Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Flintknapping => Topic started by: leapingbare on March 15, 2011, 08:05:02 pm

Title: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 15, 2011, 08:05:02 pm

 Well i guess the point challenge for March will be a pine tree.
 
Some tips for making them.
 #1 Thin from the base! you have to thin from the base to keep it wide and to get it thin enough to have good notches.
 
 #2 Pay close attention to your cross section and make sure you have good convexity. this will aid in a good final flake scare pattern.

 #3 Make sue you have good semitry before you add your serrations.
 
 #4 Doing the serrations is a lot like the 1st two flakes when notching. you want the flakes to travel to the center of the point. Set up a continues plateform and start at the tip and flake down the side till you get to the base. you want to flake about every 8th of a inch or less. dress up between your deltas and flake the other face.

 #5 have fun!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 15, 2011, 08:24:15 pm

knew you'd pick this one. i suck at serrations. now i get the opportunity to get good. time to call shannon.  ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Tower on March 15, 2011, 09:15:42 pm

I'll throw caution into the wind and see what happens.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 15, 2011, 10:11:31 pm

 ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 15, 2011, 11:48:40 pm

Yep Shanon taught me how to make them.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 16, 2011, 12:02:29 am

ok i'll TRY
but aint promising squat on this one
ive tried to make them before,hate them serrations they have  >:(

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: mullet on March 16, 2011, 12:09:40 am

 Whew! Glad i'm in Houston and turkey season starts this Saturday when I get home.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: bubby on March 16, 2011, 07:36:37 am

I dont understand a thing he said, I'll just hafta look at some pics, Bub

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 16, 2011, 07:45:30 am

heres a pic of one of shannons pine trees for reference

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jonathan creason on March 16, 2011, 11:18:47 am

Me and my big mouth.  Oh well, here goes nothing.........

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 16, 2011, 12:59:11 pm

broke two so far. keep snapping the ears off. gonna punch em off this time

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 16, 2011, 01:03:26 pm

Well, almost two weeks left. Maybe I can get into something here, hmm..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Outbackbob48 on March 16, 2011, 05:21:25 pm

Jamie, don't feel bad. :( :( I didn't follow the tips an get my base thin so this one died an early death thru neglect of base thinning. Bob   #1 down.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: maddog314 on March 16, 2011, 06:47:50 pm

here is my sorry excuse for a pine tree. It is all abo. and I started with to thin of a peace.
Micah

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Bevan R. on March 16, 2011, 07:05:05 pm

I don't know maddog, I kind of like the 'Buck Rodgers' shape. 8)

Bevan R

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 16, 2011, 07:16:30 pm

looks good to me,i have yet to make one succesfully  :P

been looking thru my overstreet manul
not all pine trees look like the ones shannon makes
his actually look better than the ones in the book
however there are several differant styles
but all seem to havr the serated edges

bevan i dont think that looks "buck rodgers ish"
looks a little more like the one from the original "flash gordon" movie  :D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: maddog314 on March 16, 2011, 07:42:10 pm

So, it looks like a space ship? I had to call my dad to see who Buck Rogers and Flash Gordon were. :)
Micah

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 16, 2011, 07:54:35 pm

man now i feel old  :(           ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 16, 2011, 08:48:16 pm

me too tim. =)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 16, 2011, 09:33:12 pm

haha.
 Good job guys!
 

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: nugget on March 16, 2011, 09:44:40 pm

I will ATTEMPT to make one this weekend. I do stress attempt

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jonathan creason on March 16, 2011, 11:37:22 pm

Gave it a try this evening, but I didn't fare too well.  I've got to get better at thinning.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 17, 2011, 12:29:28 am

dont want to jynx myself here
but i have one thats intact,all thats left is the serrations
wish me luck  ;D

when its done,if i dont wreck it,i will get a pic up


ok here it is
my sorry ass attempt at a pine tree
i know, i know it doesnt compare to shannons
but hey, whos does ?  ;D

(http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/7492/1002458x.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: GregB on March 17, 2011, 08:40:02 am

