Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Pat B on March 31, 2013, 07:12:20 pm
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I've made a few 60" static recurves but none were sinew backed so I have been thinking about this for a good bit while waiting for the right stave to show up. Last year at the classic Clint(osage outlaw) gave me one of the staves he got from the giant osage he harvested. I was very excited when he gave it to me, not only because it was one of "the" staves but also because of this hole in it, centered from side to side. I think the stave was 72" or so.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve001_zpsd62bbeb9.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve003_zps17c387dd.jpg)
After studying this stave for a while I decided that that cool hole was a bit too close to the tip for my liking. I don't think it would have made me a good bow. This stave was cut in 2011 so it is close to being season ready for a bow, it has nice rings and it only had the one big knot and a small pin along one edge. The stave was from over 3" at one end to 2 1/4" at the other end with the flare around the knot. If you look close, just below the big knot I drew a pencil line. From the other end to that mark is 56". You'll never guess what I did next...
After getting the stave almost down to one ring I cut it off at 56", at the pencil line just below the knot. I then drew the center line and measured and marked off the bow's outline(1 3/4" most of the way out then tapering to 1" tips for now).
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve007_zps7c988fcc.jpg)
I then cut it out just outside the lines...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve006_zps4772630e.jpg)
One tip does have a little dogleg in it that I will get out when there is less wood to move. I have thinned the limbs to 3/4" to the fades. The handle is 1 1/4" deep. I will start reducung the thickness next with a farriers rasp. When I get it down to floor tiller stage I'll see about adding the recurves. Here she is now. 56"t/t with a slight natural reflex. Front profine and side profile...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve008_zps5d65a3ae.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve009_zps189c49c8.jpg)
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Ill be following this thread closely. So don't make me wait forever to see it finished >:D
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Lookin' good Pat. I sure wish that knot would have worked out for you. I'm glad to see that stave being worked. Keenan has one very similar to it ;)
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Heresy...blasphemy....how dare you chop a perfectly good full length stave with a hole in it down to 56",and removed the hole from being in the bow >:D I'm sure you thought long on that decision ;)
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I saved the hole if either you, Clint or Chris want it. ;)
I wished the knot was placed a little lower in the limb but I think this is the best use for this stave. It sure is nice and clean. 8)
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Yes Sir,
I'll be watching as well.
Thank You,
-gus
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Pat, please don't make us wait too long...I'm preeeety sure this will be a beauty.
Lyle
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Now that is going to be another master piece for sure.
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Looks like that will be a very nice piece of sage to work from here on out Pat. I know I'd be fired up about working that stave into
a bow and 56" of clean osage will make a mean hunting bow as you know.
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Here is the form I made before I chose the stave. This form has the same radius as my other recurve form(5 gal bucket) but is longer(could do 9" curves if I wanted, these will be 6"[I think]). I'll jump off that bridge when I come to it.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve-form_zps84d3f790.jpg)
Lyle, unfortunately this will be a long, drawn out affair with the sinew backing and all. I'll try to keep regular posting as I continue.
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Pat, is there any way to use that end you cut off as the center of a 3 piece take down? I think an arrow would fit through that hole. Or maybe a double splice? Chris, do you have any ideas for it?
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Clint, it is 19 1/2" long and the hole is between 9" and 10" or so. It should work fine for a handle. I'll bring it to the Classic for you.
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Small atlatl? Handle n tip overlay material? Or something to keep ya warm for about 20 mins by burning it ;D
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Sweet Jesus Pat, a good stave, sinew, recurved.....you got yerself a wild T-Rex round them parts, or you just gonna bomb the next county over? >:D
rich
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Just a little something that has been floating around my noggin for a while, Rich. You never know til you try, don't cha know. ;)
Where is that sense of adventure, Chris. ;D
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Looks like a good start,very nice looking stave. :)
Pappy
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Today I reduced the limb thickness to about 5/8". One limb had a slight crook near the tip so I straightened that out with dry heat...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve002a_zps294ddd91.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurve004a_zps83b2e9f4.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56asinewbackedstaticrecurve006_zps19663bd2.jpg)
...after that cooled a bit it was time to begin the recurving. With some adjustments to the flrm I clamped the tip to the form and coated it with oil then began heating. As I was heating and bending a few splinters began to lift so I clamped a small block of wood to hold down the splinters as I went along...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56csinewbackedstaticrecurve011_zps1eaf9766.jpg)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56bsinewbackedstaticrecurve010_zps606baab1.jpg)
I'll let her cool over night to insure this curve are set in place and bend the other one tomorrow.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56dsinewbackedstaticrecurve012_zpsc9085685.jpg)
I'll add some super glue to the splinters that lifted and sand the area smooth. If necessary I'll add a underlay to support the recurve.
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Thats a lot of recurve with dry heat :o
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You got my attention! This one could be a real beast.
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Clint, this is the way I've always done it.
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Going for a big ole ryano recurve there pat? ;) ....that big curve reminded me of some of his he used to make
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You nailed it Chris. ;) His were selfbows, weren't they. I'm too chicken for that. This one is gonna have sinew.
