Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: gstoneberg on July 06, 2011, 02:51:39 pm
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This must be yew month. Most of you know I make osage bows and have for many years. Interestingly I have received 2 beautiful yew staves in the last couple weeks. Who'd a thunk I'd ever get to try yew??? Both are quite short, around 58". One is dead straight,
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5272/5907258962_9ffb289d30_z.jpg)
the other...not so much.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2792/5863115956_0d74d0394a_z.jpg)
I need to make an elk bow and I'm thinking a short recurve might be just the ticket. I thought it might be wiser to start with the straight stave, looked at the growth rings, and they didn't look any worse than the osage I also worked last night.
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6012/5907261552_a56760bb41_z.jpg)
So, I tried chasing one.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5152/5906704591_68f5d66872_z.jpg)
It sort-of works, except there's no difference in the feel of the wood moving from one ring to the next. Be a bugger to go down several rings as the color change is about the only indicator. Maybe it isn't necessary, I never hear anybody talk about chasing yew rings? I figured I'd have to bend through the handle to get 27" of draw and am hoping for 60+lbs. I'll likely need some pointers from the yew experts.
George
PS. Compared to osage, the draw knife goes through this stuff like butter. Much easier on the hands. ;)
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Well George, If anyone can straighten that stave out, it's you. ;D
Guess I gotta be nicer to the yew fairy.
I'd go for a ELB with the straight stave but then again I am partial to elb's.
I have a Welchman elb I take hog hunting in the South Ga swamps.
Can't wait to see more pics
Thanks
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May I ask why your chasing a ring on yew? Is it cause your crazy and still in Osage mode? :laugh: Or does the sapwood need thinned? It looks a little thick in your pics.
I rouged one of my many new yew staves down to early floor tiller and just scraped away the bark and cambium to get the back of my stave. And yes its a joy to work with. My favorite so far to work with. Cuts like butter. And purdy too.
It also looks to be low density yew by the size of your rings. Bigger than mine even. You know the yew experts will set ya straight. Keep us updated
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Yep, it's both. :) The sapwood is about a half inch thick, figured since I needed to thin it I'd see if I could chase a ring. I only did it for about a foot. I was so hot by then the lure of the pool was just too strong to fight.
I never have put much stock in wood density or ring counts. I just build bows with whatever I find. Course, I've not had yew before. I surely need all the help I can get.
George
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dont bother chasin yew ring but keep 1/4 sap on thaT SUCKER THATS URBACKIN BRO SEE THE POSTS KENNAN JUST PUT UP ON YEW DEMISONS BROCK
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"What is your draw length? 1/4 sap is perfect. Leave the sap wood on and feather in any rough spots on the back then shoot for about 1.5" wide at the fade for your finished bow. About 1 3/8" mid limb and then taper the last 12" to about 1/2" at the tips. Thickness about 3/4" at the fades tapering gradually towards the tips. Leave the last 12" about 1/2" thick. I would do the rest in the handle wrap apposed to a cut in shelf."
That is what Kennan said in my post hope it helps.
so with yew sap wood the rings can be violated?
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Hey Blackhawk, don't you spoil the man's fun ::), if he wants to chase that ring that's part of the fun ;).
He's just wallowing in the feel of that smooth silky sapwood mmmmm.
Del
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That is true too Del. But if he likes cutting into the silky smooth too much he might end up with a toothpick :laugh:
Yeah. Im falling in love with yew :-*
Im gonna go grab another one here this eve and rough another one down,cus i enjoyed the first sooooo much. I might be turning into a yew snob :laugh:
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Yeah. Im falling in love with yew :-*
Aw shucks, you say the sweetest things ::)
Del
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Really looking forward to this I really enjoy your build allongs!!!!!! I want to see you work that crooked one or are you working the straight one? Either way look forward to this! Thanks!
Josh
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Well thank you Josh, that was kind of you to say. I have mixed emotions about which stave to work first. I actually started working the crooked one and then the straight one arrived. I assumed the straight one would be easier, but who knows. Here's what the crooked one looks like right now.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5120/5883760081_66d6f8ce05_z.jpg)
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6003/5884325420_c20f99afae_z.jpg)
This one is clearer, not a knot in it, but one limb doesn't have much heartwood. And, of course, it needs straightened. The other one is straight, has a few knots and plenty of heartwood. In the words of Marvin the Martian..."Decisions, decisions..."
George
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How bout we take a poll and vote. I say crooked one first.
I got another one of mine roughed down tonight. Man this stuff is quick to rough out and work with. :) you should have her done in no time. :laugh:
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Are you roughing out staves, or bows? I need a picture. ;D
George
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Start with the crooked one first George.
Just don't use the "Space Modulator"....Marvin might get upset :laugh:
You do such a good job on your buildalongs. I really appreciate your efforts.
Thanks.
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Good luck ...I vote for the one that looks like a bow already lol! :o
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Really for me either stave will be enjoyable to watch you tackle and the reason I said the crooked one is not to see you fail but after seeing you take that crooked thing you made your trade bow out of it amazed me at what you could get out of such a ugly twisted bent up narly piece of wood, im sure Yew could do the same with this one. ;D
Josh
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That crooked one is cleaning up nicely :D, it says smooth wide flatish eliptical cross section limb to me.
