Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Primitive Skills => Topic started by: BowEd on February 23, 2018, 12:32:57 pm
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Just for curious first time self tanners here....If any out there wants to see I've got a nice big old coon I shot out of my neighbors garage a while back that I can show an easy way to make a soft/pliable/durable/long shelf life type fur out of for a number of different projects.Something someone can do even inside a small apartment & at a very low cost overall.Keep in mind some of the expense for tools etc. are kind of an investment for future tans or hide work & will get cheaper as more hides are tanned,but really a person can make their own tools for nothing also.My tools and equipment are pretty old I quess.A good 40 years I suppose.I invested into mine because I wanted to send & sell hides to Canada for a premium price opposed to selling them locally cheaper.Mainly coon/fox/& coyote.They have paid for themselves many many times over.Along the way I can show the fleshing and tools used and a good method of sewing up a holes and the measurements used of chemicals.
I've seen a couple of U tubes on this done by individuals and frankly,I would'nt be satisfied with the results.I'll get back to this thread when done to show results.
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I would be interested in learning this. Looking forward to the "how to".
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Ed I'm sure you'll have intest in this one. I think I've seen those same videos and that was my thought to. I'll be watching even though I've tanned stuff before. I'd like to see one on what you create from the big old coon to.
Bjrogg
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Need a Daniel Boone fur hat?.......lol.Just joking!!!I have a slick way I think of just using a length of string for making them.Custom fit!!Used to be when I got called on to make one for someone that's all I would have to ask them to grab to measure their head and tell me on the phone.
Takes a good sized close to 25 pound or close to 36" nose to a$$hole/XXL form dried length coon to make one though for an average sized fellas head.
A person never throws away spare parts like the face and tail.I did not skin out the feet on this one though.
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Ed I'd watch whatever you'd make. (-P I like trying to make stuff but I'm pretty crude yet. Would like to refine my stuff a little more. I really should get a book or something that shows how to make hats, coats, quivers, bags etc. and some better tools for sewing.
Bjrogg
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A few sizes of glovers' needles/a speedy stitch gadget for double sewing seams/and a spool of artificial sinew is about all that's needed for hand sewing.
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Thanks for the shopping list Ed. Then a few lessons on how to use em. Do you use a thimble? Or pliers? Some of the hides get though to push a needle through.
Bjrogg
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Send me in, Coach!! >:D. I'd like to see the process, but don't get on utube often. I read better than I hear! Got some hides to process.
Hawkdancer
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OK here we go with some pics and commentary.
From a frozen let to thawed state and before starting to flesh on a fleshing beam I make sure all mud,blood clots,or burs are removed from the hair with a stiff comb.
(https://i.imgur.com/AWcM2Ib.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/vtr5QUf.jpg)
A look at the flesh side before fleshing.
(https://i.imgur.com/rgvmKHd.jpg)
The fleshing knife I use.There are better but it has served me well.I've worn the wood handles off but still works great.Cost 40 years ago of $12.00.A free worn out lawn mower blade curved a bit can be used too
(https://i.imgur.com/QwBTlW7.jpg)
The fleshing beam I use.A fiberglass cove over a tapered 2"by6".A 6 to 8 inch log beam can be used too.
(https://i.imgur.com/uw9QV6l.jpg)
Lets get started to fleshing.I slip the tubed hide over the beam.Start on the face a bit fleshing and work my way down.It will be grissly and tough here but will get easier as I go down.
(https://i.imgur.com/guWSJGU.jpg)
Keep a pocket knife handy to trim grissle from around the ears.
(https://i.imgur.com/l89yq2q.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/pbFGqZo.jpg)
At first I generally go all the way down the backside to the tail with a good 4 to 5 inch wide band of flesh and fat removal.
(https://i.imgur.com/j1eYAuL.jpg)
I make that band a little wider as I go.You can see that at a little above the base of the tail the color of the hides' leather is still a very light shade of blue.This hide is not quite completely into it's prime yet but for the purpose I have for it it is close enough.A few more weeks and it would have been.A totally prime hides' leather will be white all the way down to the base of the tail.With coon this is the last area on it's hide that gets prime.If it's prime there you know for sure it is prime every where else.With experience a person can see this from the hair side long before skinning it.It's an eye a person gets for them to be able to buy and sell fur.
(https://i.imgur.com/TZNaQJk.jpg)
I then fit the hide over beam on the front legs to clean those areas up nicely.
(https://i.imgur.com/otw5aKo.jpg)
Then fit hide back to nose to clean up around neck nicely.
(https://i.imgur.com/uUhR1PN.jpg)
I now work my way down all around.