Haven't seen anything of Ryano lately. Wonder if he's coming to the Classic.
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Someone asked me why I bent the tips before I shaped them. This is only the initial recurve bending. There will be more to come. Once both recurves are bent and cooled I'll check the alignment visually by looking down each limb. Some more heating and tweeking might(read most probably) be in order. From here it will be after the bow is tillered enough to brace before I will really know how the tips line up and the string tracks. Sometimes this can be the most frustrating part of this process, getting everything lined up. I've left the tips wide too so some tip adjustment can be made by removing more wood from one side or the other when fashioning the final tip shape once everything lines up. Stay tuned...
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Pat: Ryan wont be making it to the classic this year..he has a little one on the way..Outbackbob will still be coming tho..
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Keep it coming sir
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I like that C clamp looking thing where do you get them and what are they called ! I sure could have used that the other day when I was putting curves on my new bow. I fought like heck with conventional C clamps on my jig ! Looking good so far I will be following this one !
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I bought that one from ACE Hardware.
This first pic is looking down the bow. You can see that the recurve is off to one side. That will be straightened at a later date.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/-osagestaticrecurve2ndcurve001_zpsec715d80.jpg)
Here is the result of yesterday's recurving...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/-osagestaticrecurve2ndcurve002_zps4cdb0d15.jpg)
Then I bent the other tip. I went a little slower with this one and didn't scorch it as badly and it splintered less. It will probably be the end of the week before I get back at it. (http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/-osagestaticrecurve2ndcurve003_zpsc369693f.jpg)
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that bow is looking good! I am sure it will come out nice.
Out of curiosity, do you have a jig that hold's your heat gun X amount of inches away from the wood? Or do you free hand the gun and bend the bow when it is pliable enough?
I am wondering because every bow i've made so far have been straight bow's, but I would really like to attempt a recurve. The only thing keeping me from it is I read in the bowyer bible that they recommend steaming the limbs- and I dont have the room right now to make a steam setup!
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Scott, I don't use a jig to hold the heat gun. I do it free hand in a small area at a time. I hold it about 2" above the wood and move it back and forth until I can feel the resistance leave the bow. Then I know it is hot enough. I do use cooking oil on the bow to help prevent scorching. Unfortunately I had to get this first tip so hot it really scorched. That scorched wood will be removed later when I shape the tips.
For your first try just reflexing the last 6" to 8" of each tip. This will give you the feel for what is going on without being too drastic.
A lot depends on the wood used. I've had good luck with osage and elm but not hickory. I think hickory need steam or boiling.
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Looks good - watching with interest!
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Love seein you work the yella wood, Pat! :)
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You mentioned that u did use oil during the bending process...curious how you plan on degreasing it before sinew?
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I tried degreasing with acetone once and the job failed. I've read oven cleaner does the job.
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Here she is out of the form. With her tips on the table she measured 5 3/8" from handle to the table.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/bothcurvesdone003_zps21df3422.jpg)
Seminole, I will wash it good with Dawn dish soap(original blue) and rinse it with boiling water. I'll do this just before I add the sinew. It worked very well for me on my last sinew backed bow.
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Dang pat that's looking good I followed your advise on the dawn rinse after using oil and had good results with sinew
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I'll have her with me at the Classic, not ready to shoot though. ;)
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I did a little more today. I chased the back ring to the next one down because it is a lot thicker ring and now I don't have to worry about the oil I used to bend the curves when I add the sinew. I will still wash the back good with Dawn and rinse with boiling water just before adding the sinew. Also I worked on lining up one of the tips. The other seems to be OK for now.
You will probably see some of the splintered and cracks where I bent the wood. They were filled with super glue and after cleaning up the belly side of the curves and heating it some to line up the tips they still seem to be sound. I will definately put on an underlay so these shouldn't be a worry after that. Here are a few pics of the tip being lined up...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/liningupthetip003_zps358a3092.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/liningupthetip003_zps358a3092.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/liningupthetip001_zpsb5548418.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/liningupthetip001_zpsb5548418.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/liningupthetip002_zpsdffc570f.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/liningupthetip002_zpsdffc570f.jpg.html)
...and this is the other limb tip. It is looking pretty good so I won't mess with it for m=now. I may need to adjust both curves later.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/liningupthetip004_zpse8fd5005.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/liningupthetip004_zpse8fd5005.jpg.html)
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looking mighty good there Pat.
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I finally got back in my shop today. I cut temporary string nocks in and checked the bend for the first time. One limb was a bit stiff so I equaled both limbs a bit and began the tillering process. Here she is resting on the tiller tree...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins004_zpsa0bd4f63.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins004_zpsa0bd4f63.jpg.html)
...after a few scrapes and about 25 pulls to exercise the limbs I checked the bend...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins002_zps1bb9f666.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins002_zps1bb9f666.jpg.html)
...then some more scraping, paying particular attention to areras that aren't bending so well, a bit more exercising and a pull just a little farther...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins003_zpse37d77d2.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins003_zpse37d77d2.jpg.html)
I can still see some stiff areas and that both limbs aren't bending together but I'm still on the long string. I need to reduce the weight quite a bit then I'll get her to low brace and check limb and tip alignment and a more accurate measurement of the weight. I'm guessing she's about 70# at the farthest pull on the long string but I won't know for sure until low brace.
