Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: david w. on November 07, 2008, 06:05:00 pm

Title: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: david w. on November 07, 2008, 06:05:00 pm
I dont really care about speed but i would like to get the flatest trajectory possible from one of my 40lb longbows for target shooting.  What would be a good wood to use?  Also wouldthat reed that starts with a PH (i dont know how to spell it)  I heard it was really light.

Could i use 3" fletchings instead of 5-5 1/2" fletching?
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 07, 2008, 06:09:36 pm
Your talking about Phragmites....they look like Boo or Cane....but are really punky and full of some honeycombed looking stuff....but the Indians used them ....and they are light.....cant hurt to try....but I don't know what they would spine out at...
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: armymedic.2 on November 07, 2008, 06:53:17 pm
add more weight to the bow, ooggaa boogga.....no really though, what about good ole' port oxford cedar with a light coat of sealant and a 90 gr point? that stuff is super light and is a great contender for being the most consistent arrow wood around imo.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: ZanderPommo on November 07, 2008, 07:42:20 pm
or sitka spruce

Zander
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Kegan on November 07, 2008, 07:45:34 pm
You could saw up pine board squares (provided the grain's straight) and plane them round. Works pretty well for target arrows. Especially tapered :)!
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: david w. on November 07, 2008, 08:34:01 pm
That was what i was thinking.  white pine would make a light arrow
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: stickbender on November 07, 2008, 11:10:46 pm

     As for your fletching, you can use shorter fletching on your target arrows.  Look at some of the english target arrows.  They use short sheild type.
                                                                                      Wayne
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Hillbilly on November 08, 2008, 08:59:32 am
White pine makes good light arrows. I've made a couple sets over the years, and they're good, flat shooting target arrows.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: M-P on November 09, 2008, 02:23:59 am
Hi,  My 3D arrows are currently POC, 90 gr points, one coat of water based varnish, 350 gr finished weight.  I'm getting ~170 fps out of a 42 lb bow.  It sure makes for a flatter trajectory than a heavy haunting arrow, but the foam deer don't seem to mind.  The main problem is that POC breaks easily.
Ron
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: ZanderPommo on November 09, 2008, 09:49:11 am
uhhggg

sitka spruce is super strong, barely lighter  than poc, and not too bad for straightening

Zander
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 09, 2008, 11:19:42 am
David, if you are going to shoot primarily targets and 3-D then lighter arrows will give you flatter trajectory.   I shoot the same arrows whether I'm shooting 3-D or hunting so my knowledge of the arrow's trajectory is implanted in my mind. It doesn't matter how flat your arrows fly as long as you can put them where you want them. I believe you complicate your shooting by shooting different arrows for target and different arrows for hunting.    Pat
 
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 09, 2008, 11:58:40 am
I am 100% behind what Pat just said.....I believe that you just make it that much harder on yourself by using different weight Arrows for different Tasks.....I shoot different Arrow for Hunting than I do for 3-D and 5-Spot Target Shoots.....but they are of the same Material (Sitka Spruce)....same Fletchings(5" Turkey Wing)....and as close to the Same weight as my Hunting Arrows (145 gr Points and Broadheads)....this way you get yourself programmed to the Arrows flight...and you have no problem judging distance and drop.....it will make it a lot easier on you David...if you can find a good weight for both....and stick with it......now thats just an Old Mans Opinion....so Take it or Leave it!!
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 09, 2008, 12:26:19 pm
...two old men! ;D
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 09, 2008, 01:26:28 pm
                                                                             :D :D :D ;)               
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: hawkbow on November 09, 2008, 05:15:44 pm
Willow shoots make good light wight arrows, HAWK
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: richpierce on November 10, 2008, 01:06:09 pm
Phragmites do make super-light arrows.  Shooting for distance, they easily out-shoot anything else I have tried.  Nock inserts are required as are foreshaft inserts.  Harvest the thickest, straightest ones you can find, before first frost if possible.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: david w. on November 10, 2008, 06:33:55 pm
David, if you are going to shoot primarily targets and 3-D then lighter arrows will give you flatter trajectory.   I shoot the same arrows whether I'm shooting 3-D or hunting so my knowledge of the arrow's trajectory is implanted in my mind. It doesn't matter how flat your arrows fly as long as you can put them where you want them. I believe you complicate your shooting by shooting different arrows for target and different arrows for hunting.    Pat
 


the bow i will be using is only for targets.  Its a very light weight longbbow I wouldnt want to hunt deer with it.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: jamie on November 14, 2008, 11:08:03 am
also if using phragmites , find them as straight as possible. they dont like to be starightened. if the bend is too much you'll just crush the walls and ruin the shaft when bending.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 14, 2008, 01:05:37 pm
B and Destructo, You both know your bows and arrows well, for a couple of kids; but, you've got a few years to pack on before you can lay claim to the "coveted" title "Old Men".  You guys finish your Gerbers while I top the mourning with  some milk, natures way  of keeping the spine in your arrow.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 14, 2008, 05:45:34 pm
                                                                                 T.M.I.

