Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: Fox on September 04, 2021, 11:53:44 pm
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my draw length seems to keep settling at 24" which I don't like, but I am so much more accurate at this short draw, when I'm drawing 27" I can't even hit the target, wheres I've got a 6" group out to 20 yards with a 24" draw... I really worry about arrow speed though, for hunting, my bows are all 50@26" so 45@24 ish... is that going to be okay for whitetail?
My next thought is that I should try shooting lower weight bows and 26-27" and see if I shoot better? 50# isnt uncomfertable at all and i've been shooting that weight for 2 years so it seems odd that it would be too heavy, but could that be my issue?
any insight to these issues would be wonderful :)
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You test drawlength on a bow that is very weak. Waste of time trying to do it on a heavy bow.
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IMO.
You will never shoot better with a longer draw until it becomes the draw you always use.
It's like trying to shoot left handed, you'll be hopeless... but if you continue to do it you will eventually become proficient.
It's not the "draw" so much as the aiming with a different anchor.
If you want to shoot with a longer draw, just do it and stop going back to the short draw.
It really is that simple...
Del
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What do you use for an anchor at each weight? At age 16 you still have some growing to do. It would be a shame to go through the exercise of changing your anchor, only to want to change it back in a couple years.
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Snap a cloths pin on your arrow just short of 24 inches ,and draw the bow to your full draw making sure your string arm is in a straight line to your bow (see Arny Moe, and Jim Blackmon utube). You have to use good back tension to achieve this.( J hook.) Once you have your form down your draw length will get longer, and you will be shooting accurate.Measure from inside of cloths pin to the arrow nock cut out . That will be your new draw length. Shoot a bare shaft with your feathered arrows to make sure your form is not breaking down with every group. If you want to shoot Howard Hill style refer to John Stewart utube.
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Sorry, I meant to say John Shultz not John Stewart showing how Howard Hill shot a bow. Both were amazing shots with longer string follow bamboo bows. Fluid motion release.
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Alright guys... My anchor point is always the same, it's always the corner of my mouth, but I can shoot 23" or 27" with this anchor point.....
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Alright guys... My anchor point is always the same, it's always the corner of my mouth, but I can shoot 23" or 27" with this anchor point.....
How??? :o
Do you move you head fore/aft or bend your bow arm... either is a recipe for inconsistency.
Or do you have a telescopically adjustable bowarm? :o
Del
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You must be scrunching over and/or bending your bow arm a lot to change that much. Try videoing yourself and see if you look funny!
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Alright guys... My anchor point is always the same, it's always the corner of my mouth, but I can shoot 23" or 27" with this anchor point.....
How??? :o
Do you move you head fore/aft or bend your bow arm... either is a recipe for inconsistency.
Or do you have a telescopically adjustable bowarm? :o
Del
(lol) (lol)
I’m not sure what I’m doing… (lol)
I think like you said crunching up Timbo, I’ll try videoing myself
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Alright guys... My anchor point is always the same, it's always the corner of my mouth, but I can shoot 23" or 27" with this anchor point.....
Something is deeply wrong with that, you are compromising your form somewhere to be able to anchor the same over a 4" draw length change.
Mark
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Yes something is going really wrong…. I really can’t hit anything anymore…. Getting worried as hunting season is getting close. I shot several hour over today and I can’t figure out my issue… after trying to make my DL longer now I can barely even hit the target, I’m wondering if I should’ve just let it be and shot From 24” where I was accurate….. definitely need some help :-\
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An accurate shot from a 45# bow with arrows tuned to that config is fine for deer. A bad shot from any weight bow is not. Seems like a no brainer to me
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Do what is comfortable....then practise.....don't keep searching foir a quick fix....there is no short cut to shooting well.....practise.....practise and then maybe practise some more.....but for goodness sake don't keep changing things or you will definately never become an accurate shooter.
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I would go golfing, or bowling or shoot some hoops. If you have a friend, have them pitch a baseball to you. Maybe you like tennis. If you’re not into sports, try chopping wood or knife throwing. In my experience, activities that require aiming and fluid body mechanics are all very similar and practicing one can help with the others, much like learning a new instrument will help your musicianship or learning a new language will help your poetry.
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As Don W says, 45# is good for deer. You may have been shooting that weight all along if you weren't thinking much about your draw length previously, so maybe your arrows are tuned that way, and not spined properly for the extra pounds when you haul it all the way back, which makes it seem like "you" can't shoot that way. If you are normally accurate with 24" and the arrows fly well there, I would take a couple of days off, do some projectile therapy like Boomhowzer says, and go back to shooting the way you were while trying to forget this whole thread. If, after hunting season, you want to extend your draw a bit, there is a lot of good advice here for that. There isn't anything wrong with a 24" draw if you are consistent and feel confident with it.
A couple other things that help me - when you start up again, go to something like 10-12 yards, pretend you have a shot on a deer, and shoot one arrow. If that still feels shaky, stand really close to the target (like a few feet), and ONLY think about your form. Ideally don't even look at the target (just don't shoot through your garage!). Do that until it feels good, natural, and stress-free. Then transfer that feeling to other distances.