Turned out pretty nice to me Sailordad! ;) I've got one of Shannon's that is awesome!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 17, 2011, 09:12:53 am

Thats Good Tim!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: nclonghunter on March 17, 2011, 10:19:40 am

Sailordad, looks like a pine tree to me...I like it.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jonathan creason on March 17, 2011, 10:20:39 am

Nice job, Tim.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JustinNC on March 17, 2011, 10:44:36 am

Id haft it 8)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 17, 2011, 02:58:31 pm

Those look bueno! couple more days before i even can get home to attempt this..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 17, 2011, 06:20:59 pm

looks good tim. i finished these two. the novaculite one was my learning curve. the texas one i had a little bit better grasp of the serrations. both of em i stalled one notch and had to stop.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v288/coyotebow/knapping/001-30.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 17, 2011, 08:43:51 pm

Them look good Jamie! Ya'll are making me salivate wanting to get home ;D.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 17, 2011, 08:53:46 pm

thanks for the kind words everyone  ;D
wife tells me im my own worst critic all the time
guess its cause i lok at it up close and personal
and can see where i could have done better (anal retentive )

jamie them are sweet
i like that texas one  8)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: iowabow on March 19, 2011, 06:31:08 pm

I decided to post my first try.  I might do it again later this week.

 (http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb423/Iowabow1/2011-03-19131017.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 19, 2011, 09:13:11 pm

very nicely done  8)
that sure is a cool looking piece of rock too

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 19, 2011, 10:13:58 pm

it amazes me you,ve been knapping for 2 months

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: mullet on March 19, 2011, 11:55:44 pm

Jamie, he's probably related  to Shannon. ???

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JustinNC on March 20, 2011, 12:56:04 am

Awesome work guys. I know of one by a vry under rated knapper that needs to be posted up. Fact is he can flat make some points. Now if you made a pine tree and showed it to me, post it up, you know who you are.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 20, 2011, 01:11:48 am

John: You said you needed some lessons. I don't know about that now - looks like your well on your way..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: crooketarrow on March 20, 2011, 11:32:27 am

    I thought mine looked fair they ar'nt even in the running.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: nclonghunter on March 20, 2011, 10:25:16 pm

Made of NC Rhyolite, while at Pipers yesterday. Hope you like it.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JustinNC on March 20, 2011, 10:36:12 pm

finaaaalllyyy ;)

Was waitin on it Lyman. Looks even better today than it did yesterday!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Pappy on March 21, 2011, 08:54:07 am

Not sure if he wanted me to post these but he said one was for Point of the month,I got to watch these in production. Sorry Shanon if you didn't want tese posted yet,I need better instructions. ;) :)
 He can tell yall which one. :)
   Pappy

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 21, 2011, 09:27:59 am

nice work on that rhyolite. shannon you suck!!!! ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: iowabow on March 21, 2011, 10:37:41 am

That is some real nice work.  Also thank you all for the nice words above.  I tried all weekend to make a blank that I thought would work real well for the pine tree but was working with very fustrating cracked and low quality rock.  I was trying to adhere the insturctions and never had a good thin base and nice convex tip.  I did learn through this process that flint that is a little chalky will collapse easely and will not produce consistant thinning flakes.  I did not really understand the quality difference untill this weekend.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: bubby on March 21, 2011, 05:55:21 pm

here's my first attempt at a pine tree, I've really gotta work on my serrations, and after the rhyolite I've  been working I broke three of these before I eased back on the obsidieon, Bub(http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubncheryl/handpad-5.jpg)
(http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt320/bubncheryl/handpad002-7.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 21, 2011, 09:59:31 pm

For whatever help it might be. Here's some pics I took last year of a point in the process.
1.  The first is the preform prior to notching.
2. Is after the notches 
3. This pic is after the first set of serration flakes have been taken. To do this... I work with the platform in the center of the point and work off a continuous platform, spacing the flakes just far enough to avoid the deltas left from the previous flake. If you try to get them too close they won't travel because you'll be trying to push them through the negative bulb left from the flake before. I work from base to tip. Be careful! That first flake can easily pop the ear off!
4. After you run the first series of flakes repeat the same on the other side and then abrade the hollows left by the negative bulb. This is your platform for you third and fourth series of flakes.
5. After you run those last two passes you'll have to clean up the points of the serrations with a sharp flaker and touch up the tip and such.
 Here's a picture of a some real ones. Like Sailordad said...they come in several different variations depending what region you find them in but you (hopefully) get the idea.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 21, 2011, 10:03:51 pm

