Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Primitive Skills => Topic started by: JW_Halverson on August 30, 2012, 06:00:14 pm
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Little Jack Horner
Sat in his corner
Tired of working on wood.
Grabbed a chunk of horn
As sure as you're born
Made something almost as good.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/022.jpg)
Measure circumference and divide by 8. Measure and mark. Draw lines to determine boundaries where you will remove material.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/019.jpg)
Have already thinned the horn behind the area that will become the octagon.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/023.jpg)
Dremel with sanding drum removes material quickly, but you need to have a steady hand to keep from dipping too deep. Do every other panel in the octagon, flattening between the lines.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/024.jpg)
Roughed in and ready to go after it with a scraper. A sharp knife blade works well, but I found out that the card scrapers that cabinet makers use are a significant improvement. The original "horners" used scrapers for most of their material removal once they were past using the rasps and files.
I think the tip is still too wide and too short, so I am planning on adding on material to extend it out further. To contrast with the black of the horn I would love to do the tip with ivory, but there are no season for elephants in South Dakota. I might have to look for some elk antler tip material to finish that part of the job.
I'm thinking walnut to plug the fat end. I like working with walnut even if the dust really makes me sneeze.
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fun and even educational. That scraper trick was new to me! THX
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Looking Very Nice Sir!!!
Have you considered Mammoth Ivory?
I know they had The Big Hairys up that a way...
Or maybe you could get your hands on some Walrus Oosik... >:D
-gus
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That's nice, can't wait to see it finished. Gotta dial my Flinter in. I'm going to have to start writing down my loads for each gun. I forget each year.
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Looking good there johnboy. So this is the one Eddie was telling me about? Hurry up man, Oh yea, everything in slow Mo in the greatplains of SD, I forgot for a min. >:D
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Yeah, real slo-mo now. I broke off the drill bit while putting in the pilot hole for the tip. I used a fine tip on the dremel tool to excavate around it but still could not back out the bit. I ended up sawing off most of the tip and boring it out just under half an inch.
Now I have to figure out what I am going to do for a new tip on the end. I'd love to do a Carolina style lathe turned tip, but I'm not set up for doing that. Thinking of taking leather disks saturated with ultra thin superglue and making a stacked tip! Will have to do some experimenting.
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Yea boy that is going to be nice,got to see it when it is done.
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Here's where I left off.
I had just fitted quarter inch thick pine plug into the wide end of the horn. Once installed, I hogged out the center.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/001.jpg)
I cut a matching slab of walnut and sanded it perfectly flat. Here I am test-fitting.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/002.jpg)
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The walnut cap also gets hollowed out to match where I cut out the center of the plug fitted into the horn. I do this to add storage capacity to the powderhorn. The ring now installed inside the horn provides surface area to epoxy the walnut cap onto the horn.
I used to do one piece caps, but it was really tedious getting perfect fits and avoiding any gaps.
Ok, now for the photos of the screwed up tip. Here you see the broken off drill bit where I was putting in the pilot hole.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/003.jpg)
Here's the tip after sawing it off:
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/004.jpg)
The plan is to deepen the groove that seperates the octagon section from the disc at the end of the tip of the horn. I am going to shape the disc to round the edges off to create a "ring". Then I will drill out the end to about half an inch, until it is bored out into the main cavity of the powderhorn. I intend to find a piece of white horn or something else to use to elongate the tip of the horn. It will then be tapered and shaped to finish out the horn. As it is, right now the horn is too wide to be useful for pouring powder into a measure or muzzle.
I kicked around the idea of using stacked leather soaked in superglue, but I think that's going to look just plain ugly as sin.
Are there any wood turners that have access to artificial bone/ivory? I know people that turn pen blanks use something like this. Anyone?
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Cool post
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Im guessing deer horn would be too porous?!?
Scott
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Yup, deer horn was considered and I went thru my stash of racks, horns, tips, beams, tines, etc and didn't find anything that had too much porous core material. I then went into the vault for my special stuff and went thru the elk tines I had been saving and they are too porous also.
I'm too bummed at how I screwed it up to even search online for material to finish the job, so it goes in the box of "ghost projects" and gets put on a high shelf on the wall of shame for now.
