Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: make-n-break on January 21, 2017, 03:45:05 pm
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Here's a set of 5 Western Red Cedar target arrows with 2 matched hunting arrows. The shafts were turned from a board on my Simple DIY router jig Version 2.0 which can be found on page two of https://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,56341.15.html
I used to put a ton of time into customizing my arrows with cresting, unique wraps, etc.; but the last 2 or 3 years I've preferred a plain Jane, get-r-done arrow. Mostly because I break and lose a lot of arrows! It doesn't sting as much to break arrows that take 30 minutes each vs. 2+ hours.
23/64 Diameter
60-65# spine
11/32 glue on points
Self nocks
5" Wild turkey feathers - target arrows are stripped, hunting arrows split and sanded.
Fletched with Bitz w/ straight clamp and trimmed with scissors
Artificial sinew wraps
Boiled Linseed Oil finish
These fly nicely out of a 70# Osage bendy handle. I've found that it takes a very tight grained piece of WRC to make a shaft suitable for hunting weight bows. They also break easier than other species when impacting or deflecting off hard objects. This set turned out nice but I'll probably abandon WRC in the future.
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Here's a set of HD Garden Stake bamboo target arrows.
11/32 at the base
5/16 at the nock
70-75# spine
5" wild turkey feathers, stripped.. Bitz w/ straight clamp
Self nocks
Artificial sinew wraps
No finish applied
These were made for a 75# hickory pyramid with intentionally offset limbs. The bow is very close to center-shot. Bamboo takes too long to make for my taste, but they sure are durable! I've grown to prefer turned lumber shafts but I still like a good bamboo/cane arrow.
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Here's my first go at a set made of Mahogany. I think it makes a visually pleasing arrow shaft with a unique look.
I've never tried mahogany and got the inspiration from a website I saw offering premium mahogany shafts that had good reviews.
Haven't spined them yet because I'm in the middle of a big move to a new house/shop.. but the hand flex test is gonna guess ballbark 75#, give or take 10#, at 21/64 diameter. They feel very dense and straighten easily. I have confidence that they'll make a nice arrow and I'll be sure to post them up with a review once I get them fletched up.
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Very nice arrows and shafts. I have some black walnut heartwood shafts that work well also.
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Nice Arrows!
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Very nice.
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Very nice arrows.
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Nice arrows make-n-break thanks for posting. Your shafts look real nice to.
Bjrogg
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Nice arrows and shafts. I have used wrc quite a few times as well. I find the nice old growth, tight ringed stuff is more brittle than the lighter colored, thick ringed stuff. Have you noticed a difference? Cheers- Brendan
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Thanks everyone!
Pat - I've always wanted to try black walnut but the specialty lumber store here is very proud ($$) of their walnut. I've had my eye out though.
Brendan - I have never tried the thick ringed stuff. I thought the boards felt lighter when compared to the real tight stuff. I may have to give it a try.. at $3.50 a board it's no big deal if it doesn't work out!
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They look great , they should get the job done. :)
Pappy
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Oh man, those bamboos are some lookers and they seem really straight. I can't seem to get rid of kinks at the nodes. And I have a ton of bamboo stakes, so I guess it will be a while of trying to make bamboo arrows.. I'd like to see the bow. They must really scream out of a 75# pyramid...
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Here you go Loon. I can't get a FD but it's the same bow I posted a little bit back titled "Hickory Pyramid 74@28". I toasted the bottom limb to correct prop twist and it went up to 77# but it settled at 75#. I later reworked the handle to make it a floppy rest and intentially offset the limbs with steam just for a fun experiment. It's nothing special. No stain, no decorations..just a plain function-only hickory board pyramid..but it shoots nice.
My image resizer ruins the quality of my photos but hopefully you can see in the third pic that the offset limbs make it closer to center shot.
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Awesome, thanks
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I later reworked the handle to make it a floppy rest and intentially offset the limbs with steam just for a fun experiment.
After you offset the limbs did you have to change the spine of the arrows?
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DC it's my first time trying offset limbs and I haven't done enough testing on arrow spine. Right now the bows on my rack are between 65# and 75# so all my arrows are matched to those weights.
The only thing I can say at this point is that before I offset the limbs I was having trouble with 60# spine being too weak, and 75# spine being too stiff and deflecting off the handle. After offsetting the limbs everything from 60-75# spine is flying close enough that I can't tell the difference in flight behavior other than the drop from the differences in weight.
I've got a hackberry bow roughed out right now and I'm gonna offset it too, but I'm in the middle of moving to a new house/shop. I'll be testing more extensively when I get settled in.
