Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Primitive Skills => Topic started by: riarcher on February 04, 2010, 01:17:56 pm
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Mostly all home made.
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d103/riarcher/Bess/PICT0001.jpg)
The ball pouch lower right was earlier on, bag on lower left was later. Was learning as I went.
Can't tell you how many horns I went thru before I was happy.
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Good looking kit you`ve assembled there. What caliber or guage is the thunder stick?
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Nice stuff! I to am interested in the rifle.Lets here about it.
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Flintlocks and primitive bows go together well.
I just finished this Beck rifle, 54cal Rice barrel, deluxe Chambers Siler lock, White Lightening liner, scratch build from a block of wood and a pile of parts. Shoots through the same hole at 50yds and goes off like a percussion gun. From start to finish it took me almost three years to complete the gun, bowmaking got in the way.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v181/ekrewson/hunting%20stuff/098pointandbeck.jpg)
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Nice stuff! I'm working on a shooting bag and day horn for my flintlock right now, but it won't look nearly as good as yours.
Eric, SWEET! How about some close-ups of that carving? I want to build me one one of these days. It would probably take me ten years, though. Rice and Chambers are right here in my neck of the woods.
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Very nice stuff guys. I killed my first deer(and second) with a 50cal T/C Hawkins my wife gave me for Christmas over 30 years ago. Haven't shot it since. In those days everyone told me to put up that smoke pole and get a real gun...today they say the same about my stick bows. ::) I guess I'm just a man ahead of his times! ;)
I have been reconsidering going back to black powder. I like the simplicity of it's difficulty. ::)
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sweet combo! went squirrel hunting wed. with my new .32 cal. flint and had a ball. shoot eight times and hit one squirrel. shot at one four times and another three, both lived through the experience. i would love to make one from scratch, but i have too many irons in the fire as it is.
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No carving on my rifle. I was once a serious duck decoy carver, really good at it. Too many years of working osage staves have rendered my once artistic hands to somewhat arthritic, club like appendages. They no longer take commands like they once did.
I am sure I can work out a technique to carve rifle socks in the future but for this gun I found my attempts were not up to my standards. It is easy to turn $700 in parts into a $300 gun with sloppy work so I went with stock moldings instead of carvings this time.
I have two more planned (this was my first), next will be a flintlock 12ga turkey gun followed by a slim flint squirrel rifle.
If any of you want to jump in and give longrifle building a try there are options available for every skill level from a scratch build like mine to guns in the white (assembled but no finish on the stock or metal)
For a scratch build you can count on at least 200-300+ hours to complete or at least a year of off and on work. As you learn what you are doing the process will get faster but you really have to go slow on your first one.
Here is what I started with, I drew the pattern on the orange card stock.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v181/ekrewson/beck%20rifle/Beckparts.jpg)
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Good looking kit you`ve assembled there. What caliber or guage is the thunder stick?
Sorry, got carried away with my researchs on this site and forgot all about this post. ;)
Rifle - is a "Second Land, Brown Bess Musket". The barrel has been "Browned" in the old (horse urine) way instead of being "left in the white" (White was British solder's way, browned was what happened after the Colonials shot the Britts and confiscated. ;))
Bore is 0.751 dia. / 11 ga. / .75 cal depending on how you figure it.
It's my "main squeze" in gun hunting.
Use 80-110 gr 2Fg black powder for the home spun .715 RB
Also utilize between 60 and 80 gr. with shot.
The Bambi pelt in the photo was taken with this. I've also taken pheasant, squerrel, duck and goose with it so far. (no wabbits! :'()
Foul hunting is on reserve now days because my Bismuth supply has dwindled and it's expensive if not near impossible to get.
It's close range for sure shooting. The only goose I got was (shamefully) a wounded runaway fom some poor shooting shotgunner. Ducks were from jump shooting in these Yankee swamps (where I do most of my hunting)
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Eric-
"It is easy to turn $700 in parts into a $300 gun ..."
