Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Arrows => Topic started by: PAHunter on February 28, 2014, 01:28:23 pm

Title: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on February 28, 2014, 01:28:23 pm
What bamboo shafts should I buy online?  I’m looking to make bamboo arrows with hickory inserts for target and hunting.  I’m interested in spinning them well my 50-60# sefl bows.  I’ll likely have several questions throughout this process but the first is what bamboo to get.  I’ve gotten it from K-mart and home improvement stores before and the weights and spines are just too inconsistent to make a good matching set.  I’m considering buying online and see adds like the one below for Tiger.
•   100pcs of Superb hand spined Bamboo arrow shafts 33"/40-45# (28" spine tester) for making hunting & target arrows. Comes with shafts Only, no points and fletch.
•   Weight 25-30g /piece on average, 7-8 mm diameter, 3-5 bamboo nodes within that length.
•   Long enough for arrow makers to customize the final arrows

Some questions
  • Are Tiger shafts the best to get?
  • Can the Tiger shafts work well with hickory inserts?
  • How do these recommended spine poundage’s translate to a self bow?  For example does 40-45# mean for a center cut professional bow but would be too stiff for an off center self bow in that range?
  • Does anyone offer a range of spines, such as 12 arrows per spine?
  • Any other advice is appreciated!
Thanks!
Rob
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 28, 2014, 02:52:06 pm
Some will tell you with bamboo and cane arrows that spine doesn't matter as much as keeping the physical weight the same. I try to match mine in spine and weight and have excellent results. Reed shafts are not as critical as hardwoods and you will find that the shoot shafts will fly accurately out of most of your close to same weight bows.

I've used the Tiger shafts and although I prefer some others over them, they are a good value and possibly the best value for your money.

Hand spined and weight matched bamboo/cane shafts can be very expensive. I do my own and if I had to figure my time and labor they would be too much for me to afford.

Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on February 28, 2014, 06:15:03 pm
Thanks Fred, which shafts do you perfer over Tiger and why?
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Fred Arnold on February 28, 2014, 07:29:07 pm
Rob, I prefer japanese bamboo from Jaap Kopedrayer (Yumi Bows). The times I purchased from him the bamboo was not spined or straightened and ran about $2 per shaft. Best bamboo I've found but a lot of work considering you can acquire the China cane already spined , straightened, and sealed for about the same money.
Next best product I've had the pleasure of working with is hill cane that PatB was kind enough to send me. That is an awful nice product but I haven't been able to find a source for it on a regular basis. I know Pat trades some from time to time and should try to find something to trade him for more in the Spring.
The Tiger cane actually gets a best buy rating from me but I have a tendency to purchase American made products when available. 
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Buck67 on March 01, 2014, 03:03:41 pm
I don't know what kind of price that those prepared bamboo shafts cost.  However if you want to do your own sorting, straightening and cutting to length, then you might take a look at this  I bought 500 48" bamboo "tomato stakes" from AM Leonard and had them delivered to my door for $127.00.  That comes out to about $.25 cents apiece.  So far I have made about 30 arrows from the bundle and I had to discard about 10 others for being too thin or too crooked.  The bamboo from AM Leonard is mostly solid all the way through, there doesn't seem to be a hollow middle.

Your mileage may vary.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 02, 2014, 12:07:35 am
@Buck: thanks man that does sound like a great deal.  I'll check it out.  Though I'm kinda looking for very good quality bamboo that I can spine and weigh correctly for my bows.  Though wiht 500 I'm sure you can weed through them to make several good sets.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Andoing on March 02, 2014, 05:39:40 am
HIKSTIK makes great shafts, I am very satisfied with mine.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 02, 2014, 12:55:07 pm
What spine shaft do you recommend for a selfbow?  I'm guessing the ratings on them are for center cut professional bows.  thanks!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 02, 2014, 01:00:11 pm
I found this general recommendation on bambooarrows site.  Sounds like a good rule of thumb to me!

