Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Comancheria on October 31, 2014, 12:24:22 pm
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Folks,
I have pretty much settled on using a board for my first effort, especially in light of what Lenador managed. Whichever design I end up with, I will probably rely on Surforms and rasps for rough wood removal.
But for later on, I have been reading about the advantages of bandsaws. A couple of sites mentioned having a "big bandsaw". So I remember the behemoth my grandfather owned. And the big floor models cost a fortune. So my question is this--would a small 2.5 HP, bench-mounted unit selling for $129.95 be useful to a bowyer who is willing to go slowly? Or would that just be a cheap fool's errand?
Thanks,
Russ
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Of course it could be useful, but 2.5 HP is quite a motor on a bench mounted 129 dollar machine. Where are you seeing a machine with these specs, I would like to know.
By way of comparison, my saw is 2 HP and it is a full sized 17 inch machine.
Russ
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I was wondering that also. My 14.5" is 1hp. Maybe it is .25hp.
A bench model will work but you will have to take it easy and go slow.
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Yeah, something sounds a little suspicious about those specs. A good 2 1/2 hp motor will cost a lot more than $129.00.
But, you will find a band saw to be an extremely useful and time saving tool for bow building.....and many other things. I have a 14" 1 1/2 hp Delta and wouldn't be too happy with a smaller motor. Anything less than 1 hp and you will be considerably under powered for working with the type hardwoods used for bow building.
Keep an eye on your local Craigslist posts. Be patient and you can find just the right machine for your needs.
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My 14" 1 hp band saw will cut anything I will ever need. Like Drewster mentioned, watch your local craigslist for deals. Whatever you get make sure to keep a sharp blade on it.
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My 14" 1 hp band saw will cut anything I will ever need. Like Drewster mentioned, watch your local craigslist for deals. Whatever you get make sure to keep a sharp blade on it.
...and good tires! I've come to prefer the neoprene ones. They seem to last forever!
OneBow
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Lord, but I feel like an idiot! The saw (I did not mention the brand or where I saw it because I thought that might not be allowed. But I just Googled the saw--which was at Lowes--and it was most certainly NOT 2.5 HP--rather, it was a Skil at 2.5 AMPS! And it is a 9 inch model. So, from
What you all say, it would be less than minimal.
Thanks for the correction.
Russ
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I use a 6amp Milwaukee portaband that I clamp in a vise upright.it's not the best but it will get the job done and it's blades are quite cheap and last long. I also have a 9" ryobi, it works ok on boards but it's hard on blades and they are not so cheap.
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Anything is better than nothing. Most wood split easily. Once you split the wood to the size of bow stave, the 9" bandsaw would be good enough. If you buy boards or split staves, that's all you need. I have a 10" one.
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Sawing boards yes. Milling smaller logs into boards for bows... No.
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Gotcha. Thanks, Gentlemen.
Russ
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You will never regret buying a bigger saw but you may regret buying a smaller one.
I made a lot of bows with an old 1/2 hp Craftsman saw (American made), with a sharp blade it got the job done. When I moved up to a 1.5 hp Griz I moved into a different word as far as kind of wood I could run through my saw.
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One of the problems with the smaller saws is that their 3-wheelers and much more prone to have blades jump off or brake..more high maintenence when doin what we do, lol. That bein said, i used the heck out of one till we got a big one ;D... Brian
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Look at Harbor Freight they sell some decent 14" models in the 200 range. Those old behemoths that you remember were heavy frames and solid steel, motors were cast frames and heavy, but no more efficient than todays. I own two, an old meat saw and a powermatic and both take two good men to move, but the motors are only 1.5 hp.
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200 should get you a used 12" delta on Craigslist to. Might be easier to get parts for them over the harbor freight saw.
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I have a 14" Ridged bandsaw that I use , one of the back roller bearings seazed up on me and a freind was going to use it to cut out two bows , one osage and a pecan.
My brother said we could use his so I took a new blade and we went to his shop , my brother's saw is a 14" but an off brand , built light , and has different sized pulleys to adjust the seed .