A lot easier for some of us than others! I can without trying! ;)
I'd rather a fowl smelling(?) Flinter / capper than a in-line!
Surprising how things / times changed.
Back in the 70's R.I. did not have a hunting season for front stuffers. I worked with a lot of others here to get a season going.
Now with the in-lines,,, DEM is again scrutinizing their wisdom (whizdome?) of allowing a Black Powder season. Seems the Inline guys are making things difficult by poor hunting practices. They practice with their 30-06's until opening day, then drag out the In-lines with their smokeless, sabots and such. Not the way it was intended. No devotion, familiarity, or clue, and it makes for bad publicity with wounded game and what-not.
Again, only takes a few to ruin it for everyone. :-\
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Here's some more musket stuff. All the smooth bores shoot a .615 ball. The top is an English Fowler I traded for a Browning 12 auto in around 1982. It was built by an englishman, Kit Ravenshire. The bottom canoe gun is a cutdown Navy Arms Charleville and the pistol is a NA Charleville also. I built all the bags, horns and stuff.
The rifles are a matched set .25 and a .50 southern mountain Bean family style with all handforged iron hardware built by Dave Motto for me as a trade for some $ and me doing all the chores on Dave's farm for two weeks. Learned I didn't want to be a farmer. I made all the horns, bags, etc. The round balls are a .615 and a .25. I have owned these guns for damn near thirtyfive years and all of them have made meat.
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Love all you home spun stuff ! Really fond of those Mt rifles. I have a barrel on order right now for one of such.Got my wood already and having a custom lock made. My buddys got some great patterns so really looking forward to it.
Here's a few pics of my last build. 54 cal plains rifle. I made all the furniture for this one, and Hot bleached it. Also made the percussion lock into a flint. Not the best job on the lock, but she throws a great spark!
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Fine work, you know your stuff. Lewis and Clark carried a 1803 Harpers Ferry 50 cal half stock flintlock. Your build looks like the transition rifle, half stock for horseback, a forerunner of the Hawken.
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:o WOWed with some really nice stuff here! ;D
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These weapons are all very inspiring. I have to get back to building the NW Trade Gun kit I got late last year. No pics yet, but I will post once i build her. I'm also going to get a medieval handgonne, which should be a lot of fun, plus easy to clean. Cleaning these things is never fun.
Dane
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Dane, cleaning is very simple.
one part 91% alcohol
one part perioxide
one part murphys oil soap
Mix it all together.
I just plug my touch hole and pour some down the barrel,let it set for about 15 mins, slosh it back and forth a few times,pour it out. Run a few patches to finish up. make sure it's dry then a light oil patch. nuthin toit!
Always store my rifles barrel down, keeps any access oils from running into the breech area.
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Awesome stuff guys. Flintlock hunting is my favorite way to go along with longbow, i dont hunt any other way. My dad took a button buck this year with the flintlock i hunt with and i missed two doe but took a fat squirrel, i alos killed a groundhog a few summers ago with it too.
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Nice recipe. I'll have to try it.
I never said difficult, only not fun. It is anyway when you are exhasted from a long day shooting. But that is the price of shooting these weapons.
Dane
Dane, cleaning is very simple.
one part 91% alcohol
one part perioxide
one part murphys oil soap
Mix it all together.
I just plug my touch hole and pour some down the barrel,let it set for about 15 mins, slosh it back and forth a few times,pour it out. Run a few patches to finish up. make sure it's dry then a light oil patch. nuthin toit!
Always store my rifles barrel down, keeps any access oils from running into the breech area.
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Timo,
How long can you let that cleanig solution soak?
Swamp
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Fine work, you know your stuff. Lewis and Clark carried a 1803 Harpers Ferry 50 cal half stock flintlock. Your build looks like the transition rifle, half stock for horseback, a forerunner of the Hawken.
I am looking for the documentation, but recently I read that the 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifles were delivered about 4 months after the Corps of Discovery shipped out.