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Maybe you form is wrong :fp
This is the way--Shoulders in line with the arrow
(https://i.imgur.com/y30XPfc.jpg)
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You hit the nail on the head Max. If he goes to the info I gave him above he will know the right,and wrong way to shoot.
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Thanks for all the good advice guys…. And yes I know for a fact it’s my form. I’ve done lots of research read a few books and watched a lot of videos…. So I know what it’s supposed to look like….. but not how to get it that way :P
I’ve been shooting for the past 4 years and the past 2 years I’ve shot atleast 4 times a week… every few months I start shooting really good, and then something happens with my form and I get all messed up, I don’t often wonder if it’s some not related to archery, like stress in normal life stuff ???
Anyway thanks for all the good advice I’ll take a few days off and throw some knifes :)
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Get a buddy to take a video, shoot with your long and your short draws, then correct one element at a time. If your form is really screwed up, change hands and start over. Also, check to see if you are shooting with your dominant eye. I have found that many people are shooting with their other eye, you are young enough to change easily, if necessary. Post your video so we can critique your form. As said, be comfortable with what you are doing.
Hawkdancer
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if you shoot through a chrono and design the bow for 24,, you will see arrow speed is not an issue, I have 24 inch draw bows shooting hunting weight arrows 180 fps,, yes enough for deer,,
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Remember that when you draw, the goal is to draw til you hit proper alignment. That proper alignment of your shoulders, your bow hand, and your draw forearm is your anchor point. Finger in the corner of your mouth or whatever else you use is just a touch point to remind you where your hand should go when you're in alignment, and for something like that to even be useful, your head position and really the position of your whole body needs to be the same consistently.
Search "clay hayes shooting form" and you'll get a series of great youtube videos that cover the different aspects of this. I know this close to season you don't want to be changing things, but if you don't have consistency now it's the right time to change because the sooner you start doing things right, the quicker you can get the reps in to be consistent and confident enough to hunt.
Wherever you land, good luck with it. Hope your fall is memorable for all the right reasons!
Ben
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proper alignment can be achieved with out an anchor,, depends on the shooting style and type of bow you are shooting,,
short draw bows are not made to hit anchor,, they are more suited to a Native American style of shooting,, and some say it takes more skill to achieve accuracy,, I would agree,,
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Thank you all for so much good advice and sources of information. I took a few videos and this is where my form is now, I'm shooting a 28.5" arrow so probably drawing 26". getting good accuracy out to 15 yards now, any suggestions on my form would be awesome :)
(hopefully, this link works correctly)
https://www.flickr.com/gp/141458655@N02/b2AD57
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I thought your form looked pretty good but I’m no expert. I’ve only been shooting bows for 2 or 3 yrs. I had a lot of trouble when I first started. I had 3 square bales stood on end next to each other. At 12 yds I had to make many trips into the field when the arrows completely missed the bales.
I don’t remember the you tuber that got me on a good path. What I do now is anchor my thumb behind my jaw bone and set the string in the center of my eyebrow. Any bow shorter than 64” does not touch my eyebrow correctly and my accuracy suffers.
Hope this helps but I suspect everyone has to find what works for them.
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When I was 16 I was drawing a 31” arrow to the back of the point. Of course I had no one around for coaching, so was pretty much a self starter as a young kid. I was anchoring middle finger at the corner of my mouth shooting split finger. As I got older, what I found out that I was rolling my draw arm shoulder back as I reached full draw thus overextending. Once I learned to keep everything in true alignment my draw settled in to around 28” to 28-1/2”.
Get your form right and don’t worry about your draw length. Like Bradsmith says, design your bow for your 24” draw and it will shoot with the best of them. As time goes on, if your draw length increases, build another bow.
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Are your patterns spread out horizontal?
When I try to extend my draw length, the arrows go left and right. Why? Because trying to expand that extra inch is kinda forced. The expansion I feel going longer is fake, and the pattern shows it.
I am 5' 10.5", and I draw 25.25, flat NA bend in handle weapon system. A lighter bow will show 26", but the heavier draw compacts me (I went through the draw length worry process a few years back. I called it the 'draw length wars', all fighting in my mind. Like my camouflage war, my broadhead war, my fletching size war, I finally settled into what works for me).
One guy on other sites said he screwed up his shooting bad when the internet came out, and he quit reading shooting posts for two years, just to get his groove back; he is well known, I assume.
So, I would do what the others say. Shoot that 26" style. If it goes back to 24" 25", as long as it is consistent, all good. Hunt with what works, and like the old Ryman Cat said once, hunt the shot. Meaning, look for where your form and range intersects deer. Honestly, people worry too much about inches, like feathers, draw length, etc, when most of us primitive archers make weapons of mediocre speed and so we are most likely in the typical 20 yards-and-in club of hunters. (not all of us, so do not flame me).
Hope this helps.
Best book I read, by the way, Jay Kidwell's Instinctive Archery Insights. Know thy trajectory.
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Looks pretty good to me, Fox. Nice natural motion, slight hesitation at full draw, good J follow through, looks like good alignment. I am not an archery coach, but if you are confident in your shooting, I would just stay with that form. Good luck!
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Thanks, Timbo :)
Stickmark, when I'm shooting bad my patterns are all over the place, up, down, left, right... :) I think I will try to read that book it sounds quite good! :)