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Little Jack Horner sat in a corner, eating his Christmas pie, when he stuck in his thumb, and pulled out a made in china sticker....... :P ::)
Ok,ok,ok, back to the problem at hand. Multiple solutions...... go on line, and look up knife making materials, and go to the handles, and you can find all kinds, or bone, artificial ivory, various types of exotic woods, laminates, etc. You can get slabs, blocks, and rounds. Also packa wood comes in rounds, and slabs. It is basically laminated wood. As for lamination's, What about laminating slabs of bone, and turning, or filing it to the shape you want? Also for your plug piece, Dixie Arms sells plugs, and finials for tying your thong, or strap to, The leather string thong, and leather or cloth shoulder strap! Just thought I would clarify that, before you put the wrong material on your....."Horn" ::) :P also, they have the ones that screw into the plug, with an escutcheon ring, which makes it easier to fill your horn. There is a little depression where the finial sits. They come in brass, and wood. Also, you can use the bone, for decorations, on your plug, by cutting out, little wedge shapes, and inlaying them around the edge of the horn, or any shape you want. Check out craft sites, especially carving sites, and look for Taugua nuts, or ivory nuts. They were once used for buttons, and are very white, and will yellow like ivory with age. I have a little mouse netske' I carved years ago, and it is now yellow like older ivory. They vary in size. Just do a search, and you can find the material. Cool off a couple of days, and then get back to it. Never thought about dividing the circumference by "8" to get the flats. D'uh! Like I have said before math ain't on the good side of my brain. Whatever side that may be... ::)
As for scraping, when I was a kid, some friends of mine and I would go down to the butcher shop, and watch them butcher the cows, and get the horns, and bury them in ant piles, and then shake out the bone core, and pour boiling water down the horns, to sterilize them, and then we would start scraping and filing them. When we got all the scale off, and down to nice horn, we would soak the horn in water, and use a piece of broken glass jar, or something of that order, and the scraping went like a charm. We were able to get them down to where you could see through them, and then we would cut off the tips, and drill out the end, and bevel the holes, and make signaling horns out of them. Then we would get bored, with that, and go see how far we could dig a tunnel in the side of a canal bank before it caved in on us, and take turns digging each other out. ::) If we stayed too close to the house, we would have to mow the lawn, or some other form of dangerous work. :P
But I hope that will help you out some. Hey, if you get some time off, and feel like driving for two days, come on up to Thompson Falls, and we can work on that horn, or a bottle of Crown Royal Black, or some Cruzan rum, or just about any other stuff I have in my cabinets. Or, I can show you the Merriams we have around here. They are usually in huge flocks. But the stinking coyotes, and wolves, have thinned them out some, but still lots of them. I have them in my yard now and then. Trying to get them to be more now than then...... ;) :D ::) Seen where they have been scratching the left over deer feed, uh, I mean free range cattle feed...... ::) found two small wing feathers. Good luck with the horn.
Wayne
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Never thought about dividing the circumference by "8" to get the flats. D'uh! Like I have said before math ain't on the good side of my brain. Whatever side that may be... ::)
There are just three types of people in this world...those that are good at math and those that ain't!
Someone once asked me what side of my brain did most of my thinking. I had to figger on that one a while, but pretty soon it came to me. The inside.
And meanwhile, I was futzing around on the Track of the Wolf website looking for fixings to go with my new flintlock 29 ga and I happened to scroll thru the list of things too late to be added to their printed catalog. Lo and behold, the answer to my problem for just $7.95! It's already installed and I am liking it more and more.
Will post pics once the horn is finished. Could even be later today if all goes well.
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Little Jack Horner, sat in a corner, and got a square a--!
Sorry. :P
Yeah, I'm one of those three people. ::) Well glad you found the solution to your
problem. So ..... uh...... What do it be? You found a spout, for it?...... a dooma hicky, thinga ma bob? Well ..... what is it? aww c'mon! Show the $#@!! picture of it! ... uh please, & Thank you, etc.
Wayne
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I love it...
Guess I'm one of "Them" folks...
Many Moons ago, during one successful gun season, I took a nice ten point buck.
My Grandfather was so excited he was litterally vibrating across the ground.
"We have to go show him off in town" he says...
It was about 20F outside and the dear was dressed, so I figured what the heck, I'll let Paw Paw have his fun, so we loaded up and headed to town.
So we're down at a local feed store Paw Paw has all the local hunters and Old Timers gathered around the bed of the truck looking over my Buck.
Paw Paw is telling the story for the tenth time, I'm sipping a cup of coffee and day dreaming about the work ahead, when one nice old gentleman
asked "Son, where did you shoot him?". To which I promptly replied, "In the Neck."...
