Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: jayman448 on May 20, 2015, 10:31:39 pm
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66 inch ash board with zero knots and straight as an arrow. tillering out perfect using the gizmo for the first time. refusing to pull past 50 lbs. finally get her to full draw. those gall darnd chrysels form on the upper limb! real shallow (takes em out with one scraper pass) but they are there. what the flim flam!!!!!!! maybe she will survive @40 lbs... i hope
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Aaaaaaaand now it popped a splinter in the back. Time to feed her to the fire pit. I dont even know what went wrong xD. O well
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How about some pics.
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Ill post some later tonight. It was on an edgegrained stave. I may have layed it out too narrow
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I'd advise against using the gizmo with ash. The gizmo works by holding the bow at a draw length for long enough to run the gizmo along the limbs, checking for problem areas. Ash hates being held at full draw, even more so when there are problem areas. It's one of those woods that needs to be handled with patience and care - draw the bow with a pulley so that you can watch it moving, let it back instantly and work on the areas that you saw weren't right.
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When you aren't sure where you went wrong you need to learn how to read what the wood has told you along the way.
Before you bend the stave trace the backs profile on your tillering board, a wall etc, this will give you a definite reference, without it you may not see the subtle changes in it's shape as tillering progresses.
So as you bend the stave further and further at some point set will show up. What you need to bear in mind as this happens is the 'set mantra' (TTB's) no set inner limbs, a little mid limb and the rest in the outer limbs.
If you get any set that isn't conforming to this 'rule' then that area is weak. If you get set in one limb and not the other then it is weak. Your bow will have shown more set in the limb that chrysaled BEFORE it actually chrysaled - this would have been your warning to weaken the other limb appropriately. Without the reference of the original profile drawn on a wall then it can be very hard to spot these subtle speakings of the wood. Once you've got your eye in it's quite easy to make perfectly tillered bows just by watching the set. A while ago me and a few mates were camping for a while so I made a bow by this method and didn't watch it bend once I just watched the set very closely. It shoots great, zero shock, fast and (so far!!) the set hasn't increased or changed at all.
Also ash is very tension strong and imo pretty much needs to have its back trapped to take load of the belly. If your board raised a splinter (and wasn't weak in that area) chances are your board wasn't straight grained enough. Edge grain (1/4 sawn) boards are surprisingly difficult to read and even a hint of waviness indicate a pretty severe grain violation.
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I have had good luck with heat tempering the belly of ash, like Mike said it is very tension strong and needs trapping or a toasted belly or better yet both. These "tricks" will greatly reduce frets and set in ash.
Grady
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Wills. I was onky using the gizmo at barely past brace height and then eyeing it up beyond that
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Mike. Sounds legit.... ill have to re read that all a few times before it sinks in i think.. im on my last puece of wood now. A big birch stave... its reflexed in one limb tip and slightly bends in on the other. (Createing a very slight S). I figure ill reflex the other limb with steam. Hope this one works... im oooouuuutttt of wood. Lol
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In addition to what was said above I have found ash to be the most inconsistent of all bow woods within it own species. I have had great luck with ash and great looking bows chrysal. I seldom foll with it anymore except as a backing.
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Out of 6 or 7 ash bows, the only one that did not chrysal, I made from a board.
I have not touched the stuff for about 10-15 years.
Not a fan if it. Weak in compression and strong in tension. Not a good combo.
Jawge
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so here are the pics, the largest chrysel is as result of the splinter popping on the back. to the furnace she goes !
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You were pulling beyond your draw weight. Gotta be careful when I started out I was pulling the Hercules out of them I broke a few like that I'm lucky the broken limb did not hit my face. The break was extremely violent. . :o
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guess i ought to buy a proper scale. i figured i was pulling 50 the whole way through
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Are you sure that's ash...?
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Agreed!looks diffuse porous.maple,poplar?
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This is ash.
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I'm fairly certain that's not ash, Jayman. Makes it much harder to build a bow if you're working with unknown wood, as they all have different strengths and weaknesses amongst the species.
What works for ash certainly won't work for something like poplar or maple if that's what you're actually using.
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Nope, no im not. I got a board from some guy with his own mill and he said it could be ash. I dont know if it is for sure.
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He's in the wrong job :D
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If it's fairly heavy, it's prob maple,although maple doesn't frett easily.perhaps paper birch?
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Its light as a feather. Its darker than the paper birch i have but i guess its possible. Id have thought maple would have stood up better than that. ... i really need to learn my trees... xD
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Sounds and looks like poplar. in which case you were screwed before you even cut it out!
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That much i know xD
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And I forgot to say that our English ash is much better than the American species by the sounds of it!
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Well my next attempts will hopefully be iron wood and then i may have tracied down an area near by for saskatoon. My neighbour will let me take all the birch i want... but that all means waiting ungodly lengths of time to have any fun xD. Maybe ill occupy myself with making arrows in the meantime xD
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I'd not waste too much time with the birch either ;)
Makes great arrows though.
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Ive got to find an excuse to get to the coast. Get myself some decent wood