Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Shooting and Hunting => Topic started by: Speratus on June 24, 2013, 02:09:29 pm
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Hi, I'm a new BowHunter. I've got the itch to harvest some game with my self built oak LongBow pulling 45lbs @ 28".
I know that TradHunting you've got to get close - to take an ethical shot. I've been told over and over that to stalk to within 5-10-15yards of an animal (Deer) is totally possible to do. Almost nobody talks about how tho. Being that I just got my License her in BC, Canada - I haven't had an opportunity yet to get out there and learn by trying. But are there any tips, advice or thoughts in beginning this journey? Especially with regards to BlackTail or MuleDeer as their behaviour is diff from WhiteTail.
Cheers!
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Start now with a camera and practice.
Stay downwind, move slowly and don't make a sound. It's that easy!
You are much better off starting out by ambush hunting. Make your prey come to you. You need to learn the habits and behaviors of your prey. How and when they move, what they are after, how their behavior differs when it's bright sunny and windless and when it's cloudy with variable winds.
Still hunting is setting up an ambush on the move; you need to know all that AND how to be a very convincing walking shadow.
Baby steps :)
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Generally speaking, you will not be able to stalk to 15 yds. of some animal--only in rare circumstances where, maybe, an animal is bedded and cirumstances ideal for walking quietly. I would abandon that idea until you've got good at stalking.
Rule number one of seeing animals is, "you have to be out there". You won't see them sitting in camp. And rule number one of getting close for a trad shot is, "you have to be out there alot". Rule number two is, "do more looking and listening than you do moving". With those two rules you have a 100% guaranteed success ratio for getting an animal within range, sooner or later, IMO.. Obviously this implies that you are in an area where there are animals.
Even when things are not ideal or working for you, you will bump into a critter, probably when you least expect it.
Better to approach the thing by learning where the animals are and getting yourself in there as much as possible until you have some success. It will happen.
The other alternative is the tree stand or ground blind thing where you, in hiding, wait for an animal to come to you. That requires some patience but can be even more successful than slinking along the ground.
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If you can see your quarry's eyes he can see you. Deer don't have good vision as we know it but they do pick up on movement easily. Movement is one of your enemies as is the wind unless it is in your face.
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I recommend reading 'The Still Hunter' by Theodore S. Van Dyke. It is old, (he was a friend of Teddy Roosevelt) but there's a lot of good info in there about stalking deer.
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Steve B makes some really good points. You gotta be in the game, not in the recliner watching the Outdoor Channel. Deer are rarely stalked by people in the summer and often will allow us to make a lot of mistakes before they get sick of your attention and bolt. Start, if at all possible, by working with urban or suburban deer. They are used to people.
AND NEVER LOOK 'EM IN THE EYE! I don't know what it is, but animals hate us catching their eye.
Learn what shoes/boots/moccasins allow you to move as quietly as possible. Learn to feel the ground under your foot before committing any weight to that foot. That way you can pick the foot up and reposition off the pine cones, sticks, twigs, crunchy forest bits that are scattered everywhere by the deer to alert them of our presence. Move slow with no jerky actions, move when a breeze moves around you, use every piece of terrain/vegetation to conceal your movements.
You are gonna get busted by the deer. So remember that those whitetails will pretend they are going back to grazing and browsing, slowly lowering their heads only to snap them back up to try catching you moving! If you think you are busted, but the deer has not run off, just stand like a statue until the deer actually moves off with it's head down grazing. The tail will flick just before the head comes up, watch their butts closely...they telegraph a lot with the tail.
It's just one of those things that you gotta do to learn how to do it! That means learning from mistakes. If you wait until hunting season to learn, then you really got a lot to learn fast!