After a short pause and a quizzical look, the old man grinned at me and said, "No Son, in what part of the country were you standing when you squeezed the trigger?"... :)
-gus
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My redemption!
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture015.jpg)
The tulip shaped brass spout has a plug that seals with a rubber o-ring. Cheating, sure, but it works, too.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture016.jpg)
Then the walnut plug at the back got a brass button type tab installed. It unscrews for refilling the horn.
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture017.jpg)
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Finished product, sans strap:
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture014.jpg)
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It felt so dang good to finish this project off that I dug around and found the priming horn I had started about 6 months ago. And I finished that too!
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture023.jpg)
And if that weren't enough, I went and put the final touches on a shooting pouch I was working on! Here they are posed as a set:
(http://i365.photobucket.com/albums/oo100/JW_Halverson/Muzzleloading%20stuff/Horns/Picture024.jpg)
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Beautiful work man!! That's really impressive!
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WOW Sir!
That's A Beauty!
-gus
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Wow?
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Very nice!!! Hope to see you down here someday so I can see that stuff in person. Surely your blunderbuss would ventilate a pig??
George
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Whoo Hoo!!! :o Excellent! 8)
Thanks for posting the pictures. Now I can sleep again.
Now put little Jack Horner back in the corner, and see what else he can come
up with! ;)
" Little Jack Horner, sat in the corner of his shop, admiring his finished BP set.
He picked up his jug, and pulled the plug, which gave a pleasing pop. Then his lips he did wet! :P Proud of himself, for being a clever boy, he knew future BP hunting trips would be a joy. He ran his hand over the finished set, then again picked up his jug, and pulled the plug, with that pleasing pop, that reverberated throughout the shop, and again his lips he did wet. :P He would post the pictures, and give helpful hints. Why, even pious priests O:) would admire them between studying scriptures, and lighting incense. Ah, and rightly so the PA crowd, was pleased with his creation. The accolades were loud, and traveled throughout the nation.
So once again Jack's hand picked up the jug, and pulled the plug, with the pleasing pop, but before he could again take some sips, or even wet his lips, his ex-wife entered the shop! :o :o When the jug she did behold! :o Well thought Jack she is back to scowl, and howl, and scold, and nag and gloat! Jacks eyes cleared for a moment, to see,it wasn't anything foul, or a demon with a cowl, but it "was" bold, and chewing a polishing rag. Jack let out a happy sigh, and held the jug up high, and winked, and gave a toast to the neighbors goat!
Thanks for the build along, and the helpful hints. Now when I get back to Fla. I will have to dig out my horns, that are in various stages, of finish, and then I can finish my designs, now that I know how to do them. Thanks again for a great build along, and the pictures of a very nice BP set. Now slip back out the shop, and give that plug a pop! ;) ;D ;D
Wayne
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Gorgeous pieces JW that ought to go into a museum somewhere. Ron
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Beautifull, John! Like cracker said, they should be in a museum.
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Way to come through, jdub! I've only worked a horn one time, and that was years ago! I love the beauty and finish of your pieces. Curious, though, how will the strap look on the lower (bigger) end??
Scott
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Very, Very, NICE!! 8)
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Curious, though, how will the strap look on the lower (bigger) end??
Scott
Easy-peasy, Scott-o! Just cut a slot in the end of the leather strap and it slips thru like a button. The finish work is simply 400 grit sandpaper very lightly run over the horn in the direction of the grain followed by beeswax and a heat gun. Work it in good and hot with a bit of muslin and keep polishing until the rag doesn't drag across the horn. Same for the finish on the walnut. The leather on the bag has also had plenty of hot beeswax worked into the grain in hopes of the bag being quite weatherproof. Just never know what kinda climate they might see. >:D
Stickbender, there ain't no Mrs and ain't been one for nigh on a decade. Something about the coffee being strong enough to eat out of the cup with a fork.
Mr. Stoneberg, if I can get into range, I can ventilate a piggie. In fact, I would love the chance to put a .62 cal solid lead roundball between a piggies eyes to see if it would knock 'em silly or if it would ricochet off!
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It would knock it silly. >:D
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Man that is some fine professional quality work there. FINE!
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Ooooh, sorry. :-[ Ok, I will have to go back and revise that little ditty. ;)
I am with Eddie, it should either, knock it silly, or turn it inside out! :o :P
Wayne
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Mmmm, smoothbore smoked pork!
Just got a load of the necessities for shooting the .62 this last week. Gonna have to get out soon to take it's first ever shots. Built around 1984 and never been shot, poor thing. But I do have a Black Hills Fall Turkey tag and no shortage of birds in the area. She'll get broke in right.