English Longbow archers will know that they may generally shoot an arrow aprox 10# lower, so a 35-40# shaft at 28 inches will suit a 45-50lb longbow.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 02, 2014, 01:24:43 pm
I bought 50 Tonkin bamboo arrow shafts off ebay for $90 including shipping.  They are noted at 40-45# and I'm guessing they will work for my 50-60# bows and 27 and 1/2 draw.  I'll weight match a set as best I can and work on hickory inserts.  Thanks for the advice guys!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on March 02, 2014, 02:25:58 pm
There is a place near where Eddie Parker(Mullet) lives in Fla that sell 500 ct bundles of Tonkin cane for cheaper than Leonard, I think. Contact Eddie and he'll give you the info. The stuff Leonard has sounds like Tonkin.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: mullet on March 02, 2014, 08:51:22 pm
The place in Lakeland, Fl. is the Bamboo Supply. They sell Tonkin and if you tell them you want it for arrows they will look through the bundles and pick out the ones that are the best. I usually pick up 4' x 8 to 10mm. That way it gives you a lot of room to work different spins. These are bundles of 500 and the price fluctuates between $55-60.  The one problem I had with Tigers and, that's who David Knight was getting it from is the rind and Nodes are ground off. I've noticed that they break pretty easy with that having been done.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PEARL DRUMS on March 05, 2014, 12:19:15 pm
None better Jon. 
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 20, 2014, 01:58:52 pm
I made a prototype with the 50 Tonkin shafts from Asia.  I'm very happy with it.  The 40-45# shafts (estimated 55ish for selfbow) are too thin to do decent inserts so I got some 1/8'' dowel rods to insert a few inches into the front.  I'll use sinew on my actual hunting arrows but the artifical sinew and thread are fine for the practice arrows.  I'll probably order some 50-55# ones eventually for some stiffer ones as well.  I'll see how it flys tonight!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: mullet on March 20, 2014, 03:59:10 pm
The hole inTonkin is so small I've never had to put an insert in the nock. I just wrap it real good.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PEARL DRUMS on March 20, 2014, 04:50:50 pm
You can taper either end with a good taper tool. Treat them just like parallel wood shafting.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on March 21, 2014, 04:01:01 pm
With a glue on point you shouldn't need the sinew wrap. For trade and stone points, you do.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: PAHunter on March 21, 2014, 04:50:26 pm
Sounds good guys.  I used the sinew to make the diameter bigger to match the points more snugly.  The arrow flew quite well btw!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Todd Mathis on October 29, 2019, 10:06:27 pm
Hey...I sell that stuff.  Just saying...Gimme a call.  Todd Mathis/Khansarrows.com.   210-797-1900...
Sorry guys........  I just couldn't resist...don't hate me.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Todd Mathis on October 29, 2019, 10:14:05 pm
Quote from: PAHunter on March 02, 2014, 01:00:11 pm
I found this general recommendation on bambooarrows site.  Sounds like a good rule of thumb to me!

