Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: paulc on November 12, 2018, 04:45:49 pm
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Spend a really nice fall afternoon playing on the new stave horse my wife got me for my bday. Works really well and reducing a staff with the draw knife was really enjoyable. The wood is hickory that has been cut for a year. Any suggestions on a simple first bow from scratch on my own design? The stave has a bit of a kink in it so one end jags pretty hard to the side. Left side lines up where the right side should line up. The limbs currently are 1" think back to belly. No other reducing done yet.
Peace, Paul
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1st pic
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pic 2
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That's a very thoughtful wife. Nice birthday present. Did she figure that out herself? Or did someone have to drop her a hint? Either way nice.
Bjrogg
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Take the limbs parallel out about 8" then taper to 3/4" at the tips. You can reduce the tips more later. Now, start reducing the belly until both limbs bend evenly and together. Post lots of pics of your progress and ask lots of question. Good luck. :OK
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That's a nice looking shavehorse! I like the grain on it.
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Very cool man! Hbd...
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That is a nice shaving horse. I have one similar with the saw horse leg brackets I made years ago from an article in PA Magazine. I've gotten many years of service from it.
Your wife is very thoughtful.
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Great birthday present! She knows where to find you now :BB (lol)! Happy Birthday, by the way! Not sure about a simple first self design, though, especially with a somewhat wonky stave! I had enough trouble following Comstock's basic starter pattern! Relearned a lot and learned a lot more! Like Pat said, post lots of pictures and ask lots of questions. The only dumb question is the one you don't ask!
The wood will take you where it wants to go!
Hawkdancer
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Nice present :)
A shave horse certainly makes working on staves a deal easier
Del
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Trying a new photo edit app...hopefully this works. Trying to show the curve in this hickory stave. Need help on what to do. Not worry about the curve or twist? I could maybe bend the handle so tips line up better?
Help please. Paul
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Another pic.
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3rd pic, should be of belly
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Dandy looking piece of hickory.Like our shaving horse too.Hickory will steam bend pretty easy.It's more stubborn especially using dry heat than osage but doable.
The BBS book 2 shows methods to align your tips steaming and with C clamps.Chapter on bending wood page 155 done by Paul Comstock.Pictures and all showing it better than I could explain it.
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I'd wait til I was at or very near first brace and see how the string tracks. That way you have a lot less wood to try to bend plus you might be able to bend a little here or there instead of the whole bow.
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Still working on reducing this stave. Have begun wondering if maybe I should address the back now and ensure it is sound. Not sure how to do that, dont really want to back bow if I dont have to. Should I try to chase a ring? Attached is pic of divets that are scattered along back.
Thanks, Paul
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The whole back.
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Yep, that back needs attention, and you will have to chase a ring. Now is the best time; otherwise you won't know where to stop removing wood from the other side. Go slow and make sure you have good lighting.
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Thoughts please...I've read twice now in other sources that say I dont need to chase a ring and I dont need to back hickory...when guys buy hickory backing from a vendor do they chase a ring? Couple of pics to follow including the 2 or 3 spots where my scrapper hasn't gone deep enough to clear out the shellac-i figure I really shouldn't be digging that stuff out unless I'm committing to backing?
Thanks for whatever you can offer. Paul
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Pic 2
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Pic 3
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Pic 4. You can see clearly where I screwed the pooch trying to work the handle area w draw knife....literally 3td bite w knife and it jumps to lower side of handle and pulled a giant splinter.....
Paul
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Opps! Don't you hate it when that happens? Luckily, I had plenty of wood left and shifted to the rasps and scraper, just took a lot longer to finish. Good luck recovering that handle!
Hawkdancer
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You get that hickory from LE Enterprises?
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Sounds familiar....Ebay purchase. I guess you know something of them? P
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Yeah, I bought six staves from him last fall. They are all really straight, no knots, and pretty fine pieces of wood. However, they were sopping wet and had been cut less than two weeks when he shipped them. There was no way I could use them for the bowmaking class I had scheduled, so I had to scramble up some cured osage from good people here in P.A. (dang, what a great bunch of people)
It does appear he was a little rough with the draw knife taking off the bark and cambium, so all six staves have violated backs. I guess since he is NOT a bowyer and generally deals with osage, he does not know this could be a problem with white woods. I guess I will just have to back these with rawhide, sinew, or maybe even bamboo? I just don't feel like chasing rings on whitewoods and I am too paranoid to go with violated growthrings.
