Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: GregB on July 11, 2008, 08:11:41 am
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I've been getting all the information I can here lately on cane arrows since I've been making some. I've read several different ways the nodes are handled from...leaving them alone, sanding them flush with the shaft, reducing them with heat, etc.
I'd like to get more feedback on this part of the cane arrow making process discussing what you do and why concerning nodes. Please go into some detail if needed. Also, if you are working the node down...do you do it before, after, or during heat straightening?
Thanks!
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I'm with you on this matter Greg. I too am working my first batch and have read a lot of differing opinions from sanding them even to not at all. I realize that there is more than one way to do things, I just want the "greenhorn" fail safe method since I don't have access to local cane and don't want to waste what I have.
Thanks Tracy
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Greg, I usually work them down slick as a baby's butt-even with the shaft. I've heard people say that it weakens them, but I don't see it in actual practice. Believe it or not, my arrows often make "unscheduled impacts" with trees and rocks when I'm shooting 3D or hunting :) and so far, I've never broken a cane arrow. Never. I've splintered and destroyed loads of wooden ones, though. I've seen pics of bowstrings made from cane with the nodes smoothed down, and we all know how much stress is on a bowstring. The only time that the nodes are a weak spot is when you're heating and straightening them. So I do the major straightening before I work the nodes down, as sometimes the nodes are bent at a pretty sharp angle. After the major straightening, I take a file, knife, or more often lately, a sanding drum on a dremel or belt sander, and work the nodes down. Then I go back and fine-tune the straightness until they roll straight on a flat table without a bunch of wobbling. I don't know why anyone would want big bumps sticking out of an arrowshaft when it doesn't hurt anything to smooth them down, I've tried them both ways, and really don't see a difference in durability after shooting thousands of shots with cane. Also, on hunting arrows, I don't really want those bumps sticking out to inhibit penetration. I think the "leave the nodes alone" thing is just something that everybody has heard, but few have actually tried to test out to see if it's true.
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Everything that HBNC said.
I have done them both ways. flat and left alone.
Never broke one either way while shooting. they are almost indestructible.
if you have a spine tester of some sort I would say let that decide whether to take the nodes down a bit or not.
luck
wade
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Tracy, where did you get the cane that you have? I'd like to try cane. Does it even grow around here?
-Matt
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Same as Hillbilly, I don't like bumps.
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same here - haven't done that many. But get em pretty straight then use the fine side of a rasp to take most the node off then sand smooth. I splintered a couple on rocks there Greg but think it had more to do with the foreshafts not footed properly - well come to think of it, I know that was the problem.
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From my limited experience and reading, leave them alone if you reasonably can, or to the extent that you reasonably can. It depends and what you have, the quality of arrows you are making and the risk of breakage because you are weakening the nodes when you mess with them. I am slowing working may way through a bag of tomato stakes I found in the garbage. Only one was flat and smooth enough to leave untouched. Most needed just light sanding to remove sharp edges and slight bumps. Some needed more. Only one arrow has been completed and it does fine with smooth low bumps. I test fired a second before flecting and on the second shot it broke at a node.
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I don't know anything about store-bought tomato stakes. I'm referring to native river, switch, or hill cane. I have found the same process to be true with Japanese arrow bamboo and Sasa bamboo shafts. Haven't tried the mater stakes, though.
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i leave them along unless they are real big, they dont bother me in the least, and they all fly perfect..in fact better than my doweled arrows- Ryan
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Store bought tomato stakes are Tonkin. I put them on the belt sander. You can sand the Bejeezes out of those nodes. Tonkin is almost solid.
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Papa Matt, I traded with some of the good folks here that are fortunate to have accesss to native patches. I plan on more searching this winter to find native patches of Arundinaria G. in some of southern Indiana's waterways.
I just got done reading the article ArCANE by Hillbilly and found it to be very fascinating and informative.
Tracy
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I've made a few bamboo arrows, maybe 2 or 3 dozen, & I just sanded the nodes down with a 1in. belt sander. I can't see why you wouldn't sand the nodes off. If you'll check it out you'll see that the node is the thickest place on the shaft. Much thicker than any place else. "Boo & cane shoots great and, is almost indestructible. If it matters to you, it looks pretty cool. A friend told me that if I wanted to stop by his house on the way home from Mojam, he would give me a start of Japanese arrow bamboo. Also said he had about a truck load to cut & to take as much as I want. I believe I'd be a fool not to take him up on it.
Butch
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I think I'll sand them down some and give them a try. Thanks for the information! :)
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Any pics of finished arrows Greg?
Tracy
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Tracy, I'm still procrastinating about buying another camera to replace my last one that went belly up. I'll try and take some over at the club this weekend with Pappy's camera. :)
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No problem Greg. I know you've been working on them and just wondered how they were turning out. i've been working on my first batch and trying to figure out what I like best. It's a lot of fun and I'm amazed at how well they shoot. Very rewarding.
Thanks Tracy
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If you are on the fence between sanding and not sanding , you can compress the nodes instead . When they are almost straight or after straightening . Use a clothes iron ,or two flat rocks and a heat source , and roll the shaft while pressing the node . I've done it a few times ,never enough to get the node completely even ,but close. If then you sand it down you will be removing less material.
Ralph
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Ralph, I tried something similar to that with some cane this past weekend. Had a pair of fencing pliers with about a 3/8" or so diameter hole in it. I got the pliers hot with a torch and then used them to compress the nodes. It helped, but didn't get them down as much as I'd hoped. I then sanded them almost flush with the rest of the cane.
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I did some scientific tests at a 3D shoot this weekend on cane shafts with the completely flush-sanded nodes. I dead centered and side-swiped a few trees and rocks (intentionally in the name of science, of course ;D ) and even split the side off of a sapling with the cane arrows coming out of a 60#-ish bow-no damage, breakage, or problems whatsoever, not even a scratch.
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...and he only lost cane arrow...when Steve's wife goosed him just as he released. ;D