Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: WhistlingBadger on July 04, 2021, 07:05:22 pm
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Dang it! I finally pulled this new bow to full draw and it's 10# under weight! And still some tillering work to do, so it'll get even a little bit lighter yet. So, can't use this one to hunt elk, just like my last one. Dozens of hours of work shot down the toilet, just like that. crud, crud, CRUD.
So, ok. Problem solving mode. I could take an inch off each end; how much would that bring it up? Is it worth doing? Would that strain the limbs too much? The alternative is either give it to somebody for a deer bow, or use it for firewood.
About the bow: 65" ntn, hickory backed with deer rawhide with antler nock overlays, drawing (it hurts me to type it again) about 48# @ 27". Sudbury-type front profile. Heat-treated to about 2.5" reflex; holding straight when first unstrung, regaining an inch or so of reflex after sitting a while.
I need it to draw at least 55# to hunt elk legally (and practically). It it worth trying to fix?
THanks--T
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I draw 62 inch bows back to 28 all the time. I see no reason a 65 inch bow can't be shortened up to bring the draw weight up. Cut 1.5 off each tip and if that doesn't do the trick, heat treat the bow to get the weight the rest the way up.
All that is assuming you aren't already taking significant set.
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Get a string on early and go in at 80lbs. Should be no issue but getting string on first time depending how much reflex the blank has. Go slow dont over pull it in tiller. Boom, you got a 60lber and shoot it in to 55lbs. Draw weight is a relative thing for hunting 55@ what length? 40lbs kill an elk like 30-06 you slide it in right place same as 150lbs wont do diddly if you put in a bad spot. Have limbs that say 55lbs depends which riser they're on.
Draw that bow to 29" you got 55 i'll wager if it stacks a bit.
HH~
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1 inch off both sides will give you about 5#. Jawge
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Given that it loses all that reflex after unstringing it sounds overstrained. I could see you getting 55# but probably lacking in performance for a 55# bow.
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cut it off till you get the desired weight,, its worth a try,,will probably shoot great,
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Sounds like you and I are in the same boat my friend. I'm finishing up a new bow for this elk season, and it is 50# at 28. I'm debating whether to sinew back it or cut it down an inch or two. You mention something on here that got me thinking. Legally, you have to be shooting 55#, and I'm wanting a 57-59# bow, but I just cut a shelf in this new bow, put a string on it, and started flinging. The bow shoots great, and for whatever reason, I'm shooting the thing lights-out. I know for a fact that this 50# bow is a gracious plenty to drive an arrow clean thru the lungs of an elk, and I was debating just leaving it as is...until I read this and rememberd the legal aspect of it. So, how do they determine whether you are legal on a self-bow or any trad bow? I know that it'll pull >55 at 30". Hmmm. Regardless, sorry about the light bow...I truly fell your pain.
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Not sure I'd want to, but you could always go for option 3 and make it a Penobscot. :)
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10# underweight??? With not perfect tiller.....
start again :)
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Thomas, is this a board or stave? If it’s a board, you can pull the hide off and back it.
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+1 for starting a new one. Not a huge fan of shortening to the bare minimum to achieve weight on a bow I need to rely on.
If you’re consistently coming in under weight, start thicker and get that long string looking balanced early! Regardless of species, I taper blanks — 3/4” thick near the fades, 5/8” thick mid limb, and 1/2” thick at the tips.
Get it looking good on the long string asap, and then to low brace while it’s still a spine-cracker. I like that first low brace to “feel” HEAVY, because it often won’t be quite as heavy in reality as you anticipate. You’ll have plenty of thickness left to fine tune the look of the brace before you ever stress the wood to any significant degree.
If you can get it looking balanced at brace while it’s still plenty heavy, the battle is half over. Then, it’s just patiently scraping and weighing your way out to full draw, with minor adjustments along the way (SH)
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ok if you gonna start over, send me that one,, I will get the weight and make it shoot and pay the shipping both ways,, :D
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ok if you gonna start over, send me that one,, I will get the weight and make it shoot and pay the shipping both ways,, :D
You'll be working with my hickory again : ) maybe I'll send you some blanks to send bows back to me too
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;D
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Sorry for the late reply: My chromebook won't let me post to the forum and my big computer's on the blink. I've been reading all of this and thinking things over.
Thanks for all the tips, everybody. I just checked the regs and it's actually 50# for elk, not 55. I'm guessing it will settle around 45 after I final tiller tweaks and settling in. So it's close. HH is right; a good-shooting 40 pounder will certainly do an elk, but I try to stay on the right side of the regulations unless they cause me to violate my principles. The pound limit is annoying and rather pointless, but I still want to stick as close to the law as I can. I'm tempted to just shave a bit off the tips and call it close enough. I'm worried about overstraining, too, though. So I might just finish this one up, call it a learning experience, and start over.
Goof-ups are learning experiences so I'm not too upset about it. Only trouble is I don't have much bow wood to play with around here. I have one more of Allyn's hickory logs, and Timbo is fixing to send me another one. I've also been collecting chokecherry saplings, but my skills aren't quite ready to take those on yet. So I feel bad about using a good stave and not making it count. Also, elk season is coming up so I need to get a good bow in hand.
Airkah, I've looked at your bows and decided it would take me less time to just plant a hickory seed and grow a new tree. ha ha ha
Anyway, I'm figuring it out. I know what went wrong on this one--a bad tiller tree design didn't allow me to get to full draw/weight soon enough, so I was guessing and didn't find out I was wrong until it was too late; also, the guy who makes my strings kept sending me the wrong length so I couldn't get it braced until way too late in the process.