I'll also stress that it's very important that the preform be very clean and free of any steps that might hamper the travel of those last sets of flakes. You'll also need to have a good lenticular (or lens) shaped cross section as well as a thin base.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JackCrafty on March 21, 2011, 10:10:37 pm

Thanks for posting those Filer!  Too sweet... my cavity is hurting.

I made one and filmed the process.  I only have two out of seven video clips posted.  Hopefully I'll have the rest up in a couple days.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfojb1JaOjg&feature=channel_video_title

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 21, 2011, 10:20:20 pm

shaping right up Patrick! Get it done so we can see it 8)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: iowabow on March 22, 2011, 12:26:54 am

Second try.  Just need to figure out the flute thing.
(http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb423/Iowabow1/2011-03-21195855.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 22, 2011, 01:06:32 am

Damn good work John! And Shannon: I'm with Jamie - you suck, hahahaha ;D. that's some good info though! I'm cooking a batch right now. Maybe I can turn out some kind of pinetree this week..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 22, 2011, 01:21:17 am

That looks real nice Iowabow! Very nice indeed!
 Cookin rock huh Paul? You'll get thrown in jail for that! ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: iowabow on March 22, 2011, 10:33:57 am

This was where I started. Forgot to post it with the first picture.  I like the flake pattern on the stone at the beginning. I am going to have to figure out what I am do to create that effect.  I would like my finshed work to have that pattern. 
(http://i1205.photobucket.com/albums/bb423/Iowabow1/2011-03-21174540.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 23, 2011, 01:44:50 am

John thats a very good job.
 Shanon its good to see some fresh points from you  :)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JackCrafty on March 23, 2011, 04:26:19 pm

The rest of the Pine Tree vids are up.   ;D

http://www.youtube.com/user/AllergicHobbit?feature=mhum#p/u/4/xGK-xlC27T8

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jonathan creason on March 23, 2011, 10:22:48 pm

Like Charlie Robison sang, "you're not the best, but you're the best that I can do."

(http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/jrc1106/DSCN0091.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: nclonghunter on March 23, 2011, 10:42:05 pm

Hey Jonathan its got everything a pine tree needs. Looks good to me.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jonathan creason on March 23, 2011, 10:57:51 pm

Thanks, Lyman.  There's a reason I didn't show the profile view, though.  It's way thick, which gave me huge problems trying to notch.  I just didn't have the right tools on hand to do the serrations, but I'm not real bright sometimes so I went ahead and did them anyway.  I at least wanted to say I got one done, though.  Hopefully I'll get a little more time before the month runs out to try again.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 23, 2011, 11:17:22 pm

I like that song ;). Ain't a bad looking point either..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JustinNC on March 24, 2011, 12:58:35 am

That rock looks familiar. Probably the same sob that sliced my finger when I reached in the bucket to get it for ya.........then again Im color blind sorta, so it could be a totally different rock for all I know

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Tower on March 24, 2011, 01:54:30 pm

Hats off to you guys that make this point look so well. This is my first Pine Tree. It has been a hard point for me. My stem didn't want to expand & the serrations played hell on me. My edges are off slightly.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Bevan R. on March 24, 2011, 02:09:30 pm

Looks damn good to me!!!

Bevan R

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 24, 2011, 02:39:21 pm

that is wicked!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on March 24, 2011, 05:20:46 pm

Tower thats killer!
 Whats the rock?

