Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Letters to the Editor => Topic started by: Stringman on June 01, 2017, 01:34:43 pm
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I am nobody. That doesn't bother me. I walk into a crowd and become part of it as it ebbs and flows to the rhythm of an unheard beat. I don't stand out. I am not physically or intellectually inspiring. My workmanship is average and I have made peace with that lot. I enjoy life and my family loves the man I am. I work hard and do my best to raise my daughter to be a good and honest person. Call me "Everyman" if you want but I'm not looking for a title. I don't have an agenda, and I'm not looking for accolades.
My concern is for the wellbeing of this magazine. I have had my ear to the ground and the rumblings are becoming louder. I have listened to our members complain about content and respect. I have heard stories of no payments, no hats, and no replies. Readership is down, bills are due, and distributors are bankrupt. Are we witnessing the end of an era? Is there any reason to believe Primitive Archer is still good for its word?
This forum is an oasis on the World Wide Web. It has been an incredible source of entertainment and information. It is largely self policed, and many of those fine folks I've personally met. Good men and women that I would gladly stand alongside. It would be a shame if this refuge were to disolve while we stood by and watched.
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I don't understand, I thought everything was fine - lots of input from members. What is the problem ? Finances ? How can it be helped ?
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Those are good questions. Not sure I have all the answers, but it starts with integrity. If I agree to swap this for that, I expect to give "this" and get "that". If this model breaks down and integrity is lost then this whole microcosm we enjoy here folds up.
Primitive archer depends on good writing and good writers are hard to find. If checks continue to be scarce material ceases to come in. Subscriptions are canceled because there's nothing to read. And this forum shuts down for lack of funds. Queries have been made and folks are seeking replies. There's plenty of generous minded folks on this site and if open discussion was made, who knows what solutions might be found.
And that is all I'm after, good honest discussion on the situation.
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Perfectly worded, Scott. Last weekend I sat around a fire with about 15 PA forum members and not much said was positive when we discussed the magazine. It wasn't about blended content either.
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Stringman,
You are always free to reach out to me directly with any questions as always.
Marie@primitivearcher.com
calendargirl@primitivearcher.com
Primitive Archer Magazine does not have plans to go anywhere. We are a magazine dependent on subscriber base, advertisers, and distributors as are all magazines. The magazine supports this forum free of charge. We do hope people find it useful and a haven for those passionate about Primitive Archery and Primitive Weaponry. Hopefully they will let us know that and of course our hope is for more subscribers and potentially advertisers out of providing the forum.
I believe that the title of this thread "Sad to see it go" is misleading to our readership.
we appreciate your faithful contributions to our forum and your faithful renewal of your subscription for the past 9 years.
Calendargirl
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Thanks Marie, for your response. You are right about my title (edited)
I appreciate you affirming the magazine is here to stay. I also recognize that certain topics are not best viewed on public palette. So with tact in mind, I am asking is there any way to assure our current and future authors they will receive checks? If not then we need to make it clear that writing for this magazine is pro bono work. I'm sure plenty of people would still remain interested in writing and publishing their thoughts for free, but the contract needs some rework.
Also, is BOM done or will it still be a fixture for years to come? Hate to beat a dead horse but there are several issues with this and the hats is the least of it.
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Scott,
The authors will get paid. We have been expanding our presence in outlets since December when we contracted with a new distributor. This is very exciting news. We will now be back in outlets where as this had changed based on a past distributor which beyond our control and had nothing to do with us- we were just affected by it as I am sure many magazines were. We aren't part of the distributor - (we pay them to place the magazines in outlets. In return they pay us what is made off the sales from the rack- everyone takes a cut) One of the several factors that we are dependent on.
We are now in 1000 outlets as of this new issue that just went out. I am happy to put out a list where people can find it in stores now.
We have expanded our features past only primitive archery not only to increase readership but to hopefully draw new people into the same passion as well as give our faithful advertisers more eyes seeing their ads. Muzzleloading might not be for everyone, but I personally would appreciate the support as it truly benefits more people than most realize. Especially our advertisers- another group we are dependent upon. There is big picture here.
What I do hope sincerely that the people who use this forum realize what a treasure they have here. Many have sold/traded/shared products free of charge from us - we have stayed out of their way. We don't ask for anything in return but we do desire support back. As I stated before that is our hope that and positive energy put toward the forum. The people I have met from this forum are some of the kindest, most generous, caring people I have been in contact with. The cream of the crop when it comes to archery in any form. Anyone who comes here is truly blessed by some of the most knowledgable and generous people- this is another part of the golden nugget about this forum.
As far as BOM. This was created by Don Berg (Old Bow) many years ago. He faithfully volunteered as have our moderators to keep it going. It has since been passed down to others who have also given much of their time to keep the tradition going. It will be up to the forum if they want to keep it going. There is definitely room for streamlining the process maybe even revamping it all together. Or should the forum decide it can be dropped. This was member driven from the beginning.
If anyone wants to message me with thoughts regarding how to create a better BOM please do. I would appreciate not getting any rants or complaints, but creative problem solving is always welcome! I am open to a positive dialogue about it.