Anyway, here she is at rest after the work I did today. She still sitting pretty flat.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins001_zpsac5914eb.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillerbegins001_zpsac5914eb.jpg.html)
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Geez...slow down ...take your time ;) ...lol :laugh: looking good so far pat... 8) I imagine after sinew and after final tillering you'll end up looking right where your at right now or close there too ;) should be a smooth pulling lil ripper :D
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Lordy! Lordy! Thems some serious recurves on that shorty! That is shaping up pretty sweet Pat! Josh
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Thanks guys. I was so glad to finally get back into my shop I didn't want to over do it today. Chris, this is fast for me! ;D I'm shooting for 50# to 55#@26" after sinewing and final tiller. She will bent into the handle so I can feel her give at full draw.
Matt Wirwicki suggested I get her to brace with both limbs bending evenly and together before adding the sinew so that is what I will do. I was going to tiller her all the way out first but he said by sinewing her at brace she would be less stressed and the cured out sinew would help the wood stress less as I tillered her out to full draw.
More to come...
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Oooooooooooooo, looking beautiful!.... I always love your build alongs, I always learn like 10 different things... ;D
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Thanks TMK. It felt great to get back in my shop. I'll post more pics as I progress. Stay tuned.......
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Really nice looking bow Pat, I've always wanted to do a sinew backed recurve osage. Please keep posting your progress I'm learning a bunch!
Thanks
DBar
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Looking really good there, Pat! I can't wait to see your progress on this one. I'll bet she'll be a smooth screamer. Now you've done it. I want one just like it! :-* :P :-* ;)
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It's nice to see that baby bending Pat! Keep with it and keep us posted.
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She's only possible because of you, Clint. ;)
Matt, I'm using your advise and only tillering her to brace before adding the sinew.
DBar, get to it!
I'm pleased with the initial bending so far. At this rate she'll be ready to sinew in a few more sessions. 8)
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Lookin' good. Dang, Pat, every time I'm driving home from the Classic I remember some of your creations that I was wanting to see but forgot to asked about at the Classic. Next year I'm camping by you. Or at least setting up a temporary camp ( a lounge chair) for a day until I see everything you bring with you. :laugh:
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Dave, I showed her off an awful lot at the Classic. Sorry you didn't get to see her. She'll be ready to shoot by the next Classic. ;D
Well, I did a bit more work on her today. I think she is ready for the first course of sinew. I got her to low brace...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues001_zps293a7481.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues001_zps293a7481.jpg.html)
...the string line up pretty good...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues004_zpsf44931fb.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues004_zpsf44931fb.jpg.html)
...and the tips look pretty good too. She is still braced low for these two pics...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues006_zps3c760913.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues006_zps3c760913.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues005_zpsd7aef0dd.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvetillercontinues005_zpsd7aef0dd.jpg.html)
I've pulled her to 20"(60#@20"/ she's a little shy of 80#@26" now) on the tiller tree and exercised her a bunch with each wood removal. I narrowed the tips and did an initial shaping of the handle. I wanted the handle close before adding the sinew. I'll finish shaping the handle and tips after the sinewing and the sinew has time to cure out.
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Looks good, gonna be a perfect hunting bow
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This is pulled to about 17". I can see a stiff spot about mid limb on the right(bottom) limb. I'll get that bending better before adding the sinew.
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvectillercontinues003_zpsaa1b8439.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvectillercontinues003_zpsaa1b8439.jpg.html)
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Dang Pat, that booger is looking awfully good!
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She's coming along, Cody.
Thanks Joe.
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That's going to be one sweet little bow. Thanks for keeping us posted.
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Watching this one with interest Pat.You are a long ways along already.Looks super.Your elm static I saw previously was very nice too.Liked your illustrated pictures on this one but especially liked your pictures on how you straightened your recuve tips.Patient job with the dry heat bending of em too.That bow will be a screamer.
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Thanks Ed and Dave. I'm looking forward to shooting her when all is done. She should be sweet.
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Almost looks like you could pull that one off with out the sinew Pat. She sure has some nice curves :o
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Its the quality wood, Clint! ;)
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its looking right on track to become one sweet setup. nice job Pat
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Very nice project Pat. The ability to put such an aggressive bend into a bow is very cool. Sinew is only going to add flames to the arrow as its launched >:D . You have my attention.
Tracy
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Coming along nicely, Pat! I would say she's ready for sinew. Can't wait....
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Nice job, Pat. I just caught back up on this build. I can't wait to see her finished up.
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Those were my thoughts too Matt.
Should I reduce some weight before sinewing? She is at 60#@20" now and I am shooting for
50#--55#@26" after the sinew cures.
