Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: BowEd on March 03, 2017, 07:49:28 pm
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A question here regarding choices made.Different viewpoints wanted.For reasons of longevity.Say you've made a bow.It's very close to even tillered.It matters neither way which way it's shot.String alignment is dead center to handle.You have one limb with slightly more reflex than the other though at rest.Thickness dimensions are exactly the same in each limb.For positive tiller do you weaken the reflexed one for more bend for the top limb?Or Do you weaken the flatter profiled limb for the top limb?This is assuming the bottom limb will take more abuse over time because of the position the arrow is nocked on the string and the draw pull underneath with the split finger shot.My arrow shelf is approximately 1.75" above center on handle.In the past I've put the flatter profiled limb on the bottom.
This is an age old decision everyone has to make.
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Very interesting question. My first thought would be to put the reflexed limb on the bottom because with the continual stress from the reasons you described it may eventually loose some of reflex over time, thus creating a more balanced profile. Just my initial thoughts and I'd love to have someone prove me wrong.
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The reflexed limb would be easier to stay closer the string positive tiller wise that's for sure on the bottom.I can see your point and the balancing out reason too over time..
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the more reflexed limb has traveled further to get to even, so it is.........weaker?
I would not be inclined to make it the bottom, and the crystal ball at the bowyers bar might have an anwser for "how much", should you choose to add positive tiller at this time. If you shoot it "as is" with the more reflexed limb up, and the reflex pulls out, you should be able to see it happen.
disclaimer: WAGFW
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I would go with the stiffer limb as the bottom.
No positive tiller on symmetrical bows.
uneven reflexed limbs cause uneven brace tiller aka pseudo-positive tiller
I would take it in the hands, close eyes, feel how the limbs want go - that one that bends further to the archer is the upper.
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I would go with the stiffer limb as the bottom.
No positive tiller on symmetrical bows.
uneven reflexed limbs cause uneven brace tiller aka pseudo-positive tiller
I would take it in the hands, close eyes, feel how the limbs want go - that one that bends further to the archer is the upper.
Me too :)
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Thanks fellas.It was an assurance question....lol.I do always go with the stiffer at the bottom in the past of course,but at brace and at full draw they can look then feel different.In that order.
Over time any weaker limb will reveal itself.Working it plenty on the tree helps,with longer bracing times.
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Thing is only the maker can know the tendencies of the wood in the bow there making as tillering progresses.
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That's what I do.i try to get the tiller dead even. But if I don't want to loose any weight and one limb is not more than 1/4 " off at brace I take the greatest distance at fade and make that my top limb. Then I cut my shelf a 1-1/4" above center. Arvin
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Sometimes non intentionally a limb can have more reflex before tillering or say doing a character stave,or say tillering a reflexed bow that has slightly more reflex on one limb than the other.The reflexed limb can be weakened to be the top limb to even tiller it.Or it can get put into the bottom limb too.I always thought even with symmetrical limbs because of the slight pressure difference of pulling on the string the bottom limb takes more abuse.By putting the flatter profiled limb on the bottom it would be able to with stand for the long term the abuse,but wood removal from the reflexed limb does make it weaker but in position to not take the strain.
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Yes Selfbowman.I do that too always.
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Always make the bow the way it grew in the tree. That way you don't have to debate which limb goes where. ;)
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I think it depends on the bow and how it is shooting,,
the string may be down the center,, but one of the limbs as top limb will probably shoot better or be easier to tune, or shoot a wider range of spine,,
I have found that it may "look". one way,, as far as string alignment ,,,but shooting the bow will tell you otherwise,,
so that would be my main determining factor and I would adjust the tiller if needed,,, putting the stiff limb where ever the bow shot best,,
if that was on top I would probably adjust the tiller if needed to get a bit of positive tiller,,
I usually put a limb that has a bit more reflex on the top,, in my experience,, after a lot of hard shooting, ,the limb with the most reflex is most likely to give in a bit or shift a bit,,, if it is on top,, and the tiller becomes a bit more positive,,then little or no adjustment may be needed to shoot well,,,,, if that limb is on the bottom,, and gives in a bit,, you have lost your positive tiller,, and it could effect the way the bow is shooting,, a longer bow is not as sensitive,,, but if the bow is a bit short,, the tiller may have to be adjusted to get perfect arrow flight,,,
that being said,, good points above,, that is just my preference based on my experience,,and have not doubt there are many ways to skin cat in this situation :)
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I actually have the arrow pass at 1.25 in. though that may vary according to tiller requirements. These days I would also reflex the other limb the same amount.
Usually, though, I put the stronger limb on the bottom.
Good point made above that both limbs should move just about the same distance no matter.
Jawge
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Always make the bow the way it grew in the tree. That way you don't have to debate which limb goes where. ;)
That means with Vine Maple I would have to cant the bow ;D ;D
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From what I've seen,deflex limbs are stronger than reflexed ones.a straight limb also has the edge.reflex on top is my choice.
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Thanks fellas for the insight.I should of said this prospective bow is sinewed with fairly extreme reflex reversed braced.The measurements from back to string match along each same point to each other within 1/8" but when set standing on it's belly one limb is around an inch higher.
No decisions need to be made yet because tillering it is quite aways away timewise.
I've done it both ways before top or bottom.Just wondering what you all thought about a decision like that.I see Pat M chose the ala natural view point.That's cool....lol,but that does'nt make any difference to me either or the bow for that matter.
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When this bow sets dead flat on it's belly on a desk top and I'm sure the belly of the handle is flat and even too.Tips up one tip is 1" higher than the other from the surface of the desk top it's sitting on.I'm assuming it has more reflex in the higher set tip limb.It was tillered before sinewing to an even brace and that's it.As I said measuring along the reverse bracing comparing there is only maybe 1/8" difference along the same points along each limb comparing them.I can't make any decisions yet until after tillering as to which limb is on top or the bottom.The bow is 58" long.
I feel as long as the arrow draws in a straight line to full draw it should'nt shoot high or low but with good arrow flight.Going back to what you said Brad I'll need to tune on the bow shooting arrows to see what it does.Make a decision then.Keeping the handle usable for shooting both ways.
Upon further inspection I suspended the bow on it's belly of the limbs between a 3' wide set apart pegs.Measuring now the difference is'nt that much between the height of the 2 tips.Only 1/4" in height.I'm just wondering how the pressure points on my bow hand are going to feel as to whether it might shoot high or low.I know I'm making this more complicated then it should be.Just shoot the bow in when it cures and let the chips fall were they may.
Thanks for the comments.
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For sure, I think you are right that the proof will be in the pudding at this point. With as little difference as there is, moving your grip up or down the bow a half inch or gripping it with more of your palm-heel down will make that much difference. Just rock it in your hand, and feel around a little as you pull it to partial draw will tell you what's next.
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Yes my thoughts exactly.
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I finally figured out or it dawned on me why one tip of the reversed strung bow was higher with the bow setting on the belly of the handle after studying it better.The one limb has a suttle slight deflex coming out of the fade.Distance between string and back is the same for both limbs yet.
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sounds like a good plan bet it gonna shoot great, with either limb up,,making the decision even more difficult :D :G
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Too many decisions.That's why I'm not the best finish man.....lol.