Both saws have 3/4 hp motors but his had some trouble cutting the osage and it had a harder time with the pecan , we had to keep working the pecan down a little at a time .
With a new blade my saw will walk through most woods with little problems , took over an hour with my brothers , motor would stall out on us and his saw hadn't been used much .
Investing in a good saw is worth the extra money , do some resurch and look around a little , maybe you can find a good used one , be sure and look it over good before you buy it , check all the bearings and adjusters .
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sorry to say but I've never bought anything of quality that lasts a long time from Harbor Freight. Random tools that you use once in a blue moon are OK but I don't think I'd buy a bandsaw from them. I highly recommend not buying a rigid bandsaw, I just threw a 14 inch in the garbage. All the casting on it is cheap and I broke many parts. Got sick of ordering new parts for that thing. wish I would have bought a good one from begin with. The last dozen bows I've made have been rough out with a hatchet
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Once you have a bandsaw, you'll need lots of wood :P
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Jodocus - your hilarious.
I used a small bench top saw I borrowed from a friend to make several bows. Worked great!..but I wanted a better saw and I knew I'd be using it a lot so I got a large 14" floor model. I think it's 1.5 HP. I think I paid around $400 at Lowes (It's a Porter Cable). I love it. It wasn't too expensive, it works awesome and does everything I need it to do. Sure I'd love to have a larger more powerful saw but don't really need it.
What ever you use make sure you get a nice sharp blade. 3-4TPI. That will go a long way in helping you cut through most any hardwood.
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In Canada we have a brand called "General". Apparently the highest quality you can buy. Their tools are all a pale green and made in Quebec. These are quite expensive but worth the money. Like anything be careful of the line called "General Star" an overseas version of the general saw but not the quality.
I had a cheap $100 saw and went through 3 blades so I am not sure about whether I will get another if it is not a General but pricey as they start at $700.
Kind of a must for board bows but not for self bows.
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I have a delta 14" 1/3 hp motor. Always works well for me.
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Rigid saws %$#*&^!. I bought one off a friend in bad financial shape. Having a good bit of experience with bandsaws, the first thing I noticed was the blade wouldn't track correctly on the tires, center one and the other would be almost off the other. The way the saw frame was cast there was no way to correct this problem. I took the saw to a warranty repair place that lied to me and said they added a shim to correct the problem. I still had the problem so I pulled the wheel to find they hadn't done a thing to my saw. I took it back and told them if they couldn't fix it I wanted another saw.
Well, I go another saw sent to me, being upset with Rigid I shipped it to my brother without opening the box, 25% of the parts were missing. It took him a year to get the parts from Rigid but often when he called for one part they would send a completely unrelated part that he didn't need.
He finally scrounged and made enough stuff to get the saw running.
Did I mention I didn't like Rigid saws?
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A few years back I built my own vertical metal cutting bandsaw. It runs off of a Dayton 1/2 hp motor. It has 3 speeds; 850, 1700, & 3400 ft per minute. It has a 24" throat, and cut up to 12" thick material. I have about $700 in parts and materials, probably 40 hours of construction, and countless hours engineering it. I couldn't even begin to tell you how much I use this thing on so many different projects including bow building.
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Why do my pictures always seem to post sideways?
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A few years back I built my own vertical metal cutting bandsaw. It runs off of a Dayton 1/2 hp motor. It has 3 speeds; 850, 1700, & 3400 ft per minute. It has a 24" throat, and cut up to 12" thick material. I have about $700 in parts and materials, probably 40 hours of construction, and countless hours engineering it. I couldn't even begin to tell you how much I use this thing on so many different projects including bow building.
Now that is awesome! I feel like doing that now
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Harbor Frieght sells Jet brand, not top line, but good, and parts are available.
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For a few yrs Jet has been buyin up other companies... You might own a jet and not know it, lol. Everything at our harbor frieght is chicago machine... Brian
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If I were not already bald, I'd tear my hair out. DON'T BUY ANYTHING MADE IN EAST ASIA!
If the machine has even ONE PLASTIC PART DON'T BUY IT!
Unless you have more money than you know what to do with, DON'T BUY ANYTHING NEW!