Thanks guys. Things are gonna slow down now with the addition of the sinew but I'll post more with each step. ;)
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well, considering that your weight is 60@20 and you said 80 at 26 right? well sinew adds like 10 correct? so its going to be a beast! i would think you would want to reduce it, but ive never done a bow like this, just speculating on what ive seen and heard from others.
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Comes along very good, great work!
Can't wait to see more, esp. sinew job
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Muffin, I will reduce the weight to 55#@26" after the sinew has cured. The reason for not tillering the bow out more is to prevent as much compression stress as possible before adding the sinew.
Thanks Simon. I'm looking forward to it all too. I've thought about this bow for a long time and finally got the courage(and proper stave) to do it.
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Lookin real good Pat. Looking forward to seeing her progress.
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Pat: I would sinew it. Reduce after sinewing. You will likely start (after curing) with an even tiller which will make it easier to reduce.
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Thanks Matt.
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Now I have to clean off my upstair work table where I'll sinew the bow. At the rate I'm going that alone will take a month. ::) ;D
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Cool project Pat, anxious to see more, would a belly toasting be a benefit, keep the sinue on a short bow from over powering the belly? Good luck and am sure it will be to die for. Kenneth
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Cool project Pat, anxious to see more, would a belly toasting be a benefit, keep the sinue on a short bow from over powering the belly? Good luck and am sure it will be to die for. Kenneth
A belly toasting is not nessecary with Osage it's already incredibly strong under compression but i don't think you have anything to lose from toasting it
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Seeing that this is a Static Recurve how far down the limbs are you going with the sinew?
David
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Wow Pat really nice bow. ;)
Cipriano
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Kenneth, I have has good success belly toasting osage but I won't do it on this one. It is not necessary. Sinew stretches enough so it shouldn't crush the belly.
David, the last 6" to 7" of each limb is rigid so the sinew will come to that point. I won't add sinew to the static recurves. It is not necessary and would only add unwanted physical weight. The sinew will run from that point on one limb to that point on the other limb tip so both limbs are tied together through the handle.
Thanks Cipriano.
I started the sinewing today. The first thing I did was to score the back of the bow where the sinew is going to help it adhere better. I used a toothing plane blade for this...
Photobucket is screwing up so I'll post pics later. Sorry
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Vamonos Pat ;)
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Damn Photobucket!!! >:(
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(Using my imagination)....I'd say its looking good so far ::) is that a piece of sinew to tie it down into reflex? :laugh:
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Bow is shaping up nicely there Pat. Look forward to seeing it done.
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Chris, at about 80# now this bow is too strong to tie down with sinew so I strung it backwards with a bow string. Once I get the sinew on it and it has time to cure I'll reduce the weight to about55#@26".
I'll check Photobucket a bit later and post pics if it is working.
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Been waiting to see this bow.I can see it now though already.Son of a gun might be a leaf spring in the beginning.I guess I'm glad someone else has problems with sending these pictures.@$%^(*&)_*%$%%$@#!!!!!!!!!!
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Pat, you could email the pics to me and I could try to post them for you.
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Thanks Clint. Photobucket is still screwing up or my computer doesn't get along with Photobucket. I'll email a few to you to post.
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I'm trying to post the pics for Pat. Hopefully they work.
Pat, I tried to keep them in order. If I have them messed up let me know and I'll fix them.
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins003.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins004.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins006.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins007.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins008.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins009.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins010.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins012.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins014.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins015.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins016.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins001.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins002.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins0031.jpg)
(http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/clintanders/Photobucket%20Desktop%20-%20CLINT-HP/New%20bow%20stuff/56sinewbackedstaticrecurvesinewingbegins0041.jpg)
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Thanks Pat for sharing and thanks Clint for lending a hand in the posting of the photos.
It looks great Pat. I gotta ask, is that just one strand of sinew you're pulling out of the glue pot. It looks like you leave the sinew much larger in the processing area than I do. Maybe, I'm working too hard processing the sinew down to a large diameter thread size???
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Dave I was thinking the same thing. I take mine down to about half that size.
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Thanks Clint. That is the correct order.
Before sinewing this bow I got everything set up. The crock pot($5 at GoodWill) has water in it and a stainless steel pot floating in the water holds the hide glue. I scrubber scored back of the bow well with Dawn dish soap and rinses it with boiling water just before starting the sinewing. This works better than any other method I've used to degrease the wood.
The first pic is of the toothing plane blade I used to score the back of the bow and the second pic is the scoring. Next is the hide glue sizing on the bow then the first of the sinew layed at the handle. From here I went out each limb to a point about 7" from the tip with the sinew. When done I'll add a wrap to secure both ends of the sinew.
I back strung this bow so with the bow resting on the tips the handle is about 7 1/4" off the table(induced reflex).
The next pics are me squeegying out the excess glue from the sinew and laying it down. This first layer has some voids but they will be filled with the next layer, then one last layer to even out the back.
The last 2 pics show the sinew today. It is almost dry after only one day. I'll give it another day or two before I add the second layer.
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I take my sinew down to about 1/5th that size. Literally, I can thread them in a slightly over-sized sewing needle eye. If I used one of those little wire needle threading tools I could probably thread 80% of my sinew through a regular sewing. Man, that is bunch of work. That's why I've only attempted 3 sinew bow and one of those lifted the sinew. grr.