The gun they carried that really gets my interest piqued is the air rifle. They were able to get multiple shots off before pumping up the reservoir. Coooool.
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bout 15mins swamp bow
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Thanks. I'm guessing the peroxide will start etching after a while?
Swamp
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Not real sure. I just followed the directions from a 35 plus year muzz vet. I figure ifin he says it's fine, then I rekon I ain't gonna argue with him. ;D
I figure the peroxide boils all the foulings loose, the soap cleans and the alcohol dries?
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Makes sense to me. I was just curious, because I could see getting home well after dark because the critter you shot didn't know it was just supposed to fall over nice and convenient like. Then after spending 2-3 more hours processing not being real keen on cleaning out a gun right then and there. Perhaps wanting to let it soak over night would cross ones mind. But, truth be known, I suspect that when a firearm that took that much time to make is involved, the is no "too tired to clean". I'll be the first to tell you I don't know squat about BP, but I want to change that. Thanks.
BTW "It's been working good enough for 35 yrs." is a darned good reason in my book! ;)
Swamp
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Peroxide will cause rapid rusting of your barrel if left too long. It will boil the crud out of your barrel but can pit it as well if used alone.
If you come in tired and don't want to do the whole cleaning job, a patch with black powder solvent, a couple of dry patches and an oily patch will keep your barrel in good shape until you have time to do some serious cleaning.
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Thanks
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we use just plain soap water and keep the touch hole end with the breech plug out and run a few patches through. then we take the barrel out and run dry patches through it then dry the whole barrel in and out with an air compressor. then hit the inside and out with gun oil.
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J.W. , those air guns got quite a bit of meat for them. It was also the gun that Napoleon feared the most. Some of them had a ball type air reservoir, and some had the reservoir in the stock. One design had it so you just unscrew the stock, and then stick the pointed rod, into a tree, and start pumping. Even though they were air guns, they still had a lock on the side, to make them look like normal guns. They were so superbly made, that some have held air for more than five years, with no appreciable air loss! :o That is precision craftmanship! ;) Wish it was like that today. I have seen some of them at gun shows, and they are marvels of engineering, and craftsmanship. 8)
Wayne
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Fine work, you know your stuff. Lewis and Clark carried a 1803 Harpers Ferry 50 cal half stock flintlock. Your build looks like the transition rifle, half stock for horseback, a forerunner of the Hawken.
I am looking for the documentation, but recently I read that the 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifles were delivered about 4 months after the Corps of Discovery shipped out.
The gun they carried that really gets my interest piqued is the air rifle. They were able to get multiple shots off before pumping up the reservoir. Coooool.
For anything muzzleloading I'd like to recommend here:
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/index.php?
There is tons of info on the smoke poles and it's the equiv. of PA to ML.
No matter what you're looking for, someone will gladly point the way.
A friend of mine that I've lost contact with was really into the L&C thing. Made a few rifles to copy also.
Just be thick skinned when posting there. Not everyone agrees and gets along, but, they don't bite new comers,,,,, too often. :D
Gary
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Oh, and for years and years, I used a 50:50 mix of Windex and 409/Fantastic for cleaning and "spit patch".
Some agree, some don't,,, but I never use a petroleum product in the bore.
I use my homemade patch lube. It's a mix of bees wax and olive oil. Mixed so the consistancy is like warm margrine. (better than Borebutter, which is good too. Just not as good. ;))
I seems to help a lot with the "first round flyer". - For hunting, that's important to me.
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For anything muzzleloading I'd like to recommend here:
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/index.php?
There is tons of info on the smoke poles and it's the equiv. of PA to ML.
No matter what you're looking for, someone will gladly point the way.
A friend of mine that I've lost contact with was really into the L&C thing. Made a few rifles to copy also.
Just be thick skinned when posting there. Not everyone agrees and gets along, but, they don't bite new comers,,,,, too often. :D
Gary
Cool, I just took a quick look. Book marked it. I did see the American Politics section and just shuddered. I think I'll stay out of that one if I want to keep my sanity. ;D Thanks
Swamp
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HA! Got it!
