Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: aznboi3644 on March 27, 2011, 11:40:40 pm
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Say I were to go to Home Depot and buy a straight grain pine 1"x 2"x 6'. How much set should I expect for 45-50lbs at 28" this is UNbacked pine btw
I know pine is a horrible wood for bows...but I'm fascinated with the local pine we have...my last one was 72" and bending heavily too much in the handle area pulled 40lbs at 24" before it blew. So I thought what the hell I'll buy another straight grained pine board and see how much my tillering skills have improved. I'm up for a little challenge.
So far the profile is 1.5" wide all the way until about 10" from the tips and tapers to 1/4" tie on nocks. I've slightly rounded the belly to help prevent the back from breaking. I've got it tillered out to 25" so far with a small hand plane...I love this little tool for pine...shaves so nice.
Anyways I haven't weighed it yet but it feels 35-40lbs so far at 25". Any comments on tiller? arrow is 25" at the base of the point.
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/photo.jpg)
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The tiller looks good to me. The only other pine bow I've heard of was in one of the TBB books and it was like 4 inches wide and fiber backed. I believe it still failed.
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Tiller looks pretty good to me, but why not spend a couple more dollars and get a good piece of oak, maple, or if your lucky some menards stores have hickory boards just as cheap.
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looks good
a friend of mine once said it would take a 15 foot pine bow to get 50 lbs @ 28" with out getting to much set
but he might have exaggerated a little !!
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I have enough straight grained oak boards I have collected to make 12-15 bows.
I am doing this just because a lot of people say it can't be done...if it blows it blows. Its fun though. Its just easy to tiller pine with a small hand plane...its so soft.
But this pine feels soft and springy with thick growth rings.
So far it has less than 1" of set.
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Your tiller looks good. The outer portion of the top limb looks a bit stiff. Good for you trying something so uncommon. That is the spirit that has gotten wood bow archery where it is since before the TBB series came out. Tim Baker an the gang made hundreds of bows using every wood they could find. Since then a lot of what they came up with has been disputed by guys(and gals) that wanted to push the envelope even faether. Consider yourself a pioneer in todays archery. ;)
Some of the early Scandinavian bowyers made bows from compression wood of conifers so you are not too far off.
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like patb said, i often wander how well a cedar board would work. if you could find one without knots.
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I think your bow looks good for where its at and agree with Pat the top limb is stiffer than the bottom. It doesnt surprise me that a straight not free pine can do that. The Scots made cheap ELBs from Scotch Pine. instead of Yew because it was more plentiful.
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aznboi, that looks good. I really hope it works out. I think I have a soft spot in my bowyer heart for inferior wood, seems like all wood should get the chance to be made into a bow ;)
I've often wondered about making a bow out of Southern Yellow Pine (longleaf). My house is over 100 years old and all the original trim and molding is old growth southern yellow pine. You would not believe how dense the rings are and how straight the grain is!
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Looks good to me. Just wondering if you followed a growth ring on top or is it quarter sawn so you see edge rings the length of the bow. I'm thinking a quarter sawn may have a better chance. I've thought about trying pine but figured it would fail. It has less follow than a hickory I am making. Well done!
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thanks guys...It feels like it is gonna hold out to 28". Only a few more to go.
This bow is being made from a riff sawn board. only 3-4 rings on the whole bow.
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Whew...finally found some sandpaper. Had an extra sheet in my car. Seems like the sandpaper fairy stole my stash of sandpaper from the bow closet. Oh well.
Did some more work on the outer limbs last night with the hand plane and sand paper...I rounded the belly more mid limb out. Got it pulling nicely out to 26". Not sure of the weight...feels 40-45lbs. ONLY TWO MORE inches to go woot woot!! Hell maybe this bow may make it to 30".
So far I see no chrysals. I remember my last try had chrysals around the area where it broke. I am so surprised by this pine. It feels a lot more elastic and springy than maple and red oak. The feel of drawing this bow is sooo smooth and stackless.
Set right now is sitting right at 1.25". Only tillering left is on the outer 1/3" of the limbs.
Sorry I don't have pictures yet but my sister has the camera.
Question. How much set SHOULD I expect? I think I'll be happy with 1.5-2" of set with this bow.
This is making be want to go out and get some more pine boards.
