link to one of the first bows I made and it is Alder, a year later and my boy is still shooting it :)
I loved working the wood it was like butter!
my Sitka Alder bow (http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/16305)

Sitka Alder (Alnus viridis ssp. sinuata)
This tree ranges from California to to Alaska
Plants Profile (http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ALVIS) A good description with pictures
Calflora (http://www.calflora.org/cgi-bin/species_query.cgi?where-calrecnum=254) information for California
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: El Destructo on January 11, 2009, 08:51:27 pm
                                                         Nice little Bow there....I like gnarly woods!!
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Granite Mtn on January 18, 2009, 04:07:22 am
Hey I hate to rain on your parade, but a cool dude up here in Alaska, one Martin Farris, has been shooting his alder bow at our 3d tourneys for a couple years now.  The best part is the chant go go alder bow before each shot.  Hope this provide inspiation, and if  a cult following forms I am willing to ship genuine Alska alder by the plane load at a very reasonable price, it may make the sheep hunting a litytle less demandig.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Granite Mtn on January 18, 2009, 04:10:41 am
guess I shood uss speel chek aftur 5 rumncokes
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 18, 2009, 07:15:52 am
What kind of alder up there Granite? There is actually some pretty tough alder species.
Tag Alder isn't one of them but hey I will give it a try :)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: rudderbows on January 18, 2009, 09:40:34 am
Some of my first bows I made years ago were from alder.  The trees grow fairly straight and they turn color over time. Alder does make a bow,but, the wood could use backing of cloth or soemthing. Its very light in weight once it is dried. I think it would make an excellent center core because it can offer mass without the extra weight. . .
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: sailordad on January 18, 2009, 11:33:42 am
granite mtn

ifn you want to send me a piece i would love to try it

pm me and lets talk  ;D
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 18, 2009, 12:17:14 pm
granite mtn

ifn you want to send me a piece i would love to try it

pm me and lets talk  ;D

Hey now Tim no poaching on my thread eh ;) :D
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: stonecarver on January 18, 2009, 04:05:48 pm
Here is a link to one of the first bows I made and it is Alder, a year later and my boy is still shooting it :)
I loved working the wood it was like butter!
my Sitka Alder bow (http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/16305)

Sitka Alder (Alnus viridis ssp. sinuata)
This tree ranges from California to to Alaska
Plants Profile (http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ALVIS) A good description with pictures
Calflora (http://www.calflora.org/cgi-bin/species_query.cgi?where-calrecnum=254) information for California

Yup Alaskan Alder makes a nice bow!
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on January 18, 2009, 06:01:46 pm
Here is a link to one of the first bows I made and it is Alder, a year later and my boy is still shooting it :)
I loved working the wood it was like butter!
my Sitka Alder bow (http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/topic/16305)

Sitka Alder (Alnus viridis ssp. sinuata)
This tree ranges from California to to Alaska
Plants Profile (http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ALVIS) A good description with pictures
Calflora (http://www.calflora.org/cgi-bin/species_query.cgi?where-calrecnum=254) information for California

Yup Alaskan Alder makes a nice bow!


Yea but what species???
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: stonecarver on January 18, 2009, 10:07:16 pm
Alnus viridis

It grows all over the West coast :)

http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=ALVIS
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder(Updated 2/14/09)
Post by: DanaM on February 14, 2009, 03:02:16 pm
Haven't felt like messing with this one with it having been so dry but the humidity has been up for a few weeks
so I figured it was time to do a little work on it. Had to shorten it down to 61" as I found a cluster of little knots and
I felt they would cause the bow to break. So right now its floor tillered at 61" next I will cut some nocks in and
start tillering. Not sure if I'm going to get a shooter or not but if I do it will be light weight.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: nickf on February 14, 2009, 03:46:59 pm
this is an alder bow I made, it broke when I overdrew it, sadly.
http://paleoplanet69529.yuku.com/reply/200885#reply-200885
I really liked the bow, so I was kinda upset. make the limbs wide and flat, it feels a little weak in tension, so rounding the belly a bit won't be too bad.
68" ntn, narrow handle, will give drawweights up to 70# I think, but not much more.

