Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: D. Tiller on July 14, 2006, 04:30:05 pm
-
Ok, I just glued on my fletches but want to spiral fletch them also since I always seem to have my fletching come up eventually. I know you have to wrap the shaft at the front of the feathers and tie off somehow. But how does one continue up through the fletches spiraling from the wrap up to the base of the feather and finaly tie off?
Thanks for the help!
-
I nip the feathers for about an 1/8 in at the rear. II start the wrap there (tie it off with a couple of 1/2 hitches) winding through all 3 trying to keep the intervals the same. Finish the bottom with a couple off half hitches too. Be sure you've skived the leading edge of the feathers. Jawge
-
Rod, you sent me a pic once of yourself at full draw with a very neatly spiral fletched arrow at the nock. If you still have it, maybe you could post that for a good visual. It had white fletching. Todd
-
Not sure which one you mean Todd. The neatest one I have a picture of is a Standard Arrow by Carol Edwards. She is neater than me at spiral binding, which is not surprising since she is a professional fletcher, but mine are more durable because I use a less breakable thread.
Rod.
[attachment deleted by admin]
-
Great pic. That is some neat work. Todd
-
Ok now I need to know what type and thickness of thread I should be using. Help! The ones I'm trying to do right now are not coming out right.
-
A thin fly tying silk if you can get it, is the right thckness. The thicker the thread the more likely it is to keep the fletches open.
Rod.
-
Get you some artificial sinew and pull the strands apart to get a small diameter piece.Works like a charm!:)
-
Thanks guys I will give it a go!
-
As a fly tyer as well as a bowyer type, I have tons of different threads. I also make fly rods and they too have their own unique thread types for wrapping the guides to the rod etc... I have used different threads such as flat waxed, Kevlar, monobond etc...and even wire! What I've found is that after a few dozen rounds of shots, they all either frayed of broke outright. My next step in remedy was to use 'hard as nails' acrylic and coat the thread wraps...what a mess and there were still issues. I have also used fly rod thread wrap epoxy...worked okay but on a missed shot I damaged a fletch and you can imagine what a mess it was trying to get the fletch, thread and epoxy off...yeah, time for Mr. 40 grit sand belt...not pretty. My last attempt was using Dacron B-50 bow string material...now that worked but was too 'clumpy' and I didn't like the 'heavy' look of the stuff. In my most recent attempt, I remember how I've marveled at the strength and toughness of sinew, so I used it to wrap my last three arrows. I dyed the sinew purple and love the look of them. I shot the arrows a bunch last night (even the the sinew hasn't completely cured) and they are holding great! I hope this is the key and will let you know how they do. Cheers, Primitive1.
-
I wouldn't use real sinew on account of it being too hard to come by over here. I had a big roll of synthetic sinew for ages that I bought from Tandy out of curiosity and could not find a use for it.
This stuff seems to be made up of 3 threads and so will split easily into thirds, but not any finer, leastways not easily or cleanly.
Rod.
-
There must be a secret knot that arrow makers used in the past to keep the thread from comming undone. I tried the half hitch and I had the same problem as primitive1 did. I also remember there was a methog of puttin a loop down on the dowel and wrapping up to it then feeding the spool of thread through the loop, grabbing the loos end on the opposit side and pulling the thread under the wraps. then spiralliing up the feathers and doing something simmilar at the other end. Anyone heard of this?
-
Do it exactly the same as you would start and finish a serving. Your guess is about right, apart from including the spool in the finishing part.
Rod.
-
D-Tiller, using a loop of thread to pull the end of your serving under the serving is one way but you can make a loop at the end of your serving and serve through it,I like at least ten times around, lay the end of your thread tight againest the shaft and wind the big loop over it when all ten of the wraps have disappeared pull the end of your serving hard and you have it completed. It will not come undone but for looks, cover it with laquer or a finish of your choice, providing it is compatible with the material.
-
This is my first attempt at spiral wrapping. Used 30# artificial sinew split in half.... obviously need to find something thinner and with more of a contrasting color.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/bebloomster/100_1039.jpg)
I'm thinking maybe embroidery floss or the like. Will have to take a trip down to the local Wally World and see if there is anything looks suitable.
-
I'm having a **** of a time finding the right matierial to use for wrapping the fletch. The silk thread is not strong enough which fly tiers use. So I will look at other alternatives. The thread would keep on breaking!
D. Tiller
-
I bought silk thread from 3Rivers and use it on my arrows and other applications. It's stronger than silk sewing thread and rod wrapping thread. I like red but they have black, blue and other colors. Pat
-
i love silk also. look for Size E Gudebrod silk. ebay has a ton of it for sale at reasonable prices and so does three rivers.
-
How about this? I came across some professional fletcher's page that said he used nylon upholstery thread. I got some last night and it is a tiny bit thick but very, very strong. I'm doing a batch of 30 arrows right now so to save time I fletched with super glue (hold 30 seconds and repeat) and I'm wrapping my feathers with this nylon thread. A drop of super glue spread around with the finger at the front and back keeps the thread from unwinding.