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Very Cool! If that itch to go get pine boards gets fulffilled, look for more rings per inch. Softwoods like that are gonna be the opposite of what you'd look for in elm, oak etc. where thicker rings is good!
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ahh so finer rings...I just chose this board for the thick rings...thought they were good like on oak and what not. Thanks.
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update....no pictures yet sorry.
But I've tillered it out to 28" and put a couple dozen shots through it. It has very little handshock. lost my sandpaper so I just used my small hand plane and rounded a little more here and there.
I got the bend out pretty close to the tips so the whole bow is working. It feels between 40-45lb. I'm happy with it. What surprises me the most is the set that it has after tillering and a couple dozen shots.
string follow right after unbracing is 1 7/8" on the top limb and 1 3/8" on the bottom limb.
Cast is not bad at all...just about the same as my 57" hickory 45lb@26 bow...
I haven't shot past 10 yards but it shoots just where I look and the draw from this bow is the smoothest stackless bow I have made. The draw could not be any sweeter.
I have to get a scale soon and plot out an F/d curve.
I'll get pics up as soon as I can.
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what do you think if i could use a stave of good quality pine for a longbow? i have 80 acres in Massachusetts with probably thousands of pines
noel
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Looking forward to seeing your pics!! Been following this thread and sounds like you gotta nice bow outta the pine! I've always heard it couldn't be done or it'd have to be 4 inches wide! Good job!
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fish,
I don't see why a stave wouldn't work. If you have probably have thousands of pines I'd search for compression pine staves for backed bows. This pine is actually not that dense at all...pretty light and soft. I'm sure you could find some suiteable pine staves. It's very easy to work.
acutus,
thanks...I gotta put a handle wrap on this thing before I take any pics.
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I keep expecting to check this thread and find the "aw crap" post, but it hasn't happened! Cheers, mate!
And even if it turns out to be short lived, you are getting tillering experience and design experience for a lot less than an osage stave would cost you!
I can get radiata pine here locally...growth rings up to 3/4 inch thick! Might have to buy some of this stuff and try a pine longbow, too! No guts, no glory.
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I know pine bows have been built before so im not surprised. Souther yellow pine actually has a nice balance of tension and compression strength. Im sure it would make a fine bow, probably be fast too because its so light.
Jason
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Finished out low 40s I think...haven't weighed it yet. I'll do that tomorrow.
Here she is braced at my fistmele which is right at 5.5" Shoots well at that.
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/P4010334.jpg)
What the tips and nocks look like. I am lazy and used some old tie on nocks I made out of broken arrow shafts.
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/P4010333.jpg)
Set right after unbracing on bottom limb
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/P4010331.jpg)
Top limb set.
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/P4010330.jpg)
And for the grand finally the full draw at 28".
(http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p67/aznboi3644/Bows/P4010329.jpg)
I'll try and get some better full draw shots tomorrow afternoon.
I still gotta put a backing on this...the wood is really soft. I was thinking of doing a paper backing. Linen may be too heavy. As for a finish I'm sealing it in bacon fat cured over a small fire. And a handle wrap is to come later next week.
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Most interesting and a good job. Markus.
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awesome thread :) i would love to try a pine bow, I live in Ontario, Canada where the growing season is short and the conifers have super fine rings. the softwood lumber from this area is known for its strength, i would think that would transfer to bowmaking.
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Pine can be incredibly elastic, given the right thickness. It looks like you've figured out what that is. That's a nice looking bow, and it's good cheap tillering practice.
I've always wondered how hemlock (Tsuga Canadensis, not the poisonous weed) would do, If I remember correctly, the specific gravity is only about 0.45, but it was truly evil wood to frame with. My dad would have it sawn into rough framing lumber and barn boards, saving our rare spruce and fir for planed finish boards. Compared to lumberyard framing, it was heavy, stiff, and difficult to drive nails into.
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Nice bow and nice tiller. That is an accomplishment with pine. It is very soft and not very good for compression. Be sure to watch for chrysalls on the belly. If there is the slightest tillering flaw it will show up as chrysalls on pine. However with the long length and great tiller you will probably be fine
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thanks for the compliments guys...it was really fun making this bow.
tried my hardest to perfect the tiller cuz my last one chrysaled pretty easily...but surprisingly there are no chrysals.