Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => English Warbow => Topic started by: toomanyknots on December 19, 2013, 08:31:11 pm
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Or on arrows in general? I have been using the plain old elmers glue for the whipping, but it doesn't look super sexy, and wouldn't work with a varnished arrow really. I thought maybe I could use glue, and varnish over that, over the whippings, but no matter what I always get varnish running down (or up too) the fletching. I don't know if it is too wet, or I need to do super super thin coats, or what? The varnish I have been using was tru oil though. I gather the two main ones I have found people use a lot are super glue and pva glue. I think elmers ( the pva glue I use) is ok, but two coats or more looks like dull crap, and if you don't coat it with something else, then it can turn white when wet. It also cracks easy when hit on impact, or with lots of shooting. Just curious what yall are using...
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Gidday.....i use tru oil on the shafts..about 5 coats with a steel wool sand inbetweens. i put thread at fron at back of fletches and if i need to whip them along the shaft i will. I used a touch of superglue just to hold the silk to shaft..then start wrapping. same at the end of it all. final process is to use a correct width brush so i can delicatly paint tru oil on the shaft between each fletch and on top of whipping..the other parts of the shaft are simply wiped on.
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Gidday.....i use tru oil on the shafts..about 5 coats with a steel wool sand inbetweens. i put thread at fron at back of fletches and if i need to whip them along the shaft i will. I used a touch of superglue just to hold the silk to shaft..then start wrapping. same at the end of it all. final process is to use a correct width brush so i can delicatly paint tru oil on the shaft between each fletch and on top of whipping..the other parts of the shaft are simply wiped on.
Thank you Archeress. Guess I just suck at painting it on, haha. It's good to know that I am not the only one using tru oil on arrow shafts. I will give er another go. I was having ok success tonight painting it on real light, the whipping was coated first with some clear wood glue though.
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Once I've done all the horn inserts, and cut and sanded the string nock, I fit the head then do about 3 coats of Danish Oil (beeswax, boiled linseed oil and turpentine mixture - probably the same stuff as Tru Oil?) all the way up the shaft, so I do the whole lot.
I then glue the fletchings on, over the Danish Oil using superglue usually, then whip with silk starting at the base of the fletching. I always whip all of mine all the way up, then finish at the nock end with a dab of superglue again.
At this stage, I then paint PVA glue over the shaftment and whipping, doesn't really matter if you get it on the feathers as it's clear anyway. Once the PVA has completely dried (I usually leave it a day) I go over it with actual varnish (not the Danish Oil) that dries clear. I've found that using Danish Oil on its own doesn't do a whole lot to keep the whippings in place if they really want to come undone, say you get a through-and-through on a target, or it goes into the ground and drives along the grass etc, they'll come undone if not properly glued in place. As you say, the PVA turns white if it gets wet, so that's why I go over the dried glue with proper varnish at the end - something like yacht varnish works really well.
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Another way to coat the shafts is to dip them. Use a tin tube, I use a length of copper plumbing pipe, bung the bottom and fill with your varnish/oil of choice. Just dip the shafts in and pull it back out...done! Hang up to dry.
I use a water based two part lacquer for arrows. It is designed as a bar top coating for pubs etc.
The only thing is make sure you have finish/glue compatability!!
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Hi
I use a repair glue or hot glue for the arrowheads so they can easily be taken off with heat. For the horn inserts and fletching I take a crafting-glue because it fits all materials. The glues are from Uhu and Pattex, I don`t know if you have these labels in your country.
I finish them with a tung oil / orange oil mix, linseed oil or clear lacquer, it depends on what the arrows will be used for.
Kind regards
Andi
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aHHH wILLS...yes i was going to ask whether superglue stuck to tru oil ok..as in fletches..havent tried it..i just left the shafts bare till i have finished everything then wiped the shaft and painted inbetween fletches...sounds good..if it sticks..i will do it
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Yeah it certainly sticks to danish oil, I've never used tru oil but I imagine it will stick to that as well! I guess it won't be quite as good a bond as bare wood, but it's not as bad as a varnish, as oil seeps into the wood rather than just forming a skin over it. Plus the real strength should be coming from the silk binding, so if the glue does end up failing you shouldnt lose a fletch!
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Always used good ol' Elmer's glue myself. Mostly because it is economical, and fast to apply/dry. It does chip and flake off after awhile though. Mine always dries very clear and I haven't noticed it ever turning white when wet. Could be that I haven't paid attention though :)
I had used regular superglue before that but it gummed up really bad and looked very unsightly.
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Always used good ol' Elmer's glue myself. Mostly because it is economical, and fast to apply/dry. It does chip and flake off after awhile though. Mine always dries very clear and I haven't noticed it ever turning white when wet. Could be that I haven't paid attention though :)
I had used regular superglue before that but it gummed up really bad and looked very unsightly.
I don't know how you would paint it between the fletches? Maybe find some slow drying super glue, if there is such a thing? I tried to with a brush, but it hardened the brush in about 5 seconds, haha.