I fletched 18 arrows with a Jo-Jan mono fletcher while watching V For Vendeta. Since I'm wrapping the feathers anyway, I like this super glue trick. I would like to go on the record for recommending super glue, nylon thread, and V For Vendeta.
J. D. Duff
-
Fletch tape works like a charm also for this.
JD, Don't get too wrapped up in the movie when working with super glue and your fingers. You might become a permanent attachment to your arrows. LOL Pat
-
Pat, I like that fletch tape but I can't walk through my kitchen anymore without a little piece of red tape sticking to me.
I once bit the tip of a super glue bottle (while sqeezing it) to dislodge the clog in the tip. It took about three hours to get the super glue off my teeth. Actually, I wonder if I ever did. Also, I stuck a bottle of super glue in my pocket and glued my pants firmly to my leg. Not a glue for the faint of heart!
J. D. Duff
-
Let this be a lessong to all those people who carry a bottle of super glue in their pants! DON"T DO IT!!!! ;D You might glue something else to yourself!!!! OOOOUUUUCCCCHHHHH!!!! :o
D. Tiller
-
Heya
the best thing I have found to wrap your fletching is nylon upholstery thread. it looks like silk and is tough as nails. I make and sell arrows for a living and this is what I use. I have had complains about every other string I have used but this stuff, it is light, strong and just plain works.
I know a place nearby that deals in re-upholstering and I can get any color I like for cheap.
-
Is upholstery thread something you might come across at a Michaels or Walmart or Garden Ridge?
-
you might but I dont know, I am in Montreal Canada and what is available in our stores is not always whats available in yours.
I suggest you find someplace in your area that deals with upholsterers. I know of a few places locally that do wholesale supplies for them. thats where I get my spools.
-
Thanks Ragi, I was using actual sinew/hide glue until I tried splitting artificial sinew and using that. It is holding up in the 'abrasion' and 'strength' factors; though I'm certainly limited in colors.
-
Ragi--did you see my post from ages ago? You may have been the professional fletcher I got the idea of using upholstery thread from. It's perfect. I can wear it out, but that takes a long time.
J. D. Duff
-
Uhh no, I just only recently discovered the PA site was unlimited again. I have not been here since they decided to make it subscribers only. do ya have the link? I would love to see stuff written about me. ;)
-
I have thought about using 6# spiderwire(dyneema) fishing line. Kinda expensive but it oughta be tough. It's really thin too. anyone ever tried that?
-
yeah it looked like plastic. just ruined the look and is hard to finish off well. better to stick with the nylon thread.
-
Ordered a roll of the 15# artificial sinew from 3 Rivers Archery thinking that it might be thin enough.... seems like it just might work.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v628/bebloomster/Feathers.jpg)
This was my first attempt..... just have to work on making the wrap spacing more even.
-
I buy nylon upholstery thread at wal-mart.
-
I get 50 pund artificiaL sinew from 3Rivers. I've found many uses for it. Including splitting it into 3 strands and wraping fletching with it. I spiral wrap from nock end to leading tip. Then add a drop of Elmers white glue, wrap a collar around the leading tip and tie off with the loop pull method. Add another drop of glue spread it evenly around then use the my thumbnail and compress the collar and wipe away excess glue. When finished the collar almost looks solid, you have to look close to see the thread wraps building it up.
-
Evil Dog,
Try putting the shaft in a vise and count the vanes of the fletch with a needle, picking them apart every 5 or 6 vanes. This is the easy way to make a close and regular spacing.
To be honest, thread strength is less important if you are going to seal the shaftment with a verdigris based varnish, as was the usual practice with the English war shaft.
Judging by the Mary Rose shafts, where you can still see the traces of embedded thread in the shaftment coating, this should render the fletch binding almost indestructible.
I guess it also helps preserve the fletches on the stored shafts, the mediaeval equivalent of putting mothballs in your arrow storing tube.
Most of all it stops or cuts down the incidence of the thread being broken when you bury a shaft in the grass, which is how most of the bindings on my unsealed shaftments got broken, sooner or later.
Rod.
-
Dave I use the thread that is used to tie fishing rod eyes on strong but not very big. tried to find your store a weed or so back didn't find ya was going to say hi. tomm
-
those are some really beautiful arrows boys. Keep up the great work.
-
One of the interesting aspects of wrapping your fletching down that hasn't been mentioned yet; feathers are unique and can have different vane 'stiffness'. I never really paid attention to this until recently when I unwrapped some arrows and noticed that although the spacing was fine between the vanes, some of the vanes were lazier than the others and had a tendency to lay down. I'm going to pay more attention to this aspect on this next round and pick feathers with similar vane stiffness; this might be more of an issue with natural Turkey feathers, though I'm not sure...