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Be patient -patient and patient.Realize on a calm day with super dry conditions it will be really tough to sneak to within 15 yards of a whitetail.Pick good stalking days.Right after a rain or light snow or a windy day.always use binoculars(especially us older farts)When game is spotted I will lots of times take my boots off and stalk in my socks(I always carry an extra pair in my pack).I don,t hunt from a treestand ever anymore(nothing wrong with it-just my preference)I have been stalking the last 2 seasons with my old recurve and get busted a lot.I have to be within 15 yards for a shot.Late in the archery season here in Penna. I was fortunate enough to take a doe at 8 yards and it was AWESOME.Put on a 30 minute stalk and was lucky to get a good clean shot.Remember getting a deer or whatever your hunting is a bonus-just being healthy and able to be out spending time is the great thrill.Enjoy it and have a fantastic day!!!!!!LLoyd
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IT MIGHT BE BECAUSE NO ONE DOSE IT. IT'S NEXT TO IMPOSABLE.
It's not imposable and dose happen. But not use'lly by design. If to really want to do it,do it like this.
This is how my friend CROOKETARROW did it. And he stalked every deer he saw.
First off remember deers not on a time limit so get thast out of your head. SLOW DOWN, He's make it to shooting distance maybe 15,20 times out of a 100. A REMAKEABLE FEET IN MY BOOK Not all deer are stalkable. TIME,PLACE AND CONDISHONS AND MOST OF ALL PATINANCE.
He'd stalk everydeer he'd see. But you have to beable to put yourself in a place to start your stalk. SEE A DEER.
He'd still hunt when deer are up and moveing 9early and late. Still hunting where the deer going to travel to and from food,bedding is the only way to do it always with a cross wind at least. It's imposable to stalk a bedded deer. It's easyer to spot the deer first then move into a place you can intercept him. So you have to see the deer first. SLOW DOWN
There is a time and place I do stalk. I've arrowed 5 bucks like this 2 in thier beds. WHEN THE WIND BLOWS HARD I'LL PEAK STANDING CORN ROWS.
PUT ON MY GHILLIE GET THE WIND IN MY FAVOR STRAT ON A END PUT MY HEAD TROUGH AND LOOK DOWN EACH ROW. WHEN I'M TO THE OTHER SIDE I GO BACK THROUGH WHERE I JUST CAME MOVE DOWN THE FIELD 50 YARDS DO IT AGAIN .
Get use to a lot of seeing tails.
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Hunting in your part of the world is much different than hunting where most of us have to hunt and it depends upon what animal you plan to hunt. I learned a long time ago that you just need to spend a lot of time in the hills and sooner or later it will happen. Mule deer are completely different than whitetails so hunting them is about knowing their routes and those change by season. Like JW says you must be out with the animals to learn. Being able to shoot well is as important as being close enough to shoot so when you are out there practice what we call "stump shooting" at all angles. You won't get a lot of shots at deer so practice until you are able to hit where you aim! Another thing that is very important is to be able to pick where on the animal you want to place your arrow. That was one of the most difficult things for me to learn because being close enough to shoot makes the target look very large when in fact the kill zone is small. You need to really develop a philosophy about when you take a shot at any big game animal. Mine is to promise that animal that I won't take a shot at him unless I can promise him a clean and quick kill. That is a hard thing to do and because of that I have passed up many more shots than I ever took! For many years I have wanted to sneak up on a deer or elk and count coup on him and have never been able to do that. Not needing to kill an animal has made me a better hunter. And finally harvesting an animal with all your own home made equipment is a feeling like no other in hunting. A/Ho Joe
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Once while turkey hunting I had a deer count coup on me! She walked around the tree where I was sitting and stepped on my shin. I jumped and she jumped and we both shi...I mean, shrieked.
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There are a lot of different methods for hunting animals. For bow hunting I definitely prefer the ambush method and have had most of my success in feeding areas. Depending on terrain, I have hunted from treestands and from the ground. Finding a food source which has become an active feeding area with animal droppings is a good place to start. When animals are feeding, they can sometimes be in an area long enough to present you with a good angle for arrow penetration. I have friends that prefer to hunt travel paths to and from feeding/bedding areas. As far as stalking goes, conditions have to be just right and there are just too many variables for me to be consistently successful.
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All the above.
