Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => English Warbow => Topic started by: WillS on August 23, 2013, 02:12:27 pm
-
Bit confused/stumped here, hopefully somebody can offer some advice!
I recently finished a sheaf of EWBS Livery arrows, and was just recently able to weigh them on very accurate scales. They are all made of Poplar, all using the same heads and all with the same size/length fletchings whipped with the same thread.
However three of them are 10 grams at least lighter than the rest. Is this something that happens often due to wood density and I should have weighed them before constructing? Is there any way of adding 10 grams to an arrow to make it fall into regulation weight categories? I'm amazed there can be so much difference from one identical shaft to another!
-
Yup, that is very normal. I've had arrows with exact materials and dimensions weigh up to 20 grams different. It's about the density of the wood shaft. What I do to compensate is weigh all my shafts beforehand, and group them into lots. I also weigh my hand forged arrow heads, and separate them into lots. I match the heavier heads with the lighter shafts to try and match final arrow weight.
I think it would be difficult to add weight to the finished arrow, and keep the point of balance appropriate.
-
Thanks Adam, total mistake on my part then! Will have to make a couple more up to compensate!
Would you happen to know off the top of your head what a full length (32") poplar shaft bobtailed should weigh, in order for it to meet EWBS specs once completed?
-
I don't know... I can't get poplar shafting. But, if your arrow head weighs about 15-20 grams, then your shaft must weigh 45-50 grams. The weight of the 3 feathers is negligible... less than 1 gram, so I don't even account for it.
The next trick for you to consider is the spine. Good luck with that one... it's been a challenge for me! The arrows I made with very stiff spine did not fly as well as comparable arrows with softer spine.
-
What I would do- hammer some lead sheeting till its super-de-duper thin... then jam some inside the head socket... and also bore down into the shaft a tad(1"max) and fill the hole with lead wire... and the put the point back on.
thats my style.... i like messing with stuff.
i cannot stand to not build/modify stuff.
-
You're more than welcome to try taking 10 grams of lead sheeting and fitting it inside an arrow socket while still having enough socket left to glue a point into strongly, and not completely changing the balance of the arrow... Let me know how it goes ;-)
I'm with you on the modifying thing though.
-
I do the same as adb during the making stage and make up weight shortfalls by adding more coats of finish to lighter arrows.
It is possible to add quite a bit that way!
-
Thanks for that! It was something i had thought of, but I use oil and wax only for my shafts, so adding varnish on some would spoil the set! Are you able to work out how many coats it would need to add 10 grams? It's a fairly large amount.
For what it's worth, one piece of lead wire would need to be 180mm long to reach 10grams!
-
You're more than welcome to try taking 10 grams of lead sheeting and fitting it inside an arrow socket while still having enough socket left to glue a point into strongly, and not completely changing the balance of the arrow... Let me know how it goes ;-)
I'm with you on the modifying thing though.
You can usually get almost 10g if you are really careful(and its a 3/8ths shaft and you bore 1.5" deep, 1/8th wide... and your points are shaped like mine and if you glue them on with epoxy) yes, it does massivly change the balance.
-
I tried that route, and it severely effected the FOC balance, and I found the cast was negatively effected.
-
FWIW, my shafts are 1/2" and tapered to 3/8" with hand forged Tudor bodkins.
I think what I'll do to avoid this in future is buy the shafts 1/2" parallel and taper them myself. If the density is low, therefore making the overall weight less, I'll leave the taper later on the shaft, keeping the first 2/3 or so 1/2" more or less, then a steeper taper towards the nock. Cheers for advice though guys.
-
Hi Wills
Sorry about that, I thought you were talking grains not grams.
As for the drilling option, I tried it once to make up the weight for a quarter pound arrow but as the others have said it makes it point heavy!
Now I make all my shafts myself from the same piece of wood and get great consistency
-
Hi Wills
Sorry about that, I thought you were talking grains not grams.
As for the drilling option, I tried it once to make up the weight for a quarter pound arrow but as the others have said it makes it point heavy!
Now I make all my shafts myself from the same piece of wood and get great consistency
How do you make your own shafts?
-
>>How do you make your own shafts?
I cut square blanks from a plank of Ash (or your desired material - think i've found poplar to light for certain EWBS arrows).
I then use a 'dowel cutter'... Google these as i don't think we are allowed to advertise, but they do them in numerous sizes (1/2", 3/8" etc.) and are like a big pencil sharpener.
Once i have a batch i then use a linisher (belt sander) to taper or a jig you can knock up with tapered sanpaer covered sides and whizz up and down with an electric drill... well that's how i do it.. hope it helps!
Cheers
Ev
-
Hi adb
I get a 150mm x 50mm board and cut it to the required length. Then run it through a band saw to get square shafts, the width required.
If tapering do this next by planing each side. Next, plane the four corners down so you have an octagonal shaft. I then gently plane the eight edges off and then sand using heavy grit sand paper to round off the shaft. The best one to use is cut from a belt sanding belt. It is very stiff so you fold it around some dowel to mould it into a curve. Once you have done this to all 12 shafts, start matching them to your heads to get the same weight. The lightest arrow becomes the benchmark, so sand the others more to get them all the same.
Once you finish up the arrows you have them all the same weight and spine!
I make board bows as well as stave ones, so it is possible to make a bow and set of arrows out of the same piece of wood. I made a 90lb bow and set of arrows with long bodkins from a piece of Beech and they look and shoot great!
-
Beech? Really. I don't think I've ever heard of a warbow made from beech. Cool. Could you post some pics of your bow and arrows?
-
Hi adb
I'll have to recruit my son to do that. I'm not just a primitive archer, I'm primitive all over.
-
Beech was the crossbow bolt wood of choice according to the records from St. Briavels Castle, a major producer of arrows and bolts in the 13th C.
-
I can see it as arrow or bolt wood, but I've never heard it used as bow wood.
-
beech? its a hardwood, right?
ELB war arrows were supposedly ash, "heavy to give a great stripe"...
-
Sorry about the delay in getting some pics of 90lb at 30.5 in Beech Warbow and set of Beech (same piece of wood as the bow) arrows.
Arrows are 1150 gns, 1/2 in tapered to 3/8 in, 3 in needle bodkins.
You can't see from the photos but Beech is a great looking wood!
-
OK hope the rest come up now!
-
Very cool! Thanks for taking the time to share. Beech. Huh. Who'd a thunk it! It's very unique to make a bow and arrows outta the same piece of wood!