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Hedge, that is some cow sinew I got from Trapper Rob that was already shreaded out. The strands are pretty big but they are seperated so they are fluffy and accept the glue well. I was hoping to get a smoother backing using the thicker stuff. It flattens out quite well after dipping in the glue.
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Thanks Pat. I always look forward to your posts. I learn so much from them. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.
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Oh that's looking nice Pat.. Lovely curves.
Cipriano
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Thanks Cipriano.
I added another layer of sinew today. I first sanded the rough spots down and sized the sinew with glue then began laying down the sinew. I stripper the bundles a bit smaller and layed them as straight as I could. I'll give her a few more days to dry them inspect the sinew layer to see if I need more sinew. I may just go with two layers if it looks good.
...to be continued.
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Diggin it Pat.
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Pat: 2 layers of the cow sinew has been working well for me, lately.
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Looks good, coming along nicely .... .... I'm watching!
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Matt, I think I'll stick with the 2 layers. I put it down pretty thick anyway. I'll put it up in my utility room to cure out. Hopefully for 6weeks to 2 months. ::)
Thanks Simon and Bryce
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Pat I have to ask you something that is non related to this thread, so I apologize.
WHERE'S THAT PEACH BOW!!!???
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Its still in my shop, Bryce, I just haven't had time to mess with it.
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Yep nice job Pat B.That's the same routine I go through sinewing.Christmas will be in about 6 weeks like you said.That's going to be a fun bow to shoot.I used that cow sinew before too.Backstrap.Talk about long strands.30" long or better.
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Lookin' good Pat! I'll have to try the toothing plane blade on my next sinew bow, neat results.
Tracy
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A really impressive bow, for sure. Thanks for the detailed info on the whole process.
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This coming weekend will be 2 months since I put this bow up to rest and cure. My plans were to begin the tillering at 2 months. We have had such a wet summer that I have decided to wait until drier weather before I stress her. It could be the difference in a zippy little bow or a cool looking slug and I would prefer the former. Once the weather breaks and the humidity drops I'll be ready to get her done.
We had 10" of rain in June, 22" in July(only 2 days with no rain) and already 6" for August putting us over 75" for the year so far. Our normal yearly rainfall is about 73". ...and we don't have A/C!
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Good call...heck...wait till winter...I prob wood personally 8)
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...and we don't have A/C!
We would die if we did not have A/C. My workshop even has a dehumidifier in it so I can keep the RH down to about 45% in the summertime but I have to empty the reservoir about every other day. It is nothing for Arkansas to have 100+ degree days with 95% Rh.
Grady
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Over the years our summers rarely got over 85 deg but in th last few years we've been hitting 90deg or so. This summer has been relatively cool but with all the rain the R/H has been exceptionally high and continuous. Yesterday the R/H was 94%. It will be at least fall before the R/H goes down.
I do most of my bow building in the winter anyway. Now I remember one reason why. ;D
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Good call...heck...wait till winter...I prob wood personally 8)
Yeah right ::) You would wait until winter 2016 probably. And then you would break it the first day you started working on it again ;) ;D
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You know me too well, Clint! ;)
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Good call...heck...wait till winter...I prob wood personally 8)
Yeah right ::) You would wait until winter 2016 probably. And then you would break it the first day you started working on it again ;) ;D
OH SNAP!!!! LMAO :laugh: hope yours turns out better than my last pat >:D
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/IMG_20130724_194357_666-1.jpg) (http://s1181.photobucket.com/user/blackhawk28/media/IMG_20130724_194357_666-1.jpg.html)
(http://i1181.photobucket.com/albums/x436/blackhawk28/IMG_20130724_194304_500-1.jpg) (http://s1181.photobucket.com/user/blackhawk28/media/IMG_20130724_194304_500-1.jpg.html)
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Pat, I was aiming that jab at old Blackhawk. I gave him a hard time for a few weeks about finishing up a sinewed bow that he had started a couple years ago. As you can tell by the pictures he just posted it didn't go very well.
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That was a total tension failure through the sinew or did the limb delaminate?
Clint, I've been known to do similar things. ;D
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Pat I thought most of your failures were caused by to much barley pop ;D
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Well after many months of sitting around(sinew added 6/16-18/2013)I finally got back to work on this little bow. After long stringing her I realized there were a few stiff spots to soften. With lots of excercie and a few scrapes here and there I got her to low brace then a normal brace height of about 6 1/2" from the back.
I got her down to about 60#@26" but thats still a bit stiff so I will have to reduce the weight some. I'll recheck the weight after shooting her in. When I was sure everything was looking good I braced her and put 4 arrows through her. Man does she shoot nice. I still have to do final shaping and finish on the tips and handle but for now here she is...
