Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Billbob on January 31, 2015, 09:16:34 pm
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Santa brought me a python snake skin. :D I never backed a bow before. It's 8 feet long and about 6.5" wide. It's tanned and still has scales. I usually use hickory, but was thinking of trying a different wood like Osage. What would be the best way to lay this skin out that I don't waste it but have the pattern look right? Does it matter that it's tanned and do you need to remove the scales?
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Here's what the skin looks like.
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Tanned snake skin is not the best thing to use for a bow backing.
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I would prefer raw skin but cant thinknof a reason not to use tanned skin? Its so thin anyway it doesnt add anything but looks.
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Python is probably thicker than a rattler but I'd use it if i had it
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I would make a bowcase or a quiver out of that and get a raw skin for the bow.
Very pretty skin btw :)
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I agree with adb. Don't put that on your bow. I've had bad luck with tanned skins staying on a bow long term. You can de grease them and put them on like usual but there is no guarantee they will stay put.
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I was afraid that it being tanned would be an issue. :(
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Well as far as the tanned skin goes. I agree that a air dried skin would be easier and better. But I'm a pore/cheap Bowyer. I've used tanned skins almost every time I put them on a bow. The thing about them are, you have to do a little more work when putting them on. First of all, take some tape or something sticky and remove as much of the "tanned" part on the back that is loose and will come off. That step is important, if you don't, it will peal right off like velcro after its glued to your bow.
Next, before your ready to apply the skins, most people soak them in water. DON'T DO THAT with a tanned skin. I take a damp wrap and wipe down the tanned side while applying a little pressure. This softens the skin a little and finishes removing any loose pieces. Then I let the skin dry.
Next, I take the skin a "flex" it around to make sure that the water didn't make any stiff areas in it. I will sometimes use the tape again just to be certain that all the loose particles are gone.
Now you are ready to figure out your pattern on your bow that you want. You can cut the skin down a bit. But leave it with enough that you have some room for adjustment.
When your ready and you have test fitted your skin. Prep the back of your bow for gluing. I use PatB's method. Wash the back with dawn dish soap and rinse with boiling water. I use tight bond 3 to apply the skin. First apply a thin coat of glue to both the bow and the skin to "size" them. The skin will such up a good bit of the glue. Be sure to get the glue on every part of the surface that you want the skin to be glued to. Do your best not to get glue on the wrong side of the skin.
Once the glue has dried to a very tacky state. Apply a fair layer of glue to both pieces and carefully apply the skin to the back.
Work from the handle to the tip pressing and smoothing out any air bubbles and clumps of glue. Keep doing this till you have a nice smooth application. Then repeat for the other side.
It's a good idea to clean up any excess glue before it starts to set up. Also don't move the skin after it is tacky. This will screw up the adhesion.
I let mine set for about a week in a dry warm location. Then I use the smooth side of my farriers rasp at a downward angle to "file" off and clean up the edges. Always work from the back to the belly at a slight angle. I also use a card scraper to clean up only the glue on the edges of the bow. You will know if the glue is cured, if it scrapes like wood. If not set it up for a few more days. I also us a sanding block to help clean up the edges.
I have never had a tanned skin come loose with this process. One of them on a bow has probably been shot 2000 times. Hope this helps.
P.S. Nice skin, if you don't want it you could send it to me! :laugh: Patrick
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Lol..thanks for the help. I thought my biggest problem would be wasting all the skin by centering the skin on the bow. Looks like it will be a little extra work, but it looks like I can use it. Now I just need to make a bow to use it on.
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Lol, you can center the design on a bow as well. Just glue it on down the center. Then when it's dry use a razor knife to trim it off. Just be careful with the glue. Good luck with the bow. Here you are doing the finish work before you even have it shooting! :laugh: Patrick
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:) I know I might be jumping the gun a little bit. Trying to decide if I want to try my hand at making a bow from something other than hickory. Living in south central PA, I have trouble keeping hickory dry. Maybe get some osage. Have some black locust in the barn I might try. Since my Dad gave me that skin, I was hoping I could use it.
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I would love to have some black locust. And it would look awesome with that skin on it.
Well don't send it to me if your dad gave it to you. Maybe put it on a bow and tribute it to him. Patrick
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I've used tanned skins once or twice and the problems I had was the tanned skin is like a sponge and will hold too much glue and moisture. This will give it extra physical weight which can slow the recovery of the limbs, reducing cast.
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I have a tanned rattler on a bow ...looks awesome no issues..but a python is too thick IMO...tanning thickens skin even more since the solution soaks in skin and swells it some...what I had to do to mine was soak in hot water with dawn dishwashing liquid till it cools...them rinse really well and tack out to dry as if a fresh skin...seemed to remove that tanning process but the skin if it had scales are gonna be there for good...gut
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I think I might be able to shave a little of the thickness off, but since there are scales on it, I guess they can't come off since it has been tanned? I'm not worried about losing a couple fps, just want to make sure it will stay on the bow and that the scales won't hurt anything. Thanks a lot for all the help on this.
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Yeah, if you try to take the scales off you will take the colors off as well. Patrick
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you can't remove the scales once its been tanned..they are on for good now..trying to thin skin is futile... like I said I used a rattler which is much thinner to begin with than a python.it ended up being about the thickness of an air dried python.. honestly.. I'd get another skin that is air dried....gut
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I can't imagine they would leave the scales on in the tanning process. Are you sure you aren't just seeing the pattern where the scales once were?
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I can't imagine they would leave the scales on in the tanning process. Are you sure you aren't just seeing the pattern where the scales once were?
How about soaking the skin in hide glue and pressing it between boards to dry? Never done it, but that collagen is part of what was removed or broken down by the tanning process. That would press it flat and consolidate it, but you'd probably only get one chance to try it. Meh.
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If you could get the boards apart. >:D Patrick
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Probably make more sense to soak in hide glue them apply to bow back immediately.
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Probably make more sense to soak in hide glue them apply to bow back immediately.
Just an idea. Plastic sheeting to keep the boards from sticking. I was wondering if maybe this process would take ssome of the 'fluff' out of the leather. Then you could do the dry rawhide backing method ala Dean Torges. In a TBM article he dampens the skin, sizes both wood and rawhide with hide glue, and sticks em together with a little heat.
I haven't done this, though, so I know nothing.
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why use boards when thumb tacks are all you need and air....the scales are accentuated in a tan skin...meaning they are proud and stand out ..the actual scale maybe gone but trust me where the scale was you can pick it and it won't come off... if you must try the python do as I recommend and soak in hot water with dawn dish washing liquid , rinse well and tack out on a board with thumb tacks...do not stretch skin..once air dried you can rehydrate and cover skin and limbs with titebond 111.....apply as air dried skin...gut..
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Looked at the skin last night and I think I was just seeing where the scale used to be. There is a lot of "fluff" on the tanned side. I'll try to get as much of that off and degrease with dawn. If I make a bow this spring/summer that I like, I'm going to give the python a try. Might try to glue it down with contact cement. Seems to hold tight and it's flexible when cured. Anybody else use contact cement before?
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A buddy of mine used masters cement for leather when he glued one on a glass bow several years ago. Still on there tight. Big thin is to be sure to get a good bond with minimal glue and air pockets. I personally wouldn't use it on a wood bow though. I would us tight bond 3 like I stated before. Patrick