Del
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Alright twist my arm George. Here ya go. You asked. First test piece is 61" long and down to a nice even early floor tiller. It was my smallest dia branch,not even two inches. 25 RPI
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2011-07-04_21-07-29_112.jpg)
Second test subject is 72 1/2" long. I got this one just roughed down to barely bending. I might even her up a lil more. Ran out of time last night. 35 RPI. It has a small one inch reflexed kink right at the handle.
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/2011-07-07_05-24-18_774.jpg)
And yes I shellacked those backs. Id rather have a couple dry pieces sooner than later to know what the wood can take and do.
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Nice Blackhawk, I like them both. I love to see natural reflex. Thanks. How long are you going to be able to let those season before you have to get after them? Not sure I could wait all that long. ;)
Del, have you done a recurve with yew? I can't remember and I was wondering how well the tips would hold their shape if I heat bent some nice recurves? When I think of wide limbs I automatically think recurves, or at least flipped tips. Too bad I have plans at the lease this weekend, I could get lots of good work done on it. I'm game to try the crooked one first.
George
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George i'll post some pictures of the bow from that sister stave that i'm working on. Mine is a bend in the handle recurve. Going for 27" draw around 50 pounds
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Good question. And yes its gonna be a tough wait when I've had severe yew envy for a year now.
Over the next couple weeks or so ill take more wood off,and after that when there more stabilized ill put em up in the rafters where its in the 80's with 50%RH and a fan blowing for a couple months,and by then they should be about ripe. Oh and the first one has almost 3" natural reflex with some small roller coaster ups n downs.
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I've not done a recurve as such but I've done plenty of bending and a little tip flipping, steam or dry heat works fine. I think dry heat can also be used to temper at the same time it the tips need stiffening up.
This one's about the nearest thing I've done to a recurve, it's about 59"ntn, tips flipped with steam. (I think it was only 36#)
(http://i411.photobucket.com/albums/pp195/Del_the_Cat/Website%20stills/testshots.jpg)
Here it is at 28" draw.
(http://i411.photobucket.com/albums/pp195/Del_the_Cat/Website%20stills/Finaltiller.jpg)
It was a skinny stave with V little heart wood so I had to work down from the back following a ring in the sapwood. I had to build up the handle with an offcut of Yew, I put a leather piece in between to take any movement as it may have had some flex in the handle.
Del
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Hey Tom, I am anxious to see your pics. Thanks again for the stave. I need a little more draw weight from mine to go after elk. Hope I can do it.
Thanks Del, that's a nice bow. Love the ELB look all your bows have. Mine is likely to be more flatbow looking, but I'll try to be more oval on the limb shape. Now I'm anxious to get going, but I have a prior engagement with the piggies this weekend. :D
Blackhawk, my garage attic is likely in the 150 degree range now. The weatherman said this morning that the predicted cloud cover today would hold the temps down to 103 or so. :o I can't imagine what Nate is getting over in Arizona these days...
Back to work.
George
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George make sure to heat treat. The 3 yew bows that I have made are all heat treated and I find it increases performance significantly.
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Nice looking Wood Sir!
Man, after reading Bow Nut's Yew thread and now yours George think I'm gonna have to track down a stave or two...
Though I might have seen a yew tree on the HCC campus... >:D
-Gus
PS. Just kidding... ::)
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Well, I was so pumped to work the yew that I blew off packing for the lease and hit the shop. The bow is beginning to bend a bit. It seems to have very dark sapwood. It's almost as if the wood can't decide whether to be heartwood or sapwood? Del caught that the first time he saw the pictures. I could have followed a growth ring for sure. My camera did not capture the contrast between the darker belly and lighter back. Here are pictures. The back:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5078/5914358054_4028f2ec87_z.jpg)
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5071/5914360192_28ba17771b_z.jpg)
And here's the belly and a side view:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5316/5913798493_8611830b95_z.jpg)
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5313/5913799993_edaf212b87_z.jpg)
I need to get a better floor tiller bend and then I'll straighten it. I may cut some nocks and put a long string on it so I can reduce the handle some before bending. That pin knot is one of only 2 or 3 on the stave, unbelievably clear.
Interestingly, while the draw knife goes through the wood like butter, my scraper does nothing. Odd.
George
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Good progress looking good :D
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You could always go for a boomerang instead...don't have to bother with a pesky string then ::)
Del
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That sapwood does look interesting. I guess it's the compression wood. As far as I'm concerned It doesn't affect the performance.
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I hear ya gstoneberg I was working on mine last night and like you said the draw knife when through it like butter btu the scraper just slid across it like a I was trying to scrape a piece of glass and I had just sharpened it to. humm looks like files wrasps and sand paper on this build.
Matt
Oh and good luck on your hunt I hope you bring home the bacon! :o
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That should be a breeze to straighten. Dry heat and Crisco shortening. Yew heat bends very well, Just make sure to go a touch past where you want to end up.