Braced...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/osageshorty003_zps5b7c6fc2.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/osageshorty003_zps5b7c6fc2.jpg.html)
Full Draw(@26")...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/osageshorty004_zpsf21446b9.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/osageshorty004_zpsf21446b9.jpg.html)
And after shooting 4 arrows I let her rest at brace height for about 1 hour. Right after unbracing she looked like this...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/osageshorty005_zpsccade30a.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/osageshorty005_zpsccade30a.jpg.html)
I still have to add tip overlays and finish shaping the tips, shape and finish the handle add a floppy rest with a handle wrap and then after 100 shots I'll add the carp skins Pearlie gave me then Tru-Oil.
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woohooo ive been waiting for this to get moving again!
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Looks killer pat!!!!!!!
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That's probably my favorite of any of your bows Pat. Picture perfect tiller.
Jon
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nice!
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Tasty bends Pat :D
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Looks like a killer to me Pat. I'll be posting something very similar as soon as I can get someone to take the FD shot.
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Looking great Pat. I can't wait to see her all finished up.
Jon, I'll be looking forward to seeing your posted also.
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Cool little bow Pat!
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Awesome! Josh
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Super nice Pat! Love those curves also. I'd give it a few more days to set it's weight if I were you. Temps should drop here soon. I've found it best to set the weight of these type bows for the temperature one's most like to hunt in. When you get down to the nitty gritty, sinew backed bows are still seasonal bows, at best. Good luck with yours..............Art
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Awesome bow Pat.
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WoW that bows doing some bending. That is sweet for sure.
DBar
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Text book tiller Pat.... other than that.. Im speechless Bro ;)... Brian
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Thanks everyone. She's not finished yet. I still need to shoot her a lot then add the finishing touches.
Art, I think I will wait until the air dries more before I add the finish. I'm aware of how seasonal sinew backed bows can be. Elkie fluctuated about 20# depending on the R/H.
JonW, looking forward to seeing your shorty.
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Great job pat. Love them bends :)
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Good to see this one back in progress Pat, looks great and gonna be real good looking shooter when done I'd say. Nice bend in that one!
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Definitely one of the nicer recurves I've seen Pat! I'm good with slow and steady if they look like that :)
Tracy
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That's a thing of beauty! Look forward to seeing it all finished up
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I enjoyed looking at the entire process on this bow. Awesome work.
Also noticed how much my own workshop looks compared to yours and PatB's. :laugh: Glad I'm not the only mad scientist making wood shavings.
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Tim, you wouldn't recognise my shop now. I did a clean up 2 weeks ago to have my air handler worked on. Don't worry, it will be back to normal soon. :o
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Looking awesome already,cant wait to se her dolled up!
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Boy Pat, that tiller is textbook perfect! Way to go man!!! 8)
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Well the wait was worth it.I've been waiting for this one.What a sweet looking bow Pat.Looks like it's dying to shoot an arrow.It should'nt gain too much any more......LOL.Carp skins will set it off really nice.Congrats.
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Thanks dbb, Cody and Ed. Ed, it could easily gain 10# this winter when the air dries. I've seen it before.
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That is gonna be one stud of a bow :) Looks like one hell of a shooter already :o
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Nice looking so far pat !!Can't wait to see her finished... love me some carp skins! ;)
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That is looking smooth and stout!
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Sweet work Pat,that baby is looking good. :)
Pappy
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so when are we going to see this thing finnished. i can't wait!
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Nice,Pat, I thought you were working on one of the Trade bows.
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Just caught up on here, Pat. That looks like a bow you could go Tyrannnosaur hunting.
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Wow that's a nice bow Pat!!
Cipriano
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Thanks Pappy
Slayer, it will get finished when it does...when I have time to finish. Thats the best I can tell you.
Eddie, I didn't get in any bow trades last year. Hopefully I will this year.
Steve, I'm game if you are offering. ;D
Thanks Cipriano.
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Maybe there is one lurking around back in the 10,000 islands! I've heard that there are some hogs on the loose back there and Lord knows what else. 16 foot pythons, hybridized jaguar-panthers, and of course, the ever elusive skunk ape. That'd be quite a kayaking trip.
And after seeing Eddie and Pappy, gotta put in for gator tags next year and see what happens!
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That bow is so saweeeet. Very nice work pat. I was wondering if u were gonna posts it once it was done. I've read the thread a few times. Thanks for sharing. But my draw length is 30", but u can still send it. I'll cut some of my arm off to shoot that baby
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That's a beauty and it aint even done! Looking forward to the finish pics and someday to be able to make one that nice. Thanks for the post.
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Well guys, I finally got her done. ;D bbbHere are a few pics I just took and I'll get a full draw pic as soon as I can later today.
She is 56 1/2" t/t, sinew backed with 3 courses of cow sinew and covered with diamond back watersnake skin from Cipriano. I was gonna use a pair of carp skins that Pearlie gave me but they just wouldn't work like I wanted them to. They won't go to waste, Pearlie
I'm not sure of the draw weight but she is heavy! I'll check her on my scale later but I know it is off.
The tips are reinforced with yew and ipe underlays and have leather tip overlays. The handle wrap is hemp cordage set in Massey finish and she has 5 coats of Tru-Oil on her and Ill do a quick spray of satin poly to cut the shine.
