Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Jim Hamm on March 09, 2007, 09:49:14 am
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We've begun work on a new Traditional Bowyer's Bible volume, which will be called TBB Epilogue, to be released summer 2008. Below is a table of contents. As always, your feedback is welcome.
Jim
TABLE OF CONTENTS
Foreword Paul Comstock
The Bowmaker’s Bar Tim Baker
Wood Properties Tim Baker
Bowmaking 101 Jim Hamm
Your First Three Wooden Bows Tim Baker
Copper Age Bow Tom Mills
Bows by the Numbers Steve Gardner
Character Bows Jim Welch
Turtle Bow Jim Hamm
Flight Bows Steve Gardner
Design and Performance Revisited Tim Baker
Short Bows Jim Welch
War Bows Jaroslav Petrina
Heat Treating Bow Wood Marc St. Louis
Lessons From Target Archery Jim Hamm
Arrows of the World Mickey Lotz
Ishi’s Archery Tackle Steve Allely
Bulls on a Stick Jim Hamm
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Jim, Sign me up for a first addition with autographs from all the authors. Thanks Jim and gang. I can hardly wait for it to come out! Glad to see some of our own PA family contributing. Pat
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Well, it's about time! :D
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Jim, Sign me up for a first addition with autographs from all the authors. Thanks Jim and gang. I can hardly wait for it to come out! Glad to see some of our own PA family contributing. Pat
Pat we always knew we were in the presence of greatness. Now the rest of the bow world will know. I cant wait to get a copy either. Justin
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I'm with Pat,I will be looking forward to it.
Pappy
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Can't wait, I'm with Pat would love to have a signed edition as well. Keenan
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Outstanding! Looking forward to it. Jawge
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Been too long. How do I get on that list? I'll prbably need to get a whole new set. my others are very worn. They're still my number one reading material.... Chris
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Looks good, especially glad to see Marc is getting his heat-treating technique in hard-bound print. But who are all them other guys? hehe
Let us know when we can pre-order. I assume this will be available through Horsefeathersranch?
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I got the first 3 dirrectly from Jim at Bois d'Arc Press. Pat
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Wow, that would be great! My first three are starting to look lonely, all tattered and dog eared. ;D
My wife got me mine almost as soon as they came out, also from Bois d'Arc,, I'll always cherish them!
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Sounds good to me. First three are excellent books.
DanaM
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looking thru the contents again,,, turtle bow?? curious,,, ???
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That's great! Hurry, I want one right now ;D
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Sweet! 8)
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Very nice!
Maybe you could print colour photos in the book. It's ok if the price is a bit higher due to this. And make it thicker ;)
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Sound's good Jim. How about a very thorough chapter on the English Longbow? Strunk's chapter is more about the American Yew Longbow so I don't think a chapter on the English Longbow would be redundant. I can't wait to preorder my copy. Let us know when we can give you our money.
J. D. Duff
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Jim, this is exciting, although it will be tough to wait for it to come out! The article on the Copper Age bow is what caught my eye. I wish there had been a chapter on Middle Eastern archery or other composite bows, maybe even the generic "horse bow" term. Ancient Roman and Greek archery is an interest of mine, as well. Heck, any ancient bow of any origin.
JD, there does look to be a chapter on the War Bow, and isn't that current shorthand for the English bow of war?
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PS Thanks for including a piece on target shooting. Being able to hit a target is always nice, :)
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I can't wait. And I too would like a signed 1st addition. If thats not possable I collect advance readers copies of books ( i get them from a friend who works at a bookstore) my latest being Norman Mailer's latest novel.
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It must sound like a silly request to some people Dane. But I get asked questions all the time about the English Longbow and the Vol. 1-3 just make passing references. The English Longbow is of paramount importance to understanding the history of bowyery, especially within the Golden Age of Archery in America. The English Longbow was so influential to our way of thinking that people didn't believe you could make fast shooting bows out of white woods until very recently in the American bow building tradition.
I think a chapter that cleared up peoples' understanding of 'the English design,' as it is casually (and sometimes wrongly) referred to, and the specific differences between Victorian and War Bow designs would be very helpful to bowyers who desire authentic replication.