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very pretty arrows, nice job.
do you mind sharing what sort of artificial sinew and binder or glue you make those wraps with? they have a nice look to them
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great bow- and really sweet arrows- all of them! i just love floppy rests.
yup WRC can be a bit brittle, for me, a good test with a prospective arrow wood, is to see how easily a nice straight ,clear piece splits- this will help a person identify the prevelance of the connective intergrain fibers, not to be confused with the rays- which radiate outwards from the heart-perpendicular to the grain, but these microsopic fibers run between the long "grain " fibres- and really hold the wood together, they are what give a wood split resistance. WRC and Larch, split really easily. POC is a little tougher, Spruce is really tough to split. Pine is tough too. Sitka Spruce is considered the strongest wood in the world for its weight!! i geuss thats why they like it for airframes and masts and spars on sailing vessels.
But having said that- i have seen quite a few folks use WRC- after all you only need it for one shot , eh? ;) i am really impressed that you achieved that high of a spine- must be a super nice piece of wood!
where are you based, that you have access to WRC?
those mahoganies look really nice too!
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willie - It's just your garden variety "artificial sinew" that can be found on eBay or Amazon. I use the kind they call "natural" color. It comes in 1/4 pound spools and one spool lasts a really long time. It's cheap too. I use regular ole liquid super glue to bind the wraps. It's been a durable combination for me and looks cool too.
TSA - It was the only board I've ever gotten that high of spine from and the growth rings were real tight. I don't have that much luck with it usually and they almost always come in under spine. I see what you mean by testing a straight, clear piece. The WRC does split unusually easy. I actually lose a couple shafts per batch that break while straightening if there's even the slightest grain runout. I don't have access to natural WRC here in Southeast Nebraska. I use kiln dried stuff. I actually ended up breaking all but 2 of those arrows the very next outing. I've decided to abandon it as a shaft material because they seem to break for the most ridiculous reasons.
We do have tons of ERC here but it's even less suitable for arrows. I'm not brave enough to try an ERC bow just yet but I've been mustering up the courage to try a hickory backed ERC.
I never thought to try Spruce. Does it make a good shaft? We do have some Spruce growing around here but they're not all that common and I don't want to fell a live one. I'm anxious to try the Mahogany. Sounds like they make a pretty decent shaft. I also turned a half dozen hickory in 21/64 the other day but dang they are heavy... really heavy... haha.
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the toughest thing is going to be to get wood that has not seen the inside of a kiln- that does phenomenal damage to the cells- i see it in red oak board bows- whereas a red oak stave is by far superior.
the kilns are under such high demand to get wood turned around- that is always the bottleneck in an operation- they force steam into the wood, they apply high heat- they can dry wet wood off the saw down to store moisture quality, literally in days! a load of 2x4's can be done in 24hrs!!!! in the big "spaghetti mills".
back to your dilemma, ash might be a very good option ( lighter than hickory), pine,sitka spruce will be better than all the other spruce's- not saying the other spruces wont work. tamarack/larch is a good option. of course fir or hemlock ( both on a par), yellow cedar will work a lot better than red cedar- its pretty tough, its actually a Cypress, not a cedar- "Alaskan Cypress", the trick is going to be to find clear, tight grained wood.
what trees do you have growing locally- that you might find a blowdown. blowdowns are good options, 'cos if the rootwad lifts when the tree falls it helps keep the main stem elevated- and will delay the rotting process significantly- i would avoid bug killed wood!
maple makes very good shafts too heavier- but you can possibly get high enough spines out of a 5/16 shaft- and of course the mahoganies- some mahoganies are from planted sustainable forests- some are old growth- you need to clearly identify the species to know.
http://www.wood-database.com/wood-articles/mahogany-mixups-the-lowdown/
if i were in your shoes- with limited supply- i would look to ash and maple- both readily available, should deliver higher spines, and even though they have been kiln dried- they are tough enough that they should still make serviceable arrows.
what about poplar- i believe yellow poplar makes good shafts, and of course birch- we have the paperbark birch here- and it makes great shafts- once again check your species in your area- and ask the guys on here, there is a lot of experience on this forum- talented people pushing all types of natural materials to the limits!
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Thank you for that info TSA. Very helpful. I do have poplar and when I find nice pieces I do like making arrows with it. They seem to be easy to straighten and quite durable. Poplar is one of my favorites. I think it has a nice in-between weight as a "soft hardwood". Not real heavy and still light enough to get some good speed. I've tried maple too and liked it, but it's hard for me to find a serviceable piece.