Here are a few pics...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper001_zpsf5f29176.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper001_zpsf5f29176.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper005_zps56eb3d46.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper005_zps56eb3d46.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper007_zps2ac4c527.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper007_zps2ac4c527.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper002_zps861f7820.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper002_zps861f7820.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper004_zps304a3ed3.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper004_zps304a3ed3.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper003_zps7db022f0.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper003_zps7db022f0.jpg.html)
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thats a little beauty, well worth the wait.
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Sweet bow Pat! In the braced pic it just looks liking it wants to explode an arrow! I love it. Great job man.
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Thanks guys. Pearlie, she is by far the fastest bow I've built to date. I'm a happy camper! ;D
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Pat....your patience really shows here. Outstanding workmanship!! Not sure bout the fastest tho.... the "Leopard" bow you gave me (50/50 heart/sap) shot 183 thru the chrono! ;) >:D
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I haven't even see the full draw yet,but I can say without a doubt that's the best Patb bow I've ever seen... :D ...that's all kinds of sexy!!!! And I better see this in bom next month ;)
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Bring it to the Classic next spring and we will do a comparison, Brian.
Chris, as soon as I get a full draw pic I'll send the info to Cipriano for BOM consideration. ;)
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Sounds like a plan Pat.... if I have room.... I will be packin a wife to this time ;D...were gonna take the whole week and call it a honeymoon ;)... Brian
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Dang Sir!
She's a Beauty for Sure...
Those are Diamondback Water Snake skins correct?
Looking forward to the Full Draw shot... :)
-gus
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Dang Pat :o You made the right call on cutting that knot hole off and going with that style of bow. She turned out beautiful. I can't wait to see the FD, but I got a pretty good idea what it looks like already. Are you going to let me dance with your lady at the Classic?
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Brian, if you ain't got room for the bow and your new wife just strap her to the roof racks. If she loves you she won't mind. ::)
Clint, once I studied that stave I knew she had something special in mind to become. And yes, you can shoot her any time you want.
Gus, yes, diamondback watersnake from Cipriano.
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better not put this in the Oct BOM ive just got my sub and i don't wan't to go up against a fantastic bow like this
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Awesome bow. Nice job.
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Here are a few more pics, including the full draw...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper010_zps0f886f73.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper010_zps0f886f73.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper012_zps0140ff5f.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper012_zps0140ff5f.jpg.html)
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper009_zps34f5d1f3.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper009_zps34f5d1f3.jpg.html)
Here are a few pics of the recurve tips showing the yew and ipe underlays and leather tip overlays.
bottom
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper014_zpsb471c2f8.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper014_zpsb471c2f8.jpg.html)
...and top...
(http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y199/PatBNC/LilThumper013_zps705341cc.jpg) (http://s5.photobucket.com/user/PatBNC/media/LilThumper013_zps705341cc.jpg.html)
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Wow kapow!all around beautiful !
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Wicked curves on that one,really sexy :o 8)
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Wow, absolutely stunning. It does look fast.
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That is one stud of a bow ;) I like your style, on this one especially 8)
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Oh, and DONT forget to bring it to pappys with you this spring. I have to see it in person.
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Amazing, really beautiful work.
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I like it all, but I really like those ipe and yew underlays and the leather overlays. Sweet tips too. Beautiful bow!
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That is one fine bow, looks perfect in every detail. The braced and drawn profile are all business and the finish, skins and tips are all beauty. The whole package here. Nicely done Pat.
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that is a stunner of a bow , great work Pat, Bub
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That's one wicked bow! worth the wait for sure.
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Now that's a bow worth waiting for!
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Wow Pat beautiful bow and beautiful work as always. Lots of time and work in that bow, it might be your best yet but there is one other that I am partial to as well.
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That's a very fine bow Pat B.Beautiful and fun to shoot too I'm sure.Patience pays off everytime.
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Thanks everyone. She shoots as well as she looks. I gave her the name "Lil' Thumper" cause thats how she shoots.
Kenneth, how is Elke doing these days? I guess no elk for the Gormans this year. I did shoot(.308) a doe at Chris Cades a few weeks ago so we have meat in the freezer for this year.
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Boy that is nice Pat.
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sweet bow!!!!!!!!!!
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Not that's a thing of beauty!! I love everything about this bow. Those curves are spectacular. It's certainly been worth the wait. I too, want to pull on that string ;)
Cipriano
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Come to the Classic, Cipriano and I'll let you. ;) The skin is what really set her off. Thanks. It is perfect for her. 8)
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I shot her this weekend some but I think I'll have to reduce the weight a bit. I'll check the weight this evening but my scale is off so it is hard to really know the true weight...I just know she's a bit heavy for me.
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Pat, have you gotten an accurate draw weight, shot it thru a chronograph, or done any flight shooting to be able to measure the performance on this beautiful bow? It would be nice to find a big open area and just let some fly for distance. Any way just curious. Kenneth
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Pat, thats a beauty! Nice to see you show what you can do now and then.
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Those are some amazing curves! You da man Pat.