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I bought 4 last fall, been sitting since. Beside this hickory I have 2 hackberry, one w bark on, and 1 mulberry. I honestly haven't looked too close at the other staves recently. I will report out when I do.
I sorta tried to chase a ring on the hickory but yeah....TOUGH.
If this things blows I will certainly let you know.
Paul
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I just left the back alone on my hickory, but it was well seasoned and ready to go, and I didn't know any better! Got 250 arrows down range and seems to be holding up. Got to take some pics and post, or it is a figment of my imagination! :BB >:D! Maybe before MOJAM!??
Hawkdancer
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My other staves....the mulberry is way more crooked now then it was when it arrive a year ago...not sure what the solution is for those of us that can't make it to get togethers to trade/buy in person and don't have access to collect our own. I don't think I paid more than $40 including shipping for any of these so seems like not too bad an option if you are up for a challenge.
And while not violated bad (the hack isn't but actually the mulberry looks pretty bad), both will either need to be chased or backed. But that is a challenge for the new year!
Peace
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the mulberry....does mulberry steam well? To straighten the dog leg...
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Aaaah, mulberry my most hated/loved woods! Loved because you can chase a ring, it is beautiful and strong. Hated because every stave I ever had was plumb infested with clusters of pin knots and I had limited experience.
Take your time chasing a flawless ring and treat like you would osage. Just give yourself an extra quarter to three-eighths inch width and an inch or two extra length. Dry mulberry responds to dry heat or steam. I would recommend you double coat it with shellac if you are going to steam dry mulberry, though. You can later scrape off the shellac with a sharp knife, sand it off with sandpaper, or wash it off with an alcohol soaked rag. But the shellac will be a little insurance against the light checking that can come with steam and dry wood.
The hackberry stave with the bark on looks as if it will have some character. How in love with it are you? Hmmmm? Hmmm?
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Not touched either yet except to put them in the rafters...I have read good things about both woods. Hopefully I can get something out of them beyond a learning experience.
Peace
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Morning All, latest pics of my hickory stave. Not sure of my next step...move tips over by shaping to get them lined up better? Or should I try to bend the bow at handle to get the tips lined up? The bow is not only bent side to side but also twists in one limb. When I attempt to draw it, it wants to roll in my hand. And I have plenty of wood left; the tips are at least 3/4" and the limbs barely bend. Lots of wood to remove...thanks for the help.
Paul
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two more pics.
Thanks!
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Steam bend it in the handle. Don't worry about that bit of twist. The rotating in your hand is caused by the string misalignment. A caveat here. I have no experience with hickory so dry heat may work to bend the handle. Wait for more input.
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I usually use dry heat to straighten Hickory, steam will work also but if it is close to bow size I rub with cooking oil and heat. Most white wood stave's will bend like that if they are split to narrow and green and left unattended to dry. I guess when people are selling them they try to get all they can out of them. When I cut them I leave in at least 1/4 log or maybe 1/2 depending on size of the tree for at least a few months before splitting to stave size. I also cut in spring or summer so the bark just peels off , so no violation of the back. Guess if you are buying them green on line you may want to buy them in the summer. ;) Chasing a ring on Hickory is sometimes pretty tough, but it is tough wood and will stand a little violation as long as it isn't off the edge. Good luck with that one, looks like it will make a bow.
Pappy
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You can take the tips down some more and follow EDS advice on the the bible pic.i bent alot of wood using that method.
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Pappy, can you talk a bit more about process using cooking oil and dry heat? How hot am I making the bow? I dont want to toast it right?
Also, any tips on chasing a ring on hickory? This back was definitely violated at least a little. I only scrapped the back enough to get rid of gouges, tried to scrape full length of back but gave up finding/chasing a ring. Does rubbing w alcohol or an oil or something bring out the contrast between rings?
Thanks all! Enjoy the holiday week.
Paul