Go here http://www.owwm.org/ (http://www.owwm.org/) and get an education in what great old American-made (and Canadian) band saws can be had used for much less money. Many of these machines have ALREADY lasted several generations and will just keep on working without breaking or wearing out anything other than easily replaced bearings.
Here are some of mine. I have three (had another one and traded it) and have less than $100 in the ones that cost the most and I got two of them for free.
You might have to do some cleanup and tune-up, but your grandchildren can used the same saws when they inherit them.
Jim Davis
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Harbor Frieght sells Jet brand, not top line, but good, and parts are available.
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And you will need them.
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For what it's worth, I think the blade is a bigger part of the equation than I originally thought. I bought a 1970's Rockwell 14" saw that had been sitting idle for probably the last 10-15 years at an auction. I fired it up...and was a little disappointed how it bogged down on even relatively thin wood. My dad bought me some new blades for Christmas, and the difference is night and day. Now, I don't think a good blade will make a poor saw great, but it can make a mediocre saw pretty darn good for not a whole lot more money.
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I beat the hell out of my Grizzly 14", and it loves it. I bought it brand new because I have MORE MONEY THAT I KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH. That's why Im typing this from my seat at work...............
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Get back to work Chris. :D
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Falcon you'll notice most of my entries are somewhere between 6 am and 4:30 pm EST.....:)
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;D
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Falcon you'll notice most of my entries are somewhere between 6 am and 4:30 pm EST.....:)
(http://rabbittalk.com/images/smilies/th_signs069.gif) (http://rabbittalk.com/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif)
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I notice everyone recommends a 14" saw. Is that just for the horsepower? I can't see where you need a 14" throat for a stave and I would hate to cross paths with a guy that can lift a 28" log and run it through a bandsaw ;) ;). I've been toying with building my own. I have a metal lathe, milling machine and welding equipment so I'm OK that way. Does the size of the wheels give the blade more traction and support maybe? I've got a couple of 1 HP motors kicking around. Any input would be welcome :)
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I like a robust saw if Im running 1/4 logs of osage through it. That's my reason for a 14" saw.
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I use a 1/2 hp on mine and it works great, as long as you run double reduction gearing.
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I also use four 8" neoprene wheels and I don't seem to have any problems
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I notice everyone recommends a 14" saw. Is that just for the horsepower? I can't see where you need a 14" throat for a stave...
You don't need the wide throat dimension for staves, but it's a rare saw that has a lot of depth for resawing without also having 14" or greater diameter wheels.
With a sharp blade, a saw should cut hardwood just fine without " double reduction gearing." If it has to be geared down that much, something is very wrong with the setup.
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How many FPS do you guys use normally?
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The reason I use the double reduction gearing is because I built mine to cut steel, and I have cut through 2" 304 stainless before with mine, so it easily handles any kind of hard wood you could throw at it, even really thick stuff.
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I cut osage at 1600 ft. per minute with my setup
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DC, note what Asharrow said about the wheels( 14" dia.) that is what drives the blade, the throat can vary with brand. I didn't say the Jet brand was great, just available and reasonable.
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I cut osage at 1600 ft. per minute with my setup
Yeah, I meant FPM. Thanks
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DC, note what Asharrow said about the wheels( 14" dia.) that is what drives the blade, the throat can vary with brand. I didn't say the Jet brand was great, just available and reasonable.
To be accurate, the "throat" is the distance from the blade to the frame, across the table to the left. That will be the same or a little less than the stated wheel diameter.
The depth of cut is what will vary from brand to brand within a given wheel size.
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I have a Jet JWBS14q and it's a dream. I also use a Jet drum sander and it is again a dream to use. Nothing has broken and i've run an awful lot of wood through them both.
The real key with bandsaws is a top quality blade suited to the task. I have five different blades to cope with any and every job I do. You really can't ask one blade to do everything well. Also make sure the wheels are truly coplanar and your guides are set flawlessly and of course work out the saws natural drift when setting the fence.
General bandsaw advice buy the biggest, most bad ass saw you can afford >:D