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Tower on March 24, 2011, 05:25:55 pm

Its Mook. There's a rock shop about 1.5 hrs. from me that sells it by the lbs.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Pappy on March 25, 2011, 09:20:19 am

That is a beautiful point.Very nice work. :)
   Pappy

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Stringman on March 25, 2011, 11:42:03 am

Here's my attempt. I've been really busy lately, and only able to watch what you all have been postin (which has been awesome!) Some georgeous first tries and then there's Shannon... Keep up the good work guys! Soon as I got home last night I ran to the garage and stole an hour or so, busted up my first try and ended up keeping this one together.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Bevan R. on March 25, 2011, 12:00:28 pm

That is a wicked looking point.  ;)
I like it!!!

Bevan R

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: knap_123 on March 25, 2011, 12:04:37 pm

lots of nice work guys!!  i havent knapped in a month or so.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 25, 2011, 06:38:04 pm

Well Done Everybody! 
 I wanna see some more! I have made two points since October, but I think I have a piece of green Rhyolite calling my name 8)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 25, 2011, 07:55:09 pm

i keep pulling oiut my overstreet book and looking at the shapes. then i realise i have one of shannons on the wall. think i'll just pull it from the wall and say i made it.  ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: sailordad on March 25, 2011, 08:13:31 pm

Quote from: jamie on March 25, 2011, 07:55:09 pm

i keep pulling oiut my overstreet book and looking at the shapes. then i realise i have one of shannons on the wall. think i'll just pull it from the wall and say i made it.  ;D

wouldnt work
hs work is unmistakeable

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: piper on March 25, 2011, 11:32:01 pm

DANG IT and it was going so good...............Curt

(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/piper28139/2011-03-25_20-23-37_972.jpg)

(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h308/piper28139/2011-03-25_19-52-35_923.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: maddog314 on March 26, 2011, 01:16:27 am

wow these look good!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 26, 2011, 09:16:16 am

that hurts!!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 26, 2011, 03:09:45 pm

Looking great guys! think this month is going to run out before i get a chance to sit down..

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: FlintWalker on March 26, 2011, 07:18:31 pm

Here's a couple I just finished.  The big one is Dover chert and the rough one is Rhyolite. These are made in one the several different styles you find them in.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: mullet on March 26, 2011, 08:17:50 pm

Shannon, Those are SWEET! But you suck. ;) Had birds gobbling Friday, dead tomorrow. ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: jamie on March 26, 2011, 09:50:48 pm

yup you suck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: JustinNC on March 26, 2011, 10:25:48 pm

 :o

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Timo on March 27, 2011, 12:42:14 am

The boy has still gt it! Still looking for one about 6" long though Slickfoot! ;D

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: nclonghunter on March 27, 2011, 02:34:32 am

I couldn't find the ruff one...still looking. The two I saw are great.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: iowabow on March 27, 2011, 10:19:47 pm

They look great!

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Tower on March 28, 2011, 01:42:44 am

Ohhh I will give a home to which ever one you say is rough. Outstanding both of them.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: Pappy on March 28, 2011, 11:07:25 am

Ya rough alright. ;) :) :) Nice work Shanon. :)
   Pappy

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: cowboy on March 29, 2011, 12:32:12 am

Allright Shannon - when i do sit down, i wanna sit by you ::) ;D.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: meximike on April 02, 2011, 12:05:01 pm

Here is a point leapingbear made. He didn't get a chance to get a pic of it so im posting for him.

Can't get it from phone.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: meximike on April 02, 2011, 12:48:07 pm

(http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l31/meximike69/2011-04-02_08-15-41_624.jpg)

(http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l31/meximike69/2011-04-02_08-00-20_170.jpg)

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: YosemiteBen on April 21, 2011, 10:43:38 pm

@Maddog - Nice point - buck rogersish or not - I would have to say that your material however is nice clear obsidian and not micah. Mica is REALLY thin layers packed together and would not carry a flake and would crumble under pressure flaking. there are two types I am aware of, Mica which was used as windows in early ovens and Biotite micah which is darker in color and is a primary ingredient in Granite (roundish dark crystaline structures). Yosemite has lots of granite - unfortunately it is no good for arrowheads.

Title: Re: Point of the Month "pine tree"
Post by: leapingbare on April 22, 2011, 12:04:47 am

Thanks for posting Mike.
 That ones made from some wild buffalo river chert.