I'm pretty convinced that most people believe that the ELB is a more simple design than it is. The process for tillering an authentic replica is more rigorous than just about any other design and I think the Bowyer's Bibles have the clout to set people's understandings straight, and allow a continuation of that noble tradition.
J. D. Duff
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Josh, Have you considered writing a chapter? Pat
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I think, JD, the very most interesting thing about the Bow of War (I like that way of putting it) the English build and used so very well at that period of history is not the design or how it is made, but rather, that it was such a cost-effective way to equip thousands of archers for various unpleasantries with England's enemies. Form follows function? I also think that it may have been the very first foreshadowing to today's totally industrial warfare. Superior firepower often determines outcomes of battles, campaigns, or entire conflicts, though not always. Numbers and superior resources usually win the day in the end.
Also, the plight of the common bowman is not really talked about much. As important as he was in winning those key battles, the bowman was not thought of very highly in the military chain of command in Medieval times, was he? Kind of like today's grunts - you can't win a war without the man on the ground with a rifle, even today.
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GREAT !! Can't wait
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same here. that table of content looks very promissing. particularly the design and performance part. i must have read that chapter in the first volume a hundred times.
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put me on the list!
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Me too! Can I also get my copy autographed? But I'm confused on the last section for Bulls on a stick? whats that?
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Cant wait, gonna have to buy em all. Been gettin mine from the library....Brian
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:)
Thats good news. Eeyup, I think Marc will add alot to the development of wood bows and their makin'.
Can't wait for a copy.
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Thanks for the kind and insightful comments. To address some specific questions:
Turtle Bow
At the first Mojam, which initially came about as a way to publicly test bow designs and wood types, I sponsored a tongue-in-cheek challenge for who could make the slowest bow, dubbed the Turtle Bow Contest. So this chapter is about that contest and the first Mojam.
War Bows
Excellent points J.D. We hope to address the English warbow more fully with this chapter, as well as other bows used in warfare throughout history. Not just the battles, which have been written about many times, but the underlying issues of why a particular type of bow was made a certain way. More the "why" than the "when". The heavy-weight English warbows and the Asiatic composite could hardly be more different, yet each was used to dominate their enemies for centuries. We intend to cover a wide range of bows used in battle around the world throughout history.
Bulls on a Stick
The previous volumes have all ended with a hunting-related chapter, a gentle focus for all of the preceeding bowmaking information. This one is about a New Mexico elk hunt with selfbows.
I'm sure any of the contributing authors will be happy to sign copies when they're available. A teenager once asked me to sign his TBB Vol 1. He handed me a dog-eared, glue-smeared, grimy copy of the book with no dust jacket, a ripped cover, and tattered pages. I told him I was honored to sign a book which had seen so much use.....
Jim
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Well thats exciting!
Jim, on another note. Are you also planning a 3rd volume of The encyclopedia of native american bows and arrows that includes the west coast bows?
SJM
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very cool. its great to see so many of the newer geniuses being involved. very interested especially like that you put in the abo work of tom mills. maybe i can also read badgers stuff and finally understand it. lol
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Remember to correct previous mistakes about Holmegaard bow and tiller, because people unfortunately some people still refer to them.
Preferrably get Dennis La Varenne to extend his very good article about tiller
http://www.fiarc.org/public/Forum/Data/jeval/2005102714414_Tillering%20the%20Holmegaard%20Bow-2.pdf
to contain measurements as well as some extra information about set etc...
And how about just calling it TBB IV, since eventually there will be need for part V. (and VI etc...)
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Cool! Don't forget a glossary.
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Index too. I wear out volume III just looking up stuff in the index. Just in case my first message wan't clear. Put me on the list. Signed would be outstanding.... Chris
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Can you get the book made out of Carbon fiber? I keep wearing out the books from all the leafing through them.
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That's great. I would also like a copy signed by the great masters of this wonderful art. I still read and reread many of the articles and it's amazing how the old light bulb lights up with each "new" discovery that seems to be present when I reread. Looking forward to the new material.