So, I'll be making a longer tiller tree this week, and I got some good Irish linen thread so I can start learning to make my own strings. (brace yourselves for dumb questions about that) I'll finish this dude up, see how it's pulling, and decide from there. Maybe I'll use it as a prototype to try out some unusual finishing ideas I've been kicking around. I'm learning a ton from this bow, so it isn't a waste. It is so much better than the last one; I wouldn't be ashamed to give it away. I'm just trying not to make the same mistake twice, even if I make all of them once. ha! I'm hoping that if I do that enough times, I'll eventually run out of mistakes and get a good bow.
Anyway, I really appreciate the input, contradictions and all. I'll keep you posted.
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HH made a point that I think I agree with, being that his posts are quite interesting but lyrical. I dont believe the key to hitting weight is getting to full draw early. That is a recipe for for problems. I believe the answer is getting to full draw weight early, with good tiller. If you hit 45# at 10 inches, with a 6 inch brace height, it is easy to extrapolate when you would hit 55#. If the tiller is good, you need only keep it good as you reduce, the thickness and increase the draw length. Tillering issues can always throw you a curve late in the game, but generally, if you are at 55# at 26 inches, shooting for 28 inches, your golden.
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ok so you hit the perfect weight at 28 inches,, 50#
so then when your in the field and draw it to 26,, and kill the elk at 45#,, then what,, ;D
I do agee with HH, draw it to 29 and call it good,, of coures keep making bows,, and get better at hitting the weight,, what ever works for you, thats the joy of making your own bows, make it like you want,,
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Well, I finished tweaking the tiller and put a few dozen arrows through it. I love the way this thing shoots--no hand shock at all, and really moves the arrows with some authority. At 10 yards, it's putting a 600 grain arrow about 8" into my block target and knocking it off the table! I really like the way it looks too. I'll have a few questions about my next design, as this one has lost almost all its reflex, which means the limbs are overstrained. Not sure what I did wrong there.
Final tiller was 43# @ 27". So, I'm disappointed that I missed weight, but really happy otherwise.
so then when your in the field and draw it to 26,, and kill the elk at 45#,, then what,, ;D
...draw it to 29 and call it good,,
Then I must turn myself in to Game and Fish and throw myself on the mercy of the friendly local warden. ;) But yeah, that's why it's kind of a dumb rule. I think it's just an easy way to keep morons from hunting elk with kiddie bows. I've never had a game warden stop and check my bow weight.
This one shoots like an elk bow, and with the kind of penetration it's giving me on the target, it would definitely do the job. I'm going to try to get another one done before summer's out, just because I really want one to come in at the weight I want. But this one looks great, shoots great, and taught me a lot...so I'll call it a success! Thanks for all the help.
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I think with practice you'll be able to make weight.
Give my site a check.
http://traditionalarchery101.com
Jawge
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Hey Whistling...didn't we talk about me getting you an osage stave last year? Its been a crazy year or so, and I forgot about having that convo with you...or someone that lives in the WRC. Man, if I'm remembering correctly and you live in the WRC, Im right down the road from you (relatively speaking). Where did you draw your elk tag? I drew the zone 7 type 1...what a way to solo intro into elk hunting, huh?! I will have two weeks off starting next Sunday at midnight, and I am planning on hitting the mountains to scout/train with my pack and some sandbags. Any mountain will do for the training part of it, so if you can meet me half way betwixt here and there, I can pick out the best stave I have as far as trying to get you one that will minimize fuss and get it to you. If you need it before then and can drive down for the day, come pick one out. I'm working my tail off to get one finished up too, so I feel your pain. Lemme know if that would help you out at all.
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Y'all speaking some strange language! (lol). You and WB are not too far out of the area for a get togetherness! Being older and wiser, I let the young guy do the driving game and packing out!
DHawkdancer
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Jawge--I think so, too. Thanks for the encouraging words.
SS--I didn't draw diddly squat this year! Didn't even draw a speed goat. So I'll be hunting the general areas. Area 7 should be pretty good--congrats on your draw. I hope we can hook up and drown a few flies. We could probably get your kids onto a brookie or two, if we're lucky.
Jerry, we do need to get together sometime.
Back to the bow--shot around 50-100 arrows (I lost track) and tiller still looks good. Inlayed an antler arrow pass that looks kind of cool. Removed all the tool marks and sanded 'er smooth. Going to try to get it stained and put a handle wrap on it today...then on to the next attempted 60 pounder. ha ha
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When do you start hunting Wonderful Wyoming? Archery Deer opens 1 Sept here in NE, through 31 Dec. Maybe a mini bow jam in Aug here before school starts? Got to get back to shooting soon! I plan to get some arrows down range at MOJam next week and keep practicing afterI get home - but the best laid plans of mice and oft times go awry!
Hawkdancer
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Sept 1 is archery opener. I worked it out where I'll be working and on call every day in August so I can have Aug 30 thru Sept 19 off. Yeah-boy! Going to do as much homework as possible, push my marriage to the brink with gear purchases, shoot as much as possible, hike with sandbags up and down any hill within call range, and go in with the intention of staying till I kill one or have to return for work. Seeing as I've never camped out alone a night in my life, I'll probably make it two days. But Huck Finn had me dreaming of such adventure since I was old enough to read, so I'm going to go in with a high degree of optimism.
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congrats on your bow,, next one will even be better ,, :)