Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Letters to the Editor => Topic started by: PEARL DRUMS on August 09, 2017, 10:14:39 am
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What happened to the magazine I once looked forward to receiving? This last issue was nothing more than guns and more guns. And as mentioned in another Letter to the Editor, Tony was hunting cartridge guns. This isn't a negative comment towards the authors in any way, they write what they are passionate about and I understand that completely. I respect every single author you have published. Its up to the magazine to choose appropriate articles and publish them. In my opinion this last issue what the worst I've seen in regards to pertinent content based on the title of the magazine.
Not sure what is left on my last subscription renewal, but it will be the last. And I'm not alone, I have several personal friends who are letting it go as well. No need to comment or blow smoke up my chimney, I've had plenty of that already.
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Well Pearl Drums we will be sad to see you go. Your subscription expires 4/1/18 so you have almost a year left.
As you may have read our addition of muzzleloading was in hopes to widen our readership and hopefully welcome muzzle loaders into the circle of primitive archery. To include and teach those who are unfamiliar it takes opening the doors of those who practice muzzleloading as well as the primitive archer community welcoming the new interested people into this wonderful craftmanship and artistry of primitive archery.
My experience with every one on the message boards has been overwhelming generosity. I can't wait for those who my read our magazine because of the muzzleloading article to experience the amazing kindness and willingness to teach primitive archery skills to them. I was just talking with my daughter about how she was so surprised and excited about how many gifts were made for her and given to her at the TN Classic a few years ago. This is the type of generosity that will spark new interest in the PA community.
I love this community and look forward to watching this generosity unfold.
I appreciate (and we the Magazine as a team) all that continue to support PA and this part of PA
Sincerely,
Calendargirl - Marie
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I think we are a niche market at best and not gettin' any younger or growing in number. There were other magazines that came and went but PA is still here, for now, and here we have a website where we can exchange ideas, information and share skills and accomplishments.
Oh, and BTW Pearl Drums, how did those Buffalo Ball-ets shoot for you? Been warm enough to try them in your muzzle loader yet?
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I thought I put this in Letters to the Editor? And, I politely asked for no smoke and got it anyway. Im no fool and would prefer to not be treated as such.
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I have not received my newest issue yet, but was afraid of this happening. I make and shoot flintlocks, I love them to death, but I subscribe to Primitive Archer for the ARCHERY. An article here and there I can understand, but cartridge guns? Both hobbies, traditional muzzleloading and primitive archery, are very niche markets, and not growing by leaps and bounds. When the two intersect, it is nice. But, oftentimes even when both are at the same event, the two crowds don't overlap much.
I would rather receive fewer magazines per year, ALL about archery, than six magazines that are half archery, half whatever the regular authors have been up to the last year (like Pearl, not knocking the authors, they don't select which articles get published). I support PA because it is the only magazine out there for "us." But, if they won't publish articles for us, it will be hard to justify the support.
I hope the magazine continues to provide primitive archers what they want.
Kyle
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Considering the number of nonsubscribing members of this forum, I think P.A. a long way to go before it taps out it's core market. Further dilution of the message of the magazine will only serve to weaken it's appeal.
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Pearlie, let me first apologize for my post... I was trying to show my solidarity but i can see how it started a negative ball rolling... The damage is already done and I cant take it back, and for that I am truly sorry Brother. You deserve more respect than that... I will remove my post if i can.... Brian
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You did NOTHING wrong Brian. If it takes my big mouth to open up and get others to express their true feelings, I'm perfectly okay with that job. Don't delete your feelings. That's why this section is here, for the EDITOR to read.
That being said, the little note published in this issue from I believe Butch Stone, regarding our "whining" about the format change was back-sided and very intentional. It's using another readers opinion to state their own.
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Well shoot Pearl... I already did, lol... I really enjoyed the screw-in broadheads on the cover as well 😎😎😎.... Brian
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I have not had a chance to read the issue, but I have to agree with Kyle - a whole issue of not Archery is not good. There are several other forums out there for muzzleloading, etc. I do not recall ever seeing an article devoted to archery in the one I subscribe to. This forum has compartments for the other skills, but I think the magazine Should stick to it's namesake. On the publisher's side - submit more good articles on primitive archery!
Hawkdancer
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I got my issue of Primitive Muzzle Loader magazine yesterday. I can't help but think the lack of payment for the authors who submit articles is a major factor for the recent change in the magazine. When the ML authors get tired of not getting paid I wonder what will fill the pages? I use to love getting a new PA magazine in the mail. I would read it front to back within a day or two of getting it. Now I skim through the few archery articles and toss it in a drawer. I do enjoy Ryan Gill's new hunting section. And I'm glad to see the medicine man has returned.