But that being said, I read years ago, about a guy hunting in Central America,
with an Indian guide, and he watched this guide walk up to about ten feet of a deer, before it noticed him. He said that deer, will graze, for about ten seconds, and then look, and around, and if nothing is moving, or there is no dangerous scents, it will go back to eating, and repeat the process. So I tried this out, in the Big Cypress, years ago, when I was in my early 20's,. A friend and I were down at My Dad's cabin, and we were walking in a prairie area, when we saw a doe, and a fawn. So I told my Buddy about the article I read, and said I was going to try it. Well darned it didn't work. That is until the little fawn looked up before his Mama, and saw me take a step, and at the instant, Mama swung her head and stared directly at me. I froze, and she did the look away, and then suddenly back again bit, and finally I just clapped my hands, and they took off.
But before Jr. spotted me I did get to within about thirty yards, of them, and this was in the open. You just wait till they put their head down, and take slow easy steps, and count to about 8 seconds, and then stop, and be perfectly still, slow your breathing so there is minimal movement. Then just repeat. But this only works well on a single animal. Like Jr.,if there are more than one, one might look up at a different interval. Again, there were no leaves, just grass, and it was mostly green, and the ground was damp, so noise is a factor to figure in also. Just something to consider, to the above advice, but I do know from my own experience that it works. Just be aware of the wind, noise, and movement, and such. ;)
Wayne
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I was walking around a creek one day, going to go sling, with one of my friends. I had a machete(we were going to clear a trail that was getting overgrown) and we literally walked into 3 deer. I mean literally walked into them. It was twilightish- dark, but not black. It was cool, but kinda scary. A mom and 2 fawns.
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Like a great Hunter by the name of Elmer once said " Be vewy-vewy quiet" O:) :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:.
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Move slowly, move when you have cover and look more than you move. Best thing to do is do not move at all and ambush on a trail.
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If you have a particular game that is plentiful, that would be good to start out with. Squirrels are fun to hunt by slipping along quietly on game trails. Perhaps rabbits are abundant in your area. Just get in the mind set that you are hunting when you leave civilization behind and step into the woods. You move slow, deliberate and constantly look for movement ahead and to the sides. Use shadows from the trees and when the wind blows you move slow and stop when it stops to look and listen. You are not looking for big deer, you are looking for small things that move. Move into the wind or cross wind. You are less noticeable if you are in the shadows than in a bright sun beam. A lot of the time you will see game moving towards you and then you wait for the shot.
If you move through the woods and you see squirrels, birds, chipmunks and all possible critters before they see you then you have had a successful stalk, even if you didn't take a shot. Move through the woods knowing they are hunting you, just like you are hunting them. You are the more lethal hunter if you allow it to happen....patience is what allows you to make it happen and you will be mentally and physically drained from the amount of focus you will need....Good Luck and Good Hunting
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Ambush is your best bet. When you walk through the bush, don't walk like a man. Walk like a deer. Talk like a deer . Then you can get really close . Use the wind. Take a few steps ,then stop and listen . Repeat . Get a friend to walk through the bush and listen with your eyes closed, then you'll know what I mean. you can pick out a man walking from a long ways away. The noise you make if any ,should be the kind that you hear and ask yourself if you really heard it or it was a branch or acorn falling.Then wait long enough to convince yourself that it was really nothing before making another noise. Ambush is definitely the way to go though. Good luck!, Dave.
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From reading all the post it seams alot of you think still hunting and stalking the same rhing.
STALKING IS SPOTING AND THEN GOING TO THE ANIMAL.
STILL HUNTING IS PUTTING YOURSELF WHERE ANIAMAL IS MOVEING THROUGH, THE TRICK HERE IS SEEING THE ANIMAL FIRST. LET HIM COME TO YOU.
Stalking into 20 yards or less with a selfbow would mean there'd be alot of starveing bow builders. I know I'd be one of them. I don't know anyone or heard of anyone that dose it with a bow by design no matter where you live. I use to loved still hunting with a rifle if I had the space and did really well on bucks doing it.
My friend CROOKETARROW said only 1 deer (BUCKS OR DOES) out of 100 is really stalkable. Then you'd better not do anything wrong with that one. THATS STALKABLE
He stalk fawns for practice in the summer but he's still hunt when if came to killing something. He Did alot better than I could. 100 TIMES BETTER.