Eliseo
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Of course not carbon fiber, but wood. ;)
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I am quite pleased to be a part of this project. I am also quite pleased to see the names of others that I have had the pleasure to exchange ideas with, such as Steve, Jaroslav and others.
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Mark, I feel I grew up with you guys, it will be a pleasure working with you and Juraslav likewise. Steve
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Can't wait
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I too am pleased to be a part of this works. For those who don't know me because I haven't been active on this site, my nickname is the Ferret and I have been active on the old Leatherwall, followed by the Tradgang and the Bowyers Journal sites and have a website dedicated to traditional/primitive archery (ferretsarcherywebpage.com). I have written quite a bit for Primitive Archer magazine and the Bowyers Journal. I made up the arrows for the original bow testing at Mojam and learned there that I can make a pretty average bow ha ha. I know many of the other authors on TBBE either personally or from those other sites and there are others I don't know such as Jaroslav, Tom or Steve..at least by those names. Look forward to working with each and every member of the team putting this together and I'll try not to dissapoint with my chapter. If you have any ideas or things you think should be covered in the arrows chapter, feel free to email me at huntinsticks@fuse.net
Mickey Lotz
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Mickey, i have hear a lot about you, I go by badger on line, really looking forward to your chapter, I hope we can communicate a bit behind the scenes as well, I enjoy your writing. Steve Gardner
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Nice to see you here Mickey
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I use to think I made a fair bow but after finding the bow sites, especially P.A., I realized I wasn't as good of a bowyer as I thought I was.I have learned a lot from you people. I am looking forward to learning more! I wish I could post pictures and diagrams of a few of my jigs but I am ignorant of things tech related and hate to ask others to post them for me.I am an avid resder of the P.A.forum and look forward,every day, to reading this forum.I can hardly wait to add the new book too my collection. Thanks to all here!
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Matt
I don't mind posting things for you but please reduce the size of the pics down to less than 200 kb, which is the maximum PA allows anyway
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Marc, I apologise for the imposition I put you through. A friend took the pictures for me. If I had only known the trouble it was going to cause you I would not have sent them. I owe you one friend!
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Hi Jim and the rest of you. I dont post often, but I read here a lot, and now have TBB 1/2/3, plus a full set of PA back issues. So, I have a lot of reading to catch up on. But please make sure there's a few copies of the next volume sent over to my side of the pond to keep us Brits up to speed ;)
By the way, I agree with one of the others, in that I think the new book should be called TBB IV, rather than Epilogue. I'm sure there so much more I can learn yet, and so much more that needs to be written down for people like me, and posterity.
Best wishes for the success of the next volume!
Bob [Shooting Primitve Class in the NFAS]
Company of Sixty Field Archers, Surrey, UK.
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Mickey, just wanted to tell you thanks for the web page. I spent a lot of time looking through your stuff yaers ago and still check in off and on. It has always been well done and very helpful. I look forward to your chapter... Chris
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Can't wait for it to come out.Congratulations to the new contributors.Now I can say,"I know those guys" ;)
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Wow...count me in for an autographed copy too. I can't wait to read it. Wish I had a dime for every time I've read the others. Like others, my library includes all the other Bibles, plus the full set of PA, TBM, IA, and L&R. Can you tell I like to read?
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...Wow Jimmy..........didn't know folks in gorgia could read :D.....well 'dang liv 'an lern' :P.....bob
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Wow, guys I'm proud to know yall. I have learned alot from reading yall's stuff. Mark has helped me out on several things. I really respect what he says about the craft. I too would like a autographed copy of the Book that would be some kind of keep sake. Good luck and keep coming up with ideas.Chuck
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Why shoot Bob.....I'z can read and do rithmetic just as good as yourin's can ::) .....it's these dang shoes that's killin me ;D
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Yeah, The Bowyers Bible IV sounds better.!...never say never ;D ;D
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I was just about to suggest that a new book be published. Bowyers must think alike! I look forward to it very much.
I would suggest that different techniques be covered that haven't been covered in the past volumes. For example, a lot of information is floating around on this discussion board with some great ideas that are not found in the previous books.
1) There has been a lot of posts on making shafts for arrows (check out JD Duff's - very informative).