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I know we are a "niche" group. I know are numbers aren't massively large, but I feel we have the potential to grow. Have you seen all the YouTube videos pertaining to Primitive Archery, arrow making, Flint knapping and other Primitive Skills? Not to mention the many Television shows now that are based on outdoor survival. It seems to me it's becoming the new in thing to do, or at least dream about doing. I wrote a whole article about how and why I got started doing this stuff. It wasn't something I just decided I was going to do because I watched a TV show. It just kinda happened by accident. In my early stages I turned to YouTube. I soon realized I needed more and naturally this was the place to come. Please don't give up on this Magazines true meaning. I don't even mind a muzzle loader article here and there but this just has to be our Primitive Archer Magazine.
Calendar Girl, I have never meet you. You are totally correct about the generosity and quality of the members of this site. Especially the ones like those that previously posted on this thread. They are not only generous with their gifts, but also their knowledge and talents. Most of the members I have meet do this to pass it on and not for financial rewards. Even the ones I have meet who do "sell" their products are extremely generous and top shelf people. Please, I realize you can't make everyone happy, but please consider what they are trying to tell this Magazine they once truly and passionately enjoyed and its staff what is bothering them. Please don't just tell them goodbye it was nice to know you. I also would like to help the magazine any way I can. I have written four articles, one of which PA has already printed. I'm not a professional writer. I've never done this before. I can only hope this might help the magazine in some way. If I see things I like I try to let the staff and members of this forum know.
There's always two sides to a coin. It seems there could be some pressure on this magazine right now. It might be time to communicate with the members of this site in totally unspun honesty what they are and things we could do to help. It doesn't seem to be a secret that at least some writers haven't been compensated. I guess I'm one of them. I haven't made a big deal about it, although if it was a member of this site I would probably have sent a PM to Eddie for his list. Having said this I want you to know that I really enjoyed working with your magazine and although I could very much use the dollars promised I would truly like to see this magazine healed and whole again. I still hope the rest of my articles could maybe in some small way help.
The bus is going somewhere. Not sure of its destination yet. Really hope it can find a entertaining and welcoming route.
Please feel free to communicate with me by any means.
Sincerely
Bjrogg
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Hey All,
Thanks for the comments. I think what is best is for me to change this section so that Ed Ingold (the editor) gets the information directly. We can use the Feedback for more of this exchange.
Do not interpret this as us not wanting the comments you all are posting, just a more efficient way to get information to our Editor. I personally would prefer you all email him directly editor@primitivearcher.com. As it is now ,I want to figure out a way to have these comments go directly to him or lock it with just his contact info that you can click on and email him directly. It is a more efficient way of communicating and getting your point heard.
Having said all of that. We don't publish letters sent to the LTE to use another reader's opinion as our own. That comment bothers me tremendously. If you look back at the other issues, we have always published differing opinions when we have received the letters. If someone's opinion matches my own or the publisher or the editor that is a coincidence. I would assume my opinions don't always match the publisher's or the editor's as we are all different people coming from differing experiences.
We have received calls and letters on both sides of the fence on this topic. We try to publish the letters we have for the space we have available. If you are unhappy with article content, then please contact Ed with an article of your own that would interest our readers. Some have done that.
We do appreciate all the support we have received here on the message boards and through subscriptions. Our moderators are by far the best around. This community that has been built is an amazing one. We can not please all people as some on here have realized. We are all different with differing opinions which is a great thing as that is one of the things that makes the world go round. As a magazine we are doing our best that we can, we hope that you all on the other side appreciate that as well.
I also request that should you need archery supplies please contact our advertisers. Tell them where you saw their information. Many are full of wisdom and would love to hear from you, answer your questions and support their businesses.
Feel free to reach out to me by email marie@primitivearcher.com. I would prefer that than comments on a thread as I can address them better or send you to the person that handles that part of the magazine.
Hunting season is upon us, hopefully the weather will turn soon and new adventures and stories will be had and told.
Thanks guys!
Marie
Calendargirl
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ThankYou for your PM Marie, it is good to have a heart to heart and keep that communication open.
Best of Luck
Bjrogg
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I have written archery related articles for PA and I have also written articles for PA that could generously be said are archery related.
I am one who has said that I support the new content in the magazine and I still say that, not only as a smart and logical step to bring more readers to PA magazine, but because I also love primitive guns, it seems that I am interested in all of the primitive pursuits, hunting, foraging, building things like they had in the past, primitive camping,cooking with cast iron on an open fire.
A black powder rendezvous is a fantastic place to experience a little bit of life as our ancestors did, here's a hint, when you shoot in the selfbow competition at a rendezvous, roll your sleeves up and turn the brim of your hat up if you want to shoot well because the wide brim hat and baggy shirt style's of the 1800's will conspire to ruin your score.
I started hunting many years ago because I love nature and everything about it. That lead to bow hunting and then to primitive bow hunting and it was primitive bow hunting that lead me to many of the other primitive pursuits.