But he could slow down and have patience when he needed it. Moved supper slow use to drive he crazy but move quickly when he needed to. I knewed him 13 years and he killed 6 or 7 does and 3 yearly bucks one mature 4 year old. But he'd tell you the buck and another was fighting and he walked right up. 15 yards and shot him. HEsaid if was the only buck he'd ever STALKED. All the rest were killed still hunting not stalking.
Just go out and give it a try or 3 tell us what you think.
His favoret way was to seet see the animal one day go back and still hunt the exact same trail the next day at the time he's saw the deer.
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Still hunting is slipping along slowly looking for game.
Spot and stalking is exactly that, you spot game you stalk in as close as you can.
Waiting in a good spot for deer to come along is stand hunting!
A lot of people call one the other but the above is correct anyone agree.
~HF~
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Some of this is repeating others but worthwhile to do so. Anyway, here are some tips from me...
PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE... all year, on all animals (especially deer) and people. The more you practice the better you get and as you practice, pay attention to the different animals and their habits. Deer have a tendency to look up at regular intervals as they eat to check for predators, you can almost time this out and stop moving BEFORE they look the next time.
Practice not only being slow but being able to freeze and stay motionless... in all sorts of weird positions, while in mid-step, etc.
Wear quite footwear. I like barefoot when conditions allow or moccasins. I rarely wear hunting boots.
Keep an eye on wind, other animals... heck ALL your surroundings. Be aware.
Have fun and don't get frustrated. Frustration does not help and remember this is not an easy way to hunt.
Isaac
P.S. I personally do not look an animal in the eye when I am close. I am not sure the science or anything serious on this, but from my experience, the animal busts me 99% of the time if I make eye contact and rarely when I avoid it.
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It always amazed me how when I really try and stalk I always jump deer before I ever see them but on occasion I'll be just trudging through the woods or down a road and BAM!! I'll walk up to a deer and neither one of us even realize it till I'm real close. I'm certainly not saying trudging is a good technique because most of the time I see tails hopping off long before I get close.
I guess what I'm saying is follow all the advice you've been given on here with the understanding that deer do this every day 24/7/365 and they are MUCH better at it than you. Like crookedarrow said, probly 1 out of 100 is stalkable (maybe a slight exaggeration). I don't really know how to say it right so I'll say it like this. If you go in with low expectations and just enjoy the experience you'll come out a lot happier in the end if things don't pan out. And if they do then the victory will be that much sweeter. I find I get down more when I get high hopes and "just know I'm gonna kill a big one today" and see nothing than when I'm just going to hang out in the woods to kill a couple hours. 2 years ago I killed one of my biggest bucks in a polo shirt and jeans after work. When the stars align it will seem so easy but when they don't it will be near impossible. Good luck and just have fun.
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Buckskin moccasins are deadly silent
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Here..... out west, Southwest AZ to be exact is where your put to the test. I have stalked every animal from coyote, quail, cattle, peccary, horses, people, deer, elk, and everything in between. Even fish with a spear. Every time its quick movement that they see. I never relied on camo but I depended greatly on some type of cover (brush, washes, wind gusts etc). Of course keeping good wind was always number 1. One thing is to slow down and know your quarry. You could read all you want about stalking but its through practice and blown stalks that you will learn from. I have stalked to deer in plain sight to within 25yds by baby stepping every time they put their heads down to eat, doing this I timed their movements so that by the time they had their heads up I was squatting/sitting still. My approach angle would provide at least a 25-30yd shot when they crossed my path of interception. Too bad there wasn't a buck in the bunch, but I did draw and shoot without releasing an arrow. That's practice out in the field.
I killed my best coues buck at 21 yds bedded at 1pm in the hot of the day. I was hunting with a compound bow then but my max range was 30yds. At the last 60yds or so I dumped my pack, dropped off my boots and crept the last 60. Caught the buck snoozing and he died because of it.
As described before Not all deer are stalkable. You just have to be patient and wait for change. Wind, temps, rain, anything to assist in stalking. I love it with a slight drizzle or gusty mornings for still hunting or stalking.
Honestly spot and stalk is by far the most exciting form of hunting. I never did like stand hunting, it works but I love being out in the woods with bow in hand and seeing what's around the corner.