Nick
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 14, 2009, 04:56:19 pm
Nice bow nick, what kind of alder?
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: nickf on February 15, 2009, 06:47:45 am
thanks, it's common alder
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 16, 2009, 08:03:55 am
Was hoping to get the nocks cut and start tillering it yesterday but never quite got around to it :o
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: OldBow on February 16, 2009, 12:16:34 pm
Stone Carver
That is one fine bow. I've tried alder  (A. sinuata) ...it is extremely common around here. Failed though but maybe I didn't let it cure enough.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 22, 2009, 10:39:52 am
Put the tag alder stave on the form to remove some twist and added a few inches of reflex.
Doubt if it will hold any of it but who knows eh.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: sailordad on February 22, 2009, 10:48:34 am
    Dana,
thats really starting to look like a bow,keep it coming cant wait for the finished product.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Timo on February 22, 2009, 11:37:16 am
Taken pics of wood bow gives one good reason to sweep the porch, not just because the Misses said too ?Eh Dana? :)

Curiously watching.
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: El Destructo on February 22, 2009, 11:41:10 am
                   I remember dat Porch....but whats dat white stuff....It werent there da last time I was......... ::)

                       If anyone can make a Bow from Tag Alder....it's a Yooper.....dats da State Shrub....... >:D
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 22, 2009, 11:55:38 am
Thanks guys, this tag alder seems pretty brittle.

Mike we had spring and summer 2 weeks ago its winter again :'(
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: AKAPK on February 24, 2009, 04:08:11 am
You did, It I believe it. :)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: venisonburger on February 27, 2009, 02:26:36 pm
You're getting there Dana, I finally brought my hemlock log home from camp and got it debarked, now I just need to split it and see what happens, you're post of the sumac bow and now this thread inspired me to try something that people say isn't good bow wood and see if it's true.
VB
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 27, 2009, 02:36:36 pm
Good luck VB, if nothing else its a good way to pass time when the snow is Knee High on a giraffe ;)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: bambule on February 27, 2009, 03:34:36 pm
WOW, if this works, a new bow wood is coming along. We have tons of Alder here on the creeks - really tons...
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 27, 2009, 06:18:31 pm
Bambule apparently some types of alder make decent bows but tag alder may not be one of them ;)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Blacktail on February 28, 2009, 12:19:44 am
hey dana,do you think sinew backing would help any...i dont think i have ever seen one sinew backed..john
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: El Destructo on February 28, 2009, 01:37:23 am
I would say that a Sinew Backing would severely overpower the Wood....and cause fatal problems with Belly Wood Chrysals.... JMO
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Blacktail on February 28, 2009, 02:01:56 am
oh really....i thought that might help a little....glad to know that....see what i know ???...thanks john
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on February 28, 2009, 07:17:18 am
I think mike is right on tag alder don't know about your western alder, send me a stave and I'll try it :)

I really should back this one with silk as I believe its weak in tension, but that would take all da fun out of it ;)
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Dane on February 28, 2009, 09:05:15 am
Dana, you know what they say about hitting your head with a hammer - it feels so good when you stop. :)

Best of luck with this bow. It looks great so far.

Dane
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: dragonman on February 28, 2009, 10:45:49 am
good luck with it , I really hope it holds , up
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: DanaM on March 02, 2009, 07:34:12 am
Well its over snapped her last night :'(
Will see about getting a few pics up later today
Title: Re: Ya Gotta Be Crazy - Tag Alder
Post by: Timo on March 02, 2009, 08:23:01 am
Bummer,I used to hate breaking bows,don't bother me much anymore,I need kindling for the stove.:)

Trying new woods and pushing the envelope causes the bowyer to have troubles at times,but staying stale in the craft is much worse I think.I applaud your efforts.