2) Also, I would like to suggest more information on obtaining materials (for those of us who do not have ready access to the woods). The 'making bows from boards chapter in volume 2 has a lot of good information, but there is hardly any hardware stores in my area that actually handle any of the woods mentioned. Maybe you could include a "Building a Bow on a Budget" or "Archery Tackle on a Budget" chapter.
3) Somebody else mentioned more pictures, not just illustrations; please do consider making that a priority as well, especially for the more technical material.
All the chapters you've already included look very interesting! How am I going to wait until 2008! :-)
Best Wishes,
woody
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THat's awesome! I can't wait to read it. I talked to Steve Allely bout a week ago and he told me that a 4th bible was in the works. I think it will be well received and maybe even a 5th one could be written in the future. There is so much new information that keeps coming out about wooden bows that I think you could have an ongoing series of bowyer's bibles.
YAY!!!
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Already put up my "Huzzahs, and HURRAYS!!!""", and now looking in retrospect:
Please do not call it the epilogue, or commpendium or anything along those lines....
At most:
Traditional Bowyers Bible Vol. IV - Reinventing the Wheel.... or whatnot...
But nothing less than:
Traditional Bowyers Bible Vol. IV.
There will be old, new, and the old made new again within it.....
....and ANYONE who thinks there will be no progressive revelations coming to light over the next twenty years on technology long past is kidding themselves.
.........and it's really hard to then follow up with book four, when everyone will call the previous bood "Four" anyway...
Keith AKA Milo
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Milo, very well said. I think this is what we are all doing here. standing on one anothers shoulders always reaching for something higher.
Per comments on the english bows and the asiatic bows, maybe we can talk Jim into sponsoring cpmplete books on these bows in the future. Steve
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Look how far wood bows have come since the first 3 volumns came out. In another few years, some of their info will be obsolete(some, I believe already is) and new theories and observations will be proven. I can only imagine the amount of work that goes into a book, much less a series of books like this but, especially with the amount of interest these books stirred up and the amount of folks pushing the envelope with regard to building and experimenting with wood bows, a complete volume could be written every few years.
I remember when the first TBB came out, I was amazed at what could be done with a simple piece of osage, yew, and a few other "proper" bow woods. Now, look at our own BOM. We now have bows that would blow some of those origional bows and theories out of the water.
I am very happy to see this new edition coming out but it isn't an epilogue as far as I am concerned...maybe for the origional authors but with the interest these great books have stirred up, others will and should grab the batton and continue the race to thje perfect wood bow...even though we all know there is no such thing as a perfect wood bow. Pat
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...so thanks to Jim, Paul, Tim and to all of other contributers to our world of real traditional and primitive archery but it ain't over yet...we've got a long way to go, and after all, it is the journey that is important. I am looking forward to a new generation as I continue to appreciate these origional, modern contributors. Thanks guys for "passing it on"! Pat
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Would love to see a comprehensive section on vine maple by John Strunk. ;D
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After talking it over, we've decided you guys are right, we'll officially call this one simply TBB 4.
We've also added a chapter on laminated all wood bows by Mike Westvang.
Thanks for the positive feedback.
Jim
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COOOLLLL!!!! I am totaly drooling. I am looking forward to the section on laminated bows. Will he be going into two laminations and more? What woods work best for what? Can you all write faster so I can get the copy into my greedy little hands by tomarrow? ;D
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Jim and contributors,
My sincere "thank you" for introducing us to the world of wood bowyery and keeping the age old tradition alive. Because of your series and commitment to educate, I and many others have developed a passion to pursue this simple, yet fulfilling craft. I only hope that the series continues well beyond our time and can only imagine my son or grandson someday picking up my worn set of Bowyers Bibles and feeling the same enjoyment. Looking forward to reading this new edition!
Thanks, Jason
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Jason: Several of us have had similar satisfying thoughts: That some day in the distant future a young man will be exploring the family attic and come across old and tattered TBBs, become suddenly transported into this primitive realm, shortly to begin roaming nearby wood for straight trunks or limbs. Tim
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Tim, and Jim, if it wasn't for the two of you, and your compadres who created the Bowyer's Bibles and blazed so many trails, I would never have discovered the joys and frustrations of this ancient art and craft. Thanks, and I will always be grateful.