If not for primitive bow hunting I would not camp 1800's style at rendezvous, cook with cast iron on an open fire, I would not know how to start a simple flint and steel fire, I would not have the dream of killing a deer with an atlatl, and I would probably not own a flint lock rifle, it was primitive archery that lead me to these things for the simple reason that they are all truly related, there is not one of us that is just a primitive archer, we all follow primitive pursuits, is there a flintknapper out there who only makes arrow points?
That said, I have to agree with Pearly and the others to a certain degree, Are the editors straying too far from the primitive side with cover photos of screw in broad heads and articles about cartridge guns?
We love Primitive Archer magazine and subscribe to it because it is the only magazine out there that is and has been dedicated to primitive archery and this last issue in particular needed more archery related material.
It is pretty obvious that the magazine is having trouble, mostly the people at PA mag have been silent about this, they own the business and they can choose what they want to say to us. Marie has addressed some of our concerns and that has cleared some things up, but problems still exist and silence only leads to guessing, speculation and more questions.
Some times it takes time to solve problems and if we want to see this magazine continue on into the future we have to support it and I want to encourage the PA community to support the new content, as I said before,learning new things can't be a bad thing, can it?
And, I would like to urge the editors to strike a better balance with the magazine's content, primitive archery is after all, the girl you brought to the dance.
I would ask the PA community members not to cancel subscriptions, that will only hurt the magazine, if you have a concern, make those concerns known and hopefully through dialogue a solution can be found.
We all love this magazine because it is more than just a magazine to us, it is a community, it is a large portion of our lives, it speaks to us and chronicle's who we are.
Kevin
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All good points Kevin. In today's World, most ink on paper Magazines are having a very hard time of it. Trust me I know as I was employed in the Printing Industry for 35 years before I got laid off for lack of work. If Primitive Archer Magazine goes under, it will not be replaced. Once it is gone, it's gone forever. I am hopeful that the magazine finds it way and stays afloat.
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All good points Kevin. In today's World, most ink on paper Magazines are having a very hard time of it. Trust me I know as I was employed in the Printing Industry for 35 years before I got laid off for lack of work. If Primitive Archer Magazine goes under, it will not be replaced. Once it is gone, it's gone forever. I am hopeful that the magazine finds it way and stays afloat.
That is truly well said BrianS. I agree that it is very unlikely to be replaced if it goes away and if it goes away so does this forum. Someone may start up another forum but it's unlikely to be as good as this one. I'm really hoping PA can still be the magazine we have been so excited to get. I really do encourage anyone who is passionate about a Archery or Primitive topic to try writing a article. In my humble opinion I think fur and rawhide processing articles and products made from them would be well received. I also feel antique tools and stone tool articles would be a good addition. I have some ideas I'm going to try to follow up on. I'm a little to busy right now, but I've got some more stuff rolling around in my head. I'm willing to be patient with PA in the hopes of better days for everyone. I really do think if we want this type of magazine around we had better find a way to keep this one.
I do understand Pearl and share his and the others concerns about this past issue. It did feel very much like a muzzle loader magazine and I know Pearl is more interested in loaders than I am. I think Kevin said it well, we need balance and Primitive Archery is the girl we all want to go out with. We might look at some other girls, but this one is ours.
I know PA has some good articles coming up. I know some people that have told me they were writing articles and they still have two of the favorites of mine yet also. They may not have been written by professional writers, but they where written by passionate writers. I think if we all work together we can do truly great things.
Let's make this work
Sincerely
Bjrogg
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I just skim over what I don't care about and read the rest, it has always been that way with me and PA.
there is always enough to fill my needs. As for not getting paid, I have never had a problem with that, of course you do know you don't get paid until just before the issue that it is in is coming out. :)
Pappy
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I will add my opinion as a relatively new subscriber--I am not particularly interested in muzzle-loaders except as a hand craft--that is the process of making one like Eric Krewson's buildalong a while back. If you must include them to keep the magazine alive, then so be it, but keep it limited, and probably limited to flint locks and truly primitive style firearms, not cartridge based. Consider how many subscribers you know you are losing to format changes against how many you think you might gain. Why would a muzzle loader fan even find a primitive archery magazine? I saw this happen with my other hobby -- model airplane building and flying. If you open one of the R/C magazines I used to love and subscribe to today, you will see nothing but quadcopter drones and pre-built Chinese foam garbage--not the hand-crafted works of flying art I really enjoy. When I discovered the PA website and the craftsmanship of so many of its members, I have shifted most of my attention here, because it replaces that passion that I used to see in the model building community. If this site and its magazine shift away from that core value to the give-it-to-me-now, instant-gratification kind of mentality I see everywhere else, then I don't know what I will do, but I would likely be looking elsewhere for what really matters about this community.
Just something for the editors to consider. Thanks for creating this site. I hope it stays true to its roots.