English Longbow archers will know that they may generally shoot an arrow aprox 10# lower, so a 35-40# shaft at 28 inches will suit a 45-50lb longbow.
I find this to be excellent advice by the way....  Todd Mathis.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Hawkdancer on October 29, 2019, 11:36:07 pm
Quote from: Todd Mathis on October 29, 2019, 10:06:27 pm
Hey...I sell that stuff.  Just saying...Gimme a call.  Todd Mathis/Khansarrows.com.   210-797-1900...
Sorry guys........  I just couldn't resist...don't hate me.
Come now, Todd, you do sponsor the section after all!  We may lash you with wet noodles, but we won't hate you - much >:D (SH) (lol) (lol).  Btw, welcome to PA!
Hawkdancer
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: razorsharptokill on October 30, 2019, 10:42:43 am
Do you find that bamboo shafts tend to lean on the light side for hunting? I have some i added a box nail in the tip that weight 37 grains and it pushed the total weight over 500 grains. Without the nail they are high 4602 to 470ish. Seems a little light for hunting.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Deerhunter21 on October 30, 2019, 11:32:52 am
you normally want 10 gpp (grains per pound (on the bow)) for hunting. so it depends on the bow. so if you have a 50# bow use a 500 grain arrow. 47 pound bow 470 grain arrow and so forth
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: razorsharptokill on October 30, 2019, 04:12:18 pm
Yeah I like at least 10 gr per pound for hunting. The cane being hollow, it is hard to get to that weight without adding weight inside or going to a 200 grain broadhead it seems.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on October 30, 2019, 05:29:49 pm
The arrow I posted on the hill cane thread is 27" to behind the point and weighs in at 610gr. The head is heavy(195gr) but most of my cane arrows are between 500gr to 550gr, ideal for my 45# to 55# bows.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: artcher1 on October 30, 2019, 06:49:49 pm
Pat, are you the one that sent me the Bambusa (Gracillis I believe)? They made some of the finest bamboo arrows I ever produced. I gifted those to Neil Anderson.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on October 30, 2019, 09:43:13 pm
Yes, Art. It is Bambusa multiplex, a clumping type of bamboo. My friend in Bluffton SC has a hedge of bambusa. The long internodes(12" to 15", 2 nodes per arrow), perfectly round culm, no sulcus, thick walls and minimal nodes. I still have a piece or 2 in the basement. I may even have a bambusa arrow you or I made. I think it would be a good bamboo for split bamboo fly rods too.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Deerhunter21 on October 31, 2019, 07:10:23 am
I fill the tip and nock node with thin pieces of rivercane. Depending on the size of the node it will add weight to the spine and weight to the shaft. Also allows a stronger nock and a more secure broadhead will a smaller chance of splitting.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on October 31, 2019, 08:42:37 am
I stopped filling the void at both ends of a cane shaft years ago. It just isn't necessary. I haft trade and stone points and commercial glue on points and make self nocks. The sinew wrap at the self nock is plenty strong enough as it is at the point end and if I taper the point end to accept a glue on point that taper goes inside the socket, preventing it from splitting.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Deerhunter21 on October 31, 2019, 09:50:04 am
Quote from: Pat B on October 31, 2019, 08:42:37 am
I stopped filling the void at both ends of a cane shaft years ago. It just isn't necessary. I haft trade and stone points and commercial glue on points and make self nocks. The sinew wrap at the self nock is plenty strong enough as it is at the point end and if I taper the point end to accept a glue on point that taper goes inside the socket, preventing it from splitting.

Yeah im not so worried about it splitting but I do take it into consideration. my shoots are barely marked for 45# and maybe my bow shouldn't even be spined to it but im just trying to get the weight up and the spine. i feel it helps raise the spine a ok amount. I dont have a spine tester but i do see a difference.

I was given 6 arrows from clint and im now down to 3. 2 of them slipped right under my grass and one broke. i found one that slipped under the grass but that was while i was trying to find the other one that went under!  (lol) it lost the fletching and the tip is rusted but i can use it for bear shaft tuning by bow!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on October 31, 2019, 12:14:28 pm
If you could fill the void in the center of the cane it would stiffen the spine. Adding only to each end would only add a slight amount of physical weight and if anything decrease the effective spine.
 If the arrows Clint gave you are cedar, they are rot resistant and even though the feathers rot off and the point rusted the shaft is probably still good after it is dried and straightened if needed. Most any other shafting would be rotted too or at least made so they shouldn't be reused or shot.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Deerhunter21 on October 31, 2019, 12:48:10 pm
Yeah not rot at all! feathers came off of course, tip rusted and was all round dirty and bent the slightest bit but other than that it was perfect!
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on October 31, 2019, 05:02:00 pm
Well, let it dry for a while then give it a good bend test in all directions before making a new arrow with it. ;) :OK
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Wally44 on November 13, 2019, 05:59:35 am
How much does a finished  shaft weigh
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Pat B on November 13, 2019, 06:45:52 am
My finished arrows are between 500gr and 600gr.
Title: Re: What bamboo shafts should I buy online?
Post by: Hawkdancer on November 13, 2019, 12:36:12 pm
Deerhunter,
The solution is two-fold:  a.  Don't shoot the grass (SH) (lol) - b. Try the weed whacker brush knot that was up a couple weeks ago (lol) (lol)!  Also, a garden rake to help find the arrows under the grass! (lol) (lol)!  I do have to reweigh my arrows as I shorten some, but I think they will hit 10 gpp.  I do like a heavier arrow for hunting, 500 gr plus off my 45# - 50# bows. 

Take care with the back injury and do keep us posted!  Those are serious, and get at least one second opinion!  I crashed on a jump in '78, and the doctor promised me a permanently sore back! He was right!  But our battalion surgeon, an orthopedic specialist, told me not to get cut on until it was a last resort.
Hawkdancer