Dane
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I have but two passions in life (well, that arent my family).....flintlocks and primitive archery (but there is hardly anything "primitive" about a well finished wood bow!).
When I here that the masters are coming out with a new Bible.....I starting saving ye pennies!
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I was really surprised and honored to be asked to contribute my small bit to this volume! Like many of you out there, I learned to make bows from these guys and from reading these books. So it's incredibly cool to be asked to be a part of this - especially me...just some dope who's got a crazy affliction for prehistoric technology, and one too many hobbies for his own good!
So double thanks! As I've said before, it should be illegal to have so much fun!
Tom
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Well said Dane....My sentiments exactly......
Thanks Tim, Jim and all the other's. I can't wait till the next one comes out
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Great, I need all the help I can get :)
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This is amusing. You guys remind me of my kids waiting for the new Harry Potter book to come out. Oh wait, I guess I'm included in that you guys statement. Justin
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To Jim Hamm======Would like a copy of the new Bowyers Bible. When, Where and how much...Crookedbow (charles wendt)
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Hey Charlie, You found us. Welcome back. Pat
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Fantastic, add me to the list of requests for a signed copy,
David
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That sounds great. I liked the "tips and tricks" and "favorite tools of the authors" sections of the originals. I have also seen a lot of tips and tools posted here, as well as other places online. Would it be possible to include something like this, possibly "jigs and things", or something similar? If not, no sweat, it will still be the best book of '08 as far as I am concerned. Thanks, SOM
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wow a Traditional Bowyers Bible 4! i am pumped! honestly i dont think a week goes by that i go without picking up and looking through the bibles. seems like i always find exactly what i am looking for and more! If you guys(authors) would sign a limited amount of coppies for us that would seriously be my favorite book of all! without you guys writing the series i would never be doing what i love and enjoy doing now. a huge thanks for #1-3 and now #4! you guys are awesome! -jesse
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Steve Allely is going to be in this one right? If so tell him we need to have the dimensions on the modoc bows in this issue. Man I have been looking for that info everywhere and its tough to find. Also, more on west coast bows. There have got to be a ton more tricks to making these style bows thant there seems. Also, composite arrows from the west coast and how to make them. And, and ...and a cherrie on top would not hurt either!!! ;D
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I would like to have a signed copy also. I have all previous books and love them.
I am also one of the first subscribers to Primitive Archer. Even donated money to get the mag. started.
I have every copy and will protect them with my life.
Have a great holiday all. ;D
B.D.
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Could Someone PLEASE Tell me When and Where I can Get a Copy of this NEW BOOK??? I WANT ONE!!!<-------------Learned that from my son. ;D
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Hallo,
i'am new here at this board and will buy me the part 4 of the bible.
Unfortunately I come from Germany and must wait for the translation.
Is there the possibility to let autographed the book of the authors?
Sorry for my bad english :(
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That wasn't bad at all Yeoman....much better than my German. ;D
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Im not sure if this will be read by the authors but if so I would love a signed copy. having lived in Africa I would be interested in a section on African bows and construction techniques. I know There is only so much room in your book and this was already covered somewhat in tbb3. Wishfull thinking thanks Jesse
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Since so many of our copies are tattered and worn, maybe the publisher will consider a limited run of signed four-book collector's sets? Maybe snake skin bindings with sinew stitching? Include a free Condor feather for a bookmark? >:D
For what it's worth, I too would like to see more information about West Coast bows. Especially the Pacific Northwest bows.
Keith
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I wonder if there will be any info on bows of the Mississippian peoples or maybe any new info from the many historical digs around the country.
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Jim:
Hearing about a new edition to the Bowyer's Bible is thrilling. But please don't call it "Epilogue" because that might mean it really is the last one. Just call it #4 and keeping with tradition put four arrows over the cover bow. That way there can be a #5 and then a #6 and then.....
A.L. Gaitanson
South Texas
PS: How about something on making bows from hickory tool handles for those of us in the cactus and mesquite country who can't find hickory boards anywhere. And then how about a bow made from mesquite and also TX ebony.....