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That is a beautiful bow by an accomplished bowyer. Well done, Pat. Jawge
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A few weeks ago Charlie Jefferson(stringstretcher) sent me a digital bow scale. My old spring scale has been off for a while now but I didn't know how much until I got the digital scale from Charlie. With the new scale Lil' Thumper weighed in at 65#@26". :o She will be going in for some weight reduction surgery to get her weight down so I can handle her more comfortably.
Thanks for the kind words guys.
I guess this would be my least favorite thing about bow building...reducing the weight of an already finished bow. Murphy get his chance to reek havoc. ::)
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Pat, I bet that bow would do well at the flight shoots. I took the libery of copying your profile with a hickory backed osage. Just finished it today. I made mine 50#@ 26 and it thumps the arrows pretty good. Looking forward to shooting an arrow through your bow at the classic if I can make it this year.
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Steve you are more than welcome to shoot her. I hope you can make it back to the Classic this spring.
She's definitely the fastest bow I've built. The arrows that shoot best are 28" parallel poplar shafts weighing in at 494gr to 525gr. A bit light(gpp) for hunting arrows for a 65# bow but plenty enough weight to hunt with. When I reduce her I have some rear tapered poplar arrows that should shoot well too. I haven't tried cane or hardwood shoot arrows yet.
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Turned out awesome.
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Waited a long time for the money shot! Thanks for sharing Pat. You got a nice one there.
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Thank you guys.
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She's a beauty. That full draw picture looks like it fits you perfectly Pat! I think that "bow will hunt"!
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Thanks Snag.
I got her weight reduced to 56#@26" now and she is still a shooter. I put about a dozen arrows through her and am still very pleased with her. 8)
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Pat I'm counting down the days until I get to shoot her. I might be copying your bow for my winter sinew project.
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Cool Clint. I'd like to see how they compare.
Its funny...the arrows that shot so well from her at 65# also shoot well at 56#. :D
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WOW! That is really really nice! Awesome!
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Now that's a mighty perdy bow you made Pat!
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Very nice recurve Pat .Looks like a rocket launcher to me. Great job. God Bless
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Thanks Jon and Pete. She is a sweet shooter.
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Now that bow is a dandy. Well done Pat. Danny
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Thanks Danny.
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Beautiful bow.. Worthy of any hunt anywhere.. Great bow brother.. Will look better with elk blood on it.. Hawk a/Ho
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Thanks Mike. Great to see you around. I'll let you shoot her if you come back to the Classic in late April. ;)
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Your Little Thumper turned out very nice, Pat! It would have been interesting (while at 65#) to shoot it against Badger's 50-pounder to compare flight and speed. I would have reduced it myself, though. 65# is a bit heavy for us older fellas. Can we do it? Yes. Over-and-over? Not without a sore back and shoulder after a 40 target course. Really, cool Pat. Glad she was a success for you. Can't wait to see it at the Classic. Good on ya!
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Thanks Matt.
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For some reason the pictures are not showing up
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They are all showing up for me. Are you o a mobile device?
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Hello Pat B. Remember me??-Oldbow in Montana
Your fine bow certainly got my attention. Congrats on making such a fine weapon.
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Thats awesome Pat. Congrats on a sweet looking bow. If you hang on to it I'll try it out in the spring.
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Don Berg, you ole Montana mountain biker, how the heck are you? It has been a coons age. We sure have been missing you around here. I think my last BOM is when you were running it. Hope all is well with the family.
For everyone's information, Don Berg(aka Old Bow) was the creator of BOM on PA and ran it for years.
Thanks, Don for the kind words.
Thanks Jesse. you are more than welcome to shoot her at the Classic. Looking forward to seeing you again.
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hello everyone, from the Great White North. I am new to the site and I am enjoying it so far. I just wanted to say that is a beautiful beginning and I am looking forward to seeing the end result. keep up the good work.
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This is a great bow! Very nice
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Photobucket has apparently released pics so I thought I'd bring this back up. Got some build along info and pics. Pearlie is now the owner of this bow. How's she doing Pearlie?
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Thanks for bringing this build back up top Pat. Here is what became of the hole you cut off.
http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?topic=58998.75
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Nice bow Pat. Sure glad you got your pictures back.
Clint I remember that handle. Interesting to see where it came from.
Bjrogg
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That is a cool ax handle, Clint. :OK
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This is a fantastic thread. The tiller on that bow is perfection. Thanks for bringing it back Pat.
Awesome axe as well. ;)
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Pat the ol' gal is getting darker and darker every day. I show it off to anybody that knows you or will appreciate it. Its one of my treasures, no question about that. Thanks again, my friend.
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That's good news about photobuckets' change of attitude Pat.I remember that bow and very nice usage of that stave also.
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Couldn't have thought of a better person to be the guardian, Pearlie. :OK
Ed, when I got that stave from Clint I was thrilled with the hole in it. After studying it I realized that the hole wasn't in a good location and that the rest of the stave was perfect to the bow I wanted to make. I hated cutting off that end but am very pleased with the results of both pieces.
Upstate, glad you appreciate this thread. Lots of good info for sure.
Now if I can retrieve my 106 pages of pics back from PB I'll be happy.