Guy's name is Richard,, goes by the handle "Swampy" on that site I mentioned.
Has a online site (not sellin anything) where he has pic's of the "Contract Rifle" that he built using what records he could find on L&C. (http://www.nimrodsplace.com/lewisandclark1.html)
I'm cetain he could help with any info you'd like.
Tell him Gary (riarcher) sent ya!. ;)
He&* of a nice guy. (just like me ;D ;))
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Fine work, you know your stuff. Lewis and Clark carried a 1803 Harpers Ferry 50 cal half stock flintlock. Your build looks like the transition rifle, half stock for horseback, a forerunner of the Hawken.
I am looking for the documentation, but recently I read that the 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifles were delivered about 4 months after the Corps of Discovery shipped out.
The gun they carried that really gets my interest piqued is the air rifle. They were able to get multiple shots off before pumping up the reservoir. Coooool.
I'll dig out my three volume set of Coue's edition of Lewis and Clarks journals and see if I remember right about the rifles. If I remember right they got the first rifles out of the armory. Coulter and Drewer were the chief hunters and the only critter they had trouble with was grizzly or "white"bears. Drewer was a Frenchman and Drewer is his Americanized name.
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I looked into your question about the 1803 Model 1 Harpers Ferry rifle in The History of the Lewis and Clark Expedition edited by Elliott Coues 1893. The rifles they carried were definitely made by the Harpers Ferry arsenal in 1803 as were their tomahawks. The arms were budgeted at $81. The arsenal started making them in May 1803 and Lewis was still at Harpers Ferry waiting on his metal ribbed boat till the 8th of July. The U S Army expedition didn't leave St Louis area until May 1804. All the guns were the same because the journals describe the ease of changing out the locks and tumblers so they were issue weapons. Thomas Jefferson pretty much gave the expedition a big letter of credit and I can't imagine Jefferson sending them on their way without state of the art weapons. I haven't reread all three volumes but every time I pick up one I page through the finest American hunting story ever told. The indians were impressed with the air gun.
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Fine work, you know your stuff. Lewis and Clark carried a 1803 Harpers Ferry 50 cal half stock flintlock. Your build looks like the transition rifle, half stock for horseback, a forerunner of the Hawken.
I am looking for the documentation, but recently I read that the 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifles were delivered about 4 months after the Corps of Discovery shipped out.
The gun they carried that really gets my interest piqued is the air rifle. They were able to get multiple shots off before pumping up the reservoir. Coooool.
I just found out something. I was in Asheville NC today and as my custom I went to a used book store to brouse around. I found a book titled Lewis and Clark Across the Divide by the Missouri Historical Society and Smithsonian Books. The book is a companion catalog of items carried in the Lewis and Clark expedition collected from several museums. The large nice book was $8 so I bought it and as soon as I got home I looked up weapons.It seems as if my assumptions about the party carrying Harpers Ferry 1803 half stocks is wrong. The book states that time time frame is wrong for the HF 1803's to be used. It seems that the party got fifteen Model 1792's that were stored at the HF arsenal and had them fitted with new locks. They also had duplicate locks made to carry along with the reconditioned rifles. The Model 1792's were originally made by private gunmakers on contract with the US government.
All this fits with my previous research, guns from HF and same locks and parts. Ya learn something new every day. Sure glad you brought this to my attention JW.
By the way the book has all kinds of other way cool info about the LC party including published photos of original journals and lists of trade goods and such.
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If you really want a great read, pick up a copy of "Undaunted Courage" by Steven Ambrose. His research of the Lewis and Clark expedition is second to none. His book will keep your interest from the first to the last page, hard to put down.
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If you really want a great read, pick up a copy of "Undaunted Courage" by Steven Ambrose. His research of the Lewis and Clark expedition is second to none. His book will keep your interest from the first to the last page, hard to put down.
Just read it a couple weeks ago-really good book.