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Thanks Keenan, I'm such a yew novice I need all the help I can get. I will give that a try.
George
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As Keenan says, but IMO it doesn't need much overbend compared with other woods I've used, just a few% rather than 10%
Del
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I hear ya gstoneberg I was working on mine last night and like you said the draw knife when through it like butter btu the scraper just slid across it like a I was trying to scrape a piece of glass and I had just sharpened it to. humm looks like files wrasps and sand paper on this build.
Matt
Oh and good luck on your hunt I hope you bring home the bacon! :o
My scraper didnt work on yew either but then i ran my angle grinder over it and it works fine now
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OK thanks guys. Sounds like it bends like osage. I should be OK, but time'll tell.
George
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Took a shot at straightening my yew bow. First attempt didn't quite get the tips lined up, but got most of it. Since the handle is straight, I bent it again further out in the far limb. That is cooling out in the shop as I type. Here's bend #1:
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6005/5938920404_300234bc7e_z.jpg)
Hopefully I bent it enough this time.
George
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looking good. I love yew. Just have made one bow from it so far as I live on the other side of the world from where it grows.
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Thanks, and I'm glad it's sometimes planted as an ornamental or I wouldn't have this one. Sadly, I pulled the weight off the first handle bend too early and some of the bend in the center came back overnight. Bummer. 3 heatings and it's still not straight. ???
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6002/5939939692_8c68ba67c0_z.jpg)
I'll get it tonight. It would be easier to bend if I went further and got it closer to its final shape, but I like to remove the oily and discolored wood from the bending process in my tillering. Do I have to let yew rehydrate the way I do osage after a heating? One thing I don't like about yew is how soft it is. I can clamp osage in the vise with abandon and a couple scraper swipes cleans up the marks. This stuff can really crush, I'm having to use my vise protectors all the time. Very pretty wood though, that little bit of oil really brings out the grain.
George
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I rarely use a spokeshave but yew and ERC have worked well with a spokeshave for me. I also used a bowyers edge when working with yew.
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Clamp her down and set her out in that hot Texas sun. That'll set her straight :laugh:
What a stubborn mule. You'll have that as ya know. Come on George. Show her who's boss. You got this. ;)
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I rarely use a spokeshave but yew and ERC have worked well with a spokeshave for me. I also used a bowyers edge when working with yew.
Drat, I just traded away my bowyers edge a few months ago. I do have an old spokeshave somewhere if I can find it. You can see my shop is not the epitome of cleanliness and order. :D
Clamp her down and set her out in that hot Texas sun. That'll set her straight :laugh:
No way BH, I don't want to kill her...just train her a little. ;) The next bend will be centered in the handle, it'll cool over night, and she'll be straight! Then the fun can begin.
George
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That stave is looking good George. Now I have the courage to go and try to heat fix my stave. What poundage are you shooting for?
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I'm trying for 60lbs Tom. I don't use a caul, and it took me 4 heatings to get it. I had to go a little further past straight than I do with osage. Somebody said that earlier and they were right. It would have worked with 1 heating had I pulled it further past where I wanted it. There would have been some character in each limb and that would have been fine. I guess a benefit to 4 heatings is that it is now dead straight.
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6001/5942269855_c19ce535a5_z.jpg)
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6011/5942828688_288e86a808_z.jpg)
There's bad news though. One time it slipped out of the vise when I was bending it and the back of the bow got damaged where it hit the screw on the vise. I'm going to have to go down at least a ring on the back or narrow the bow a bit to get it out. I wonder if I could just have a more rounded back than I had planned? I had decrowned the back, but maybe I should just follow the curve a little more? Any of you yew guys (I've been wanting to say that :D) have any advice for me?
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6142/5942829134_e75087be0f_z.jpg)
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6024/5942829612_777238817a_z.jpg)
Thanks,
George
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I had a saw cut in the back of a yew bow once and I just wrapped it with sinew and it was fine
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I decided I had enough depth and took another growth ring off the back. Then I decided I had enough width and narrowed the limb enough to remove the rest of that goof. I cut some nocks and put a long string on it. Like all reflexed bows, it wants to turn upside down on the tillering setup. But, since it was reflexed only in one limb, I didn't like the look of the bend. So, I gave it yet another heating and now it's pretty even. The near limb in the picture is the naturally reflexed limb, the far one is the one I bent. I'll work on another bow or do some knapping and give this one a rest now.
Edit: I was wrong, that kink in the near limb is where I added the reflex. The far limb has the natural reflex.
George
(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6149/5943982702_fe352f07b5_z.jpg)
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WOW that turned out great george! Very well done! look forward to more updates :D
Josh
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Looking Good Sir,
Have some Yew on the way from BC...
Man the Bow Bug bites Hard.
-gus
If I don't start finishing some bows soon my wife is gonna make me build a dog house outa bow staves... ::)
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And put you in it....?? O:)
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Yes Sir...
gus, in the dog house... again...
Sounds like a Bluegrass song. ;D
-gus
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Looks like you're taming that bit of wood nicely George :laugh:Once you've got it shooting arrows, you'll have to see if you can make it ' go fetch' too!
Del