                                                                                  >:D
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Franklyn A on November 14, 2008, 06:21:23 pm
Another vote here for Sitka Spruce as a nice. light, rugged arrow material
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 16, 2008, 11:35:53 am
Destructo, chronically bad but not rising to the level of evil.  K.B.Z.E.R.  Go play with the  other kids and stop calling people names or you won't get dessert.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 16, 2008, 11:47:40 am
Hey guys, lets keep this about "lightest arrows" and not personalities. >:(     Pat
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 16, 2008, 12:37:04 pm
B'ster, relax , I'm just having fun and I think Destruto was also.  A little levity never hurts anything or anybody. Relax , smooth out.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 16, 2008, 12:43:54 pm
B'ster, relax , I'm just having fun and I think Destruto was also.  A little levity never hurts anything or anybody. Relax , smooth out.


I'll bite....what is K.B.Z.E.R  ???  If it's not appropriate...please PM me......OK........... :-[
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 16, 2008, 01:12:29 pm
Xin, I'm about as smooth as it gets. ;)  My job is to stop the snowball before it gets too far down the hill.  ;)     Pat
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 17, 2008, 03:10:49 am
Destructo,  K.B.Z.E.R. is just jibberish in response to your T.M.I., which I suppose is too much information.   As I pointed out in an earlier post, this is all in fun which I think you realized, but I'm not so sure The B'ster did.  Any way , If you or the B'ster were offended, I apologize for  repartee which obviously was misconstrued.  There  is no snowball to stop.   Both of you fellows post some really nice bows and arrows. Destructo , your knives are real works of  art  and I really like your Wampanoag style bows.   
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: El Destructo on November 17, 2008, 07:55:39 am
  Tanks a Lot Eh!!! I can take da joke ot ya know....cause I'm a Yooper....and We does allot a jokin bouts ourselves ya know.... :D

All kidding aside....I think I like making Knives as much or maybe more than Bows..... But when I am building Bows....I sure have a preference to Native Bows over .....Recurves........ :o
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 17, 2008, 09:09:23 am
I'm not offended...only trying to prevent possible problems. That's why I suggested you guys keep it on topic.  ;)       Pat
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 17, 2008, 12:39:42 pm
Destructo,  I've been bowyering, fletching, and knapping for 15 years.  All of my bows,except for one , have been some sort of N.A. reproduction with the Wampanoag being my favorite, even paid a visit to it at Harvard Peabody museum.   My knapping has only been sporatic over the last 15yrs, but the last year I have been concentrating on breaking rocks.  I've got a long way to go before I'm as good as you.  The bow making thing is a lot easier than knapping.  Any rock over 2inches, will soon be a broken rock if I'm knapping it.  Really frustrating to get a good Clovis goiing only to snap it in half as you flute it.   B'ster, I'll do my best to stay on topic,but sometimes a little drift off course can break the monotony..  I've been reading PA magazine since around the first year it was published and have been lurking around this website almost as long as it has lbeen up, even through the period when it was almost nonfunctional.  I find both informative and entertaining, although both can at times can use a little mirth.  Any  attempts on my part to introduce levity will not be mean spirited.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: JackCrafty on November 17, 2008, 01:13:08 pm
Personally, I like phragmites, but it is hard to keep straight (like jamie said).  Phrag is the lightest material that I've ever worked with.  With a short forshaft and small arrowhead, it makes the lightest arrow IMO.

That said, I think I would choose Douglas fur as the overall best lightweight arrow material.  POC is very good, but I guess I'm one of the few people who doesn't like the smell of the wood.  I've tried spruce, but it is a bit weak on impact...lots of broken arrows.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: Pat B on November 17, 2008, 02:01:22 pm
Thanks xin. We all need levity. A little drift off topic isn't a problem either. When it seems like misunderstandings are about to happen we, the mods, try to break it up before it goes too far. If I misread your intentions I apologize.      Pat'ster ;)
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: xin on November 17, 2008, 05:15:10 pm
Pat'ster, no problem. Looking forward to some of your bows and arrows.  I believe I recall you saying you didn't knap; with the beautiful arrows you make it would be a natural progression if you did.  Again, keep those pictures coming.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: mullet on November 17, 2008, 10:18:36 pm
 I've gotten a couple of arrows made by Art that were Poplar. Those were really light and splined at 55#.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: 1/2primitive on November 17, 2008, 11:51:18 pm
I was in this exact predicament a little while ago. What I found was that when I focused on the performance of my bows (getting the speed and flat trajectory from there), the arrows were no longer a problem. Most of the arrows I made were from 5/16" dowels, and were slightly too heavy for my slower shooting shortbows. With a slightly stronger bow, and revised building techniques and bow design (and more practice), I can shoot my 5/16" arrows with plenty of spped and acuracy. Let me stress this, small bow tips. A ton of perfomance can be picked up when bow tips are made very small. Most of my bow's tips are only slightly over 1/4" wide for 50lb (with Osage).
So, I would say, focus on bow performance.
     Sean
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: bow-toxo on January 28, 2009, 10:55:56 pm
If you are using wood, a breasted arrow spined to the bow would be lightest. A 'breasted' arrow is tapered fore and aft from points between the midpoint and near the fletchong.
Title: Re: Making the lightest arrow
Post by: knightd on January 29, 2009, 10:49:28 am
If you send me a PM I got some 250 300 grain tonkin shafts that would do the trick for you..