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http://www.gorillatough.com/index.php?page=epoxy
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http://www.gorillatough.com/index.php?page=epoxy
Will give it a try. Can you paint it on with a brush without it hardening too quickly?
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It's 5 minute epoxy, do the math. Why not just use regular epoxy if you want time?
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I use super glue on wraps fore and aft of the fletching. I don't wrap through the feathers. I use my finger to spread the super glue around the wrap. As long as it is liquid you won't stick to it. Once the super glue has cured I use 220 emory cloth to smooth it out then add more glue. Do this a few times and the wrap becomes a solid band.
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you can buy THIN cyanoacrylate glues at hobby shops. Its sort of a slower-drying superglue. It is also very expensive- 5$ for an oz. However, it is extremely strong, more so than superglue.
Works wonders on fletching, and also on wrappings.
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you can buy THIN cyanoacrylate glues at hobby shops. Its sort of a slower-drying superglue. It is also very expensive- 5$ for an oz. However, it is extremely strong, more so than superglue.
Works wonders on fletching, and also on wrappings.
I use the liquid loctite super glue on fletchings, I tried the gel super glue, but it didn't work too well for me. The liquid stuff works great, cures in seconds.
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fletch-tite for the fletching, TBIII on the whipping, then a blend of tru-oil and linseed oil treats the rest of the shaft.
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fletch-tite for the fletching, TBIII on the whipping, then a blend of tru-oil and linseed oil treats the rest of the shaft.
Whats up Joe! Will be sure to check out fletch-tite. Does mixing linseed oil and tru oil make a nice result? I have thought of doing similar things...
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I have also started using the bohnings double sided tape for the fletches. No issue so far.
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fletch-tite for the fletching, TBIII on the whipping, then a blend of tru-oil and linseed oil treats the rest of the shaft.
Whats up Joe! Will be sure to check out fletch-tite. Does mixing linseed oil and tru oil make a nice result? I have thought of doing similar things...
fletch-tite is the jam! and mixing the two oils make them go a hell of alot farther. plus you i never give it more than 1 coat and it's great. my hunting arrows though get a nice coat of Otter-Wax. it's made up here in portland and it's intended purpose is for canvas, wool, and leather water-proofing but it's amazing on wood.
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Tru-Oil is Linseed oil... it's just like Danish Oil, a blend of linseed, turps and various other bits and pieces (Danish Oil is more or less an equal parts mix of linseed, turps and beeswax) Adding more linseed probably won't make any difference other than to dilute and take longer to cure, but you never know till you try!
I tried fletching tape once, and while it's pretty good on the thin shop-bought turkey feathers, it's not much use with war arrows that meet EWBS spec, as they need to be fletched with goose, and goose primaries are too strong for fletching tape! They just pull away from the tape as they don't want to straighten and the adhesive isn't really strong enough. Nothing beats a good bead of cheap superglue ;)
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i've used all sorts of varnish and i've found that for me, a diluted 3:1 linseed to tru-oil mix is fantastic and i don't have to feel bad about dropping waaaaay to much money on tru-oil.
on the note of glues for fletching, sand the goose feathers quill as thin as paper and you can get away with tape (you're wrapping it up anyway) bigbowbrum on youtube has a great how to on battle shafts and he uses tape and his music selection is unbeatable
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i've used all sorts of varnish and i've found that for me, a diluted 3:1 linseed to tru-oil mix is fantastic and i don't have to feel bad about dropping waaaaay to much money on tru-oil.
on the note of glues for fletching, sand the goose feathers quill as thin as paper and you can get away with tape (you're wrapping it up anyway) bigbowbrum on youtube has a great how to on battle shafts and he uses tape and his music selection is unbeatable
Yeah, tru oil is pretty darn expensive. It's a lot cheaper to buy the biggest thing you can of it, I think it is 32 ounce, but then you gotta use it all before it goes bad too! I always get little crustys in mine, and then I will finish doing a bow, and I will look and it will have dried crustys glued to the bow in the finish. I hate that.
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When I want to do it the easy way, I use Titebond II or III for the wrappings. For the primitive arrows, I use fish glue.
As for the "varnish" on arrows, I now use wax and got rid of everything else. Car wax for the easy way and lanolin for the primitive stuff.
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I sometimes use clear nail polish over my wrappings, but only after they have been set with a little superglue. Makes them shinny, If you like that kind of look.
Russ
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Ducco for the fletching. TBII over the sinew wrappings. Start out with a stained and Tru oil sealed shaft. Have been using Ducco for years on wooden arrows and feathers. Will complete my first 3 primitive arrows in 31 years this weekend. Will post pics. I use 2 coats of Johnsons wood wax over the whole works. Helps the shaft slide smoother over the seal skin on My arrow rest..
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Hi, found this post a bit late.
A wax rich colour neutral shoeshine works for the shafts, fletching glue for the feathers and for the whipping still looking for something in the local hardware shop.
-cheers