We as always are very grateful and appreciative to our followers. If you are on Facebook - go like us there. Share pictures on there as well or send them to me and let me post them. If you purchase from our advertisers let them know. I know some people mention our name and some of the vendors have given a special Primitive Archer deal. But let them know you see their ads.
Let's all support each other in this passion.
Calendargirl
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Some very good points made there, thanks again for the response. I would love to see a list of outlets as I've tried to direct friends on where to buy off the rack and had no luck.
As for the muzzleloading content, I am tentatively positive about this addition. Unlike some, I don't see a conflict with reading about traditional front stuffers alongside primitive archers. The two go hand in hand in so many ways that there's no reason not to capitalize on the increased reader base. Moreover, as I said to you in Tennessee, I appreciate the newer look and feel of the magazine as well as the efforts being made on Facebook to generate a buzz about current topics. I think it is having a positive impact on many and giving increased exposure to the magazine.
Thank you for the clarification on BOM. I'm sure many would agree that it is an integral part of our PA culture and it would be a shame to see it disappear for lack of attention. Hopefully, with this new information some one will be able to offer some suggestions on how to make the process more efficient. Never ceases to amaze me the wide range of skills and abilities among us and hopefully something constructive can come out of this.
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Thanks Scott!
and I will get that list together. It included Barnes and Nobles, Field and Stream and other familiar outlets but series state to state.
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I am concerned about the state of the magazine after hearing several people at the Classic say that they are still waiting on payment for articles that had already been published. 2 people said that they would no longer submit articles to the magazine due to this reason. One person even stated that they had sent emails and received no response. Without content there is no magazine. There seems to be some sort of lack of communication in the organization. Maybe when they send the contract out to be signed by the author they should put some kind of time frame on it so they know when to expect the payment.
Primitive Archer is the only magazine that I subscribe to. I would hate to see it go downhill.
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I appreciate your concern, Clint. And as always you can email me directly marie@primitivearcher.com and Calendargirl@primitivearcher.com
I think I have stated what I need to state. Please feel free to reach out to me directly.
And as always, Clint we appreciate how loyal you have been in subscribing as well as your contributions to the forum. I always look forward to seeing you at the TN Classic.
Calendargirl
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I receive a Racing Pigeon magazine. A lot of the authors of the articles accept a years subscription for their articles. Then again some don't even ask for anything - they use their article for a sales pitch to sell their pigeons. Some manufacturers might be interested in that.
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I receive a Racing Pigeon magazine. A lot of the authors of the articles accept a years subscription for their articles. Then again some don't even ask for anything - they use their article for a sales pitch to sell their pigeons. Some manufacturers might be interested in that.
That is a slippery slope to go down unless it is clearly stated in the article. Nothing can ruin a publications reputation faster than becoming shills for their advertisers. You see that in some gun mags that give glowing reviews to guns advertised in their pages
Not that I think it would be the same here as the market is entirely different and less open to that type of abuse but something to keep in mind
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It can be a slippery slope. But Wildcat Hunter has a good point. We have tried hard to walk a fine balance with that. But if we have an author that verifies the product that does hold weight. The important part here is all of us are supporting each other. We (as a magazine) would love to let our readers know about certain products and businesses out there. Small businesses (which are often the best) don't always have a budget to advertise their products. Our magazine has lots of opportunities / prices for advertising.
There are many forum members that could really increase their business if they would put their name in our magazine. It's a risk worth taking.
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I'll tell ya one guy that is gonna continue to write and constantly make new-exciting content... This guy! http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/Smileys/default/PA_life_good.gif
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I'm with you Twisted!
I don't know how new or exciting my articles are but,I am going to continue to write for and subscribe to PA magazine with the hope that it will help them put their problems behind them.
Magazines are finding it harder every day to survive in the internet age, I support the new format and new content, hopefully it will bring in more readers and hopefully current readers will be entertained and maybe learn something new, learning something new cant' be a bad thing, can it?
Kevin
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I agree with you, Kevin. I've submitted a few articles and lots of time as an Administrator and Moderator here on the forum, not for the financial reward or the ego reward but because I want to see Primitive Archer Magazine succeed even beyond it's already 25 year run.
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Clearly the voluntary input that has gone into this magazine/forum would be hard to calculate. Pat's contribution as well as many others has been immense and largely unnoticed. He mentioned two categories, but I'm sure there are dozens of other categories that one could identify where folks have stepped up for the good of the cause to see the magazine succeed and this community to thrive! We all have benefited from Primitive Archer's generosity to host this community blog so it stands to reason that we should chip in, however we can, to see it last.
However, we have turned away from my original intent (purposely I suppose) to ignore the real underlying concern. Eddie holds a black list that names scores of "No Deal" customers. Why do we have such a list if we are all so generous minded that we are fine with giving our time and resources freely? Is it just that we are only generous with certain folks and those that don't make the cut are ostracized? Or is our largesse best premeditated? "Here, you may have this - please don't give me anything in return." If such is true, what happens when stipulations are made? "This for that" is as common on this site as yellow dust and I challenge any of you to go 3 deals without "that" and watch your open handedness not take a hit. These contract deals are what runs our trade blanket and that same expectation of fair play is what the free world was founded on.