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Ok, the ditty, has been revised, to correctly reflect current marital status
of Jack. ;) So to speak..... Man, that coffee, sounds like mine. I am having a nice cup, right now. I have a coffee maker, that you just push the cup up against the machine, and it fills the cup, and if you want one, or two, or more, you just put that much water in. Well it has a plastic heating reservoir, and it tastes like burnt plastic! I wish I could find one of the old stainless steel, percolators! I tried putting a coffee filter, in a wire mesh strainer, but it took for ever to drain through, and the coffee was luke warm by the time the cup was filled. So now I grind the Dunkin D roasted beans, and put what I need in a pot, and pour boiling water over it, let sit, a minute or two, and take, my espresso, filter, and pour the coffee, through that, and into the cup. ;) I still get a few grinds, but it reminds me of the hunting camp in the Big Cypress swamp, and the coffee my Dad made with the sulphur water from the well he put in. It was strong, and somewhat chewy, as the coffee got lower in the cup. ;) But it was still good, especially after a long day of riding a half track in the saw grass, or wading in the sloughs, and cypress heads.
Again that is a beautifully made set, to be proud of. Thanks again for the build along, and tips for building them. Just another item to put into the Gemini pile of things to start, and restart,........
Wayne
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Mmmm, smoothbore smoked pork!
Wish you'd have been with me last night. We'd have come home with a lot more pork.
George
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Guy's, I got to find out first hand what an artist JW is. I came home this afternoon and found a box I used to own sitting on the table.
I opened it up and couldn't believe how nice these two horns are. And I was beside myself whe I found that great looking leather bag in the box, also.
After I got through fondling everything and adjusted the straps to fit, I had to move all of my Flinchlock dodads into their new home. Then I found the red, hand stiched, little, bag inside that had a flint wallet made from some soft deer leather. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Thanks, John, you are truly a Horn Master.
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Mullet and I made a deal a long while back, he sent me a box of horns and I was to send him back a finished powderhorn. It took me plenty long. In fact, it was so long I was having nightmares of my name being written in blood in Mullet's little black book. I would wake in the middle of the night sweating .50 caliber lead balls.
Finally, I got the horn done, right about the same time that the shooting pouch and the priming horn was finished. I figured since Eddie is always doing such nice things for other people, I wanted to return the favor to him.
Enjoy the living daylights outa the set, Eddie! I figured the box the horns came in would work to go right back to ya. My Scotch great-grandmother would approve of my frugality, too!
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That box is gonna get wore out, it'll be coming back to ya. ;)
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LOL!
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Thats cool! Great end of the story!
Scott
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Dang!!! Sweating fifty caliber lead balls! :o You better get your well checked! :P
Like I have said many times before, Eddie is one lucky man! That must be one heck of a lucky star he has. My lucky star turned out to be a UFO! Sheesh! And after all that work, to not be able to initiate them in turkey warfare! Well, I am sure that Eddie will show them the woods, and the Critters that they are to supply the powder, and mojo for, to put them in the freezer! ;) So...... uh, J.W. if I were to send you a box of green mountain barrels, ....... a long box, ....... uh...... would that box come back to me with a couple of flint lock rifles in it? ::) You know, just .......you know, just sort of curious, and all...... ;)
You are a "LUCKY" man Mr. Mullet! 8) Good show J.W., Eddie has helped a lot of people, and given a lot of stuff away, including to me!
Wayne
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Last rifle kit I bought is mostly assembled, and has been in that state for 6 years. I still need to install the ramrod pipes, do the finish carving, sand/scrape it out, and lay on the stain and finish. But other than that I have taken at least 7 deer with it!
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Hmmmmm, perhaps I should just send you a box of bleached dollar bills........ ::)
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JW, That is a really nice set up. Great job on the matching horns. Plain or fancy, horn work can be most satisfying! I like to use part of the same horn for the plug though.
(http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh217/robin101st/horns/horns/DSCN0931.jpg)
Robby
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JW, Keep an eighteenth century mind set and let your imagination be your guide! Keep up the good work.
(http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh217/robin101st/horns/horns/IM000527.jpg)
Robby
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Or a ninth century mind set! ;) and toast your fellow archers when they come to call!
(http://i257.photobucket.com/albums/hh217/robin101st/horns/horns/securedownload-10.jpg)
Robby
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Holy Criminy! :o Those are gorgeous, Robby.