Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: kamil2910 on December 07, 2014, 06:58:31 am

Title: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 07, 2014, 06:58:31 am
Hi
I have problem with my new ipe-maple sinew horsebow
After I first stung bow, with maple and ipe ,glue go delaminate, Make a 2 mm crack,Crack make at the end of grip to bending arm.
I made a longbow with epoxy glue Polish epidian 5 and bow be good, dont have any problem,What is best glue for that composit horsebow?
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: redhawk55 on December 07, 2014, 07:44:29 am
Any pics of the crack?
I don' t think ipe/maple mix to be a great choice.
Michael
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 07, 2014, 07:48:27 am
I dont have a photo because i glue thys delaminte with cyjanoakril
What you mean if maple and ipe its bad combination with sinew???
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 07, 2014, 11:09:32 am
Did you copy that off my sinew along? It looks uncannily similar.
 The combination is fine but you can't nor do you need to reflex it that much.
 I would try again and scrub the Ipe down well with soapy water before gluing it up.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 07, 2014, 01:58:46 pm
No i dont copy youre ipe sinew laminate,I start making thys bow in july I tomorrow, more scraped belly of bow, lose from draw weight,
at that moment bow go to 90-100 lbs at 28 inch
 and I go to tiller,
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 07, 2014, 03:02:38 pm
Remember the originals show evidence of wrapping at that point. It's a highly stressed area.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: bubby on December 07, 2014, 03:27:33 pm
might want to post this in the hornbow section
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 07, 2014, 03:52:00 pm
But it's not a hornbow and the hornbow guys are adamant that this style is a waste of time in wood.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: Tommytinker on December 07, 2014, 04:22:39 pm
Do you think it's a waste of time Pat?
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 07, 2014, 04:28:53 pm
Of course not, I am the biggest proponent of this style. There is just no need to try for a very high degree of reflex.
 The reflex in a horn bow is to strain the materials to get the most out of them. You don't have to do that with wood.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: Tommytinker on December 07, 2014, 04:32:07 pm
Ok, I think I might give it a go, got some nice ipe left and plenty of sinew. What wood would you recommend for the core?
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: bubby on December 07, 2014, 04:41:29 pm
But it's not a hornbow and the hornbow guys are adamant that this style is a waste of time in wood.




your right pat I missed that
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: blackhawk on December 07, 2014, 06:14:50 pm
With that much reflex you'll likely exceed the elasticity limits of the wood.....been there done that....like pat says don't put in as much reflex on the next one.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: mikekeswick on December 08, 2014, 02:22:09 am
Major stress at that point. Wrap it next time before bending.
So much reflex is a waste of time. Aim for the tips to sit maybe 4 inches ahead of the grip.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 08, 2014, 09:01:41 am
Also balance your reflex through the materials. Glue in a little bit with the wool lams and then a bit more with the sinew.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: adb on December 08, 2014, 09:28:21 am
Any pics of the crack?
I don' t think ipe/maple mix to be a great choice.
Michael

Do you mean just in this case, or in general?
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: bubby on December 08, 2014, 11:18:47 am
Any pics of the crack?
I don' t think ipe/maple mix to be a great choice.
Michael





I don't know, I've had good results with this combo
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 08, 2014, 11:35:09 am
  If you push the reflex too far with Maple/Ipe the Ipe WILL tear the Maple in half, even under sinew.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 08, 2014, 11:50:59 am
I today scrap a belly of bow, I go to at that moment 3-2 mm ipe, to 9 mm thin arm,
I make wrap at the grip end place, bend and already be good, Tomorrow I go to strung thys bow
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: adb on December 08, 2014, 02:04:10 pm
Any pics of the crack?
I don' t think ipe/maple mix to be a great choice.
Michael





I don't know, I've had good results with this combo


Yah, me too. Maple and ipe has been a great combo for me. Warbows, flatbows and static recurved. I haven't used it in a highly reflexed or highly stressed design like this, but it's done everything else I've asked of it.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: bubby on December 08, 2014, 03:41:02 pm
  If you push the reflex too far with Maple/Ipe the Ipe WILL tear the Maple in half, even under sinew.





Push any wood to far and you will tear it apart ::)
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 08, 2014, 04:40:32 pm
  If you push the reflex too far with Maple/Ipe the Ipe WILL tear the Maple in half, even under sinew.





Push any wood to far and you will tear it apart ::)
Some of them just crush and lose spring without tearing apart....
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 11, 2014, 11:31:18 am
Today I go to tepelik bending, I make litlee more bend tepelik, and thys is photo bending arm,
No crack and delamination,
Bow go to 60-70 lbs draw weight
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: Blaflair2 on December 11, 2014, 01:13:29 pm
Why r u putting deflex into it?
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 11, 2014, 01:42:22 pm
Thys is no deflex putt, thys is traditional methody hornbow tylering
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 11, 2014, 02:10:06 pm
He's just getting it bending.
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 14, 2014, 06:58:51 pm
Any updates? The siyah grain configuration looks a bit ominous...
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 18, 2014, 12:49:32 pm
Hi
Thys is a litlee udpade, litlee tiller and photo, the sijah grain be good, ;)
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: kamil2910 on December 23, 2014, 07:56:20 am
I go to tiller, and its go to good
, by limb go twist and I must heat bend
Title: Re: Problem with laminated hungary bow
Post by: PatM on December 23, 2014, 05:18:52 pm
Certainly looks the part. I wouldn't heat it much. Probably you would be able to manually twist the limb to straighten it and train it to be more in line.