I may not be as philanthropic as some on here, but I do try to be always generous minded. But when a deal has been made there is a reasonable expectation that it will be fulfilled.
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As kevin and Pat mentioned I believe in giving of my time and talents for the longevity of this forum and Primitive Archer Magazine. On September 21, 2011, I was made an administrator on the forum when I took over the BOM contest.
On June 30, 2017 when I was no longer "giving of my time and talents" I was stripped of administrator status. Not even moderator. There are moderators that have not been active for years and they are still moderators.
Is that what gratitude looks like after the many years of service that I gave? Hours and hours of my own time spent away from my family. In all those years not once did I receive any type of correspondence from the president of the forum and the magazine. I gave happily and freely until it was apparent that there was a gross lack of gratitude and appreciation.
I wrote an article that was published in the December issue. My many emails about when I would be paid for the article went unanswered. No response. Primitive Archer magazine and I had a contractual agreement (that they created) on the pay and timeline of being paid. On July 5, I finally received a check in the mail after over seven months of the article being published. I only received the check in the mail after I repeated emailed all the folks in charge of this forum and the magazine. Has Scott Stanberry and others been paid for their articles?
I shouldn't have had to ask to be paid. I shouldn't have asked multiple times for Primitive Archer Magazine to keep the contract we both willingly entered.
I did not write nor submit my article to Primitive Archer magazine for a financial reward or an ego reward. I submitted the article because I wrote it. I love writing.
I entered kindergarten in the US fresh from Mexico and I learned English the baptist way. Full submersion. It was sink or swim and I chose to swim. It's my story and my testimony to others. If I can learn English and write for a magazine then anyone can.
In all the years that I did BOM I received a handful of personal messages expressing gratitude. Therefore, I was asked many times why I did BOM. My answer?
I don't make or build anything. It's how I contribute and serve the bowyers that enter. I love writing and it comes easy to me. Most importantly it makes my dying father proud every month when the magazine comes in the mail and I read and translate the articles to him.
Cipriano
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As kevin and Pat mentioned I believe in giving of my time and talents for the longevity of this forum and Primitive Archer Magazine. On September 21, 2011, I was made an administrator on the forum when I took over the BOM contest.
On June 30, 2017 when I was no longer "giving of my time and talents" I was stripped of administrator status. Not even moderator. There are moderators that have not been active for years and they are still moderators.
Is that what gratitude looks like after the many years of service that I gave? Hours and hours of my own time spent away from my family. In all those years not once did I receive any type of correspondence from the president of the forum and the magazine. I gave happily and freely until it was apparent that there was a gross lack of gratitude and appreciation.
I wrote an article that was published in the December issue. My many emails about when I would be paid for the article went unanswered. No response. Primitive Archer magazine and I had a contractual agreement (that they created) on the pay and timeline of being paid. On July 5, I finally received a check in the mail after over seven months of the article being published. I only received the check in the mail after I repeated emailed all the folks in charge of this forum and the magazine. Has Scott Stanberry and others been paid for their articles?
I shouldn't have had to ask to be paid. I shouldn't have asked multiple times for Primitive Archer Magazine to keep the contract we both willingly entered.
I did not write nor submit my article to Primitive Archer magazine for a financial reward or an ego reward. I submitted the article because I wrote it. I love writing.
I entered kindergarten in the US fresh from Mexico and I learned English the baptist way. Full submersion. It was sink or swim and I chose to swim. It's my story and my testimony to others. If I can learn English and write for a magazine then anyone can.
In all the years that I did BOM I received a handful of personal messages expressing gratitude. Therefore, I was asked many times why I did BOM. My answer?
I don't make or build anything. It's how I contribute and serve the bowyers that enter. I love writing and it comes easy to me. Most importantly it makes my dying father proud every month when the magazine comes in the mail and I read and translate the articles to him.
Cipriano
Actually Cipriano the mods that were no longer doing anything for the board had their status stripped a long time ago, some of them by their own suggestion. Others had not logged in for a loooong time so it was time to remove them
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Every bow of the month moderator went back to member when they turned over the duties to someone else if i remember correctly.
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Actually Cipriano the mods that were no longer doing anything for the board had their status stripped a long time ago, some of them by their own suggestion. Others had not logged in for a loooong time so it was time to remove them
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Rules is rules and traditions is traditions 👍🏾
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Every bow of the month moderator went back to member when they turned over the duties to someone else if i remember correctly.
Rules is rules and traditions is traditions 👍🏾
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Considering the time and effort that goes into multiple pages of printed material that is followed religiously by readers, I am dismayed to learn that the Bow of the Month editor is not a paid position. It is a feature that is in every issue. In fact, in many ways it embodies the initial spirit of the magazine, namely that it is a reader driven medium.