(https://i.imgur.com/ii0C1gK.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/UdDJfJI.jpg)
I will hike the hide up to fit shorter for easier fleshing.
(https://i.imgur.com/9HUqrpF.jpg)
A good amount of fat on most winter coons.I sometimes burn that inside my wood stove.It burns pretty hot.
(https://i.imgur.com/w1bKWs0.jpg)
All fleshed.
(https://i.imgur.com/Bl7Bkwu.jpg)
Since I want to make this hide for a bag/hat/pouch project I will slit this hide up the belly length wise.Other wise the hide could be left in a tube for a possible quiver also.
(https://i.imgur.com/EEsYBXL.jpg)
With the temperature in the shed around close to freezing I will salt the hide with pickling salt for a while before tanning it.I put the hide on a sheet of wood on a slant so it drains nicely.The salt will help to remove oil and if left to flint dry will set the hair so it does'nt slip.
(https://i.imgur.com/u45xytZ.jpg)
The salt gets massaged in well.Put plenty on.It will be a couple days till I get it ready for tanning.That process involves rinsing well.Then washing in warm water with dawn dish soap to remove oilyness.
(https://i.imgur.com/KC928Bn.jpg)
A closer look at the book by Phyliss Hobson that got me started close to 40 years ago tanning hides.
(https://i.imgur.com/pH462Su.jpg)
Contents of interest for this project along with the formula of aluminum sulfate and salt tan.Simple and easy.I will include 100% neats foot oil too in the finishing and softening.There are probably at least 30 different ways to tan hides.This is one way I settled in on for myself.What I like about it is that there are no harmful toxic chemicals used and as you can see I don't wear gloves.
(https://i.imgur.com/Kqqmkxg.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/8UrY7b7.jpg[/imgThis type tan will produce a soft supple leather if it is stretched and worked as it dries.The mistake I see people make is to let it get dry too far and hard before working it.A little elbow grease is needed for a nice product.I will mix warm water with 100% neats foot oil at times and massage that in too but most times it's not needed.[img]https://i.imgur.com/fU9Eq4F.jpg)
Until later into the tanning bath in a few days.
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Here is the formula I use from the book.There are corresponding hide weight to amount of chemical used too but for the part time tanner of a few hides it's not important to be exact. I'll explain later why.It makes a soft supple leather if it is worked as it drys.The mistake I see many make is to let it dry too far and hard before working it.Work and stretch while damp till dry.This basically just involves periodic stretching in between periods of rest laying around.Putting it into a plastic bag and in the frig if it will be longer than a few hours in between stretching.Not near the intense type work of stretching for brain tan leather.This type finished tan will come back out soft if it gets wet too with a little scuffing.
The upside of this type of tanning and formula is that you don't need to worry if you overdose the amount of aluminum sulfate or salt.It won't hurt anything.Making it too light would require more soaking time though for chemical penetration and I would'nt reccomend that.A plastic container should be used because of the salt.Hides with hair like a coon in the solution don't need to be weighted down.A hair on deer hide would though and a larger container of around 30 gallons[trash can] used too.The hide gets repositioned at least a few times a day so chemicals can get to everywhere in the leather.Also this solution has never been irritable to my hands any at all.
To be exact and precise a PH reading of the solution by some is reccomended but I usually eye ball it.Does'nt hurt to have some borax around though for rinsing after hide is tanned.You can't overdose using this either.I've never done the PH testing yet and hav'nt gotten into trouble for it even after dozens and dozens of hides,but can see the importance of it.
(https://i.imgur.com/fU9Eq4F.jpg)
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Great follow along Ed. Thanks for posting this. I've got a freezer full of hides that need done.
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Looks real good Ed. Nice to have someone taking pictures for you while your doing this.
A couple tips if you've never scrapped a hide. Skin coon warm if you can but chill it good before scrapping it. The knife will bite into the fat and meat better when it's cold. Very messy if fat is warm.
Also belly is much thinner on most animals and be careful around teats very easy to cut through them.
Bjrogg
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Great follow along Ed. Thanks for posting this. I've got a freezer full of hides that need done.
Clint I used to have a lot of hides that needed a tanning myself.The way I'm showing is about as mistake free and cheap as possible with tools and containers everyone can have laying around.With the way Robin and me live here I needed more room for meat/vegetables/berries etc. in the large chest freezer we got so I don't let the hide numbers get built up too much any more.Got 1 nice doe hide in there yet at the moment.I plan to just make regular old rawhide out of her in the frame dry scraping.
Looks real good Ed. Nice to have someone taking pictures for you while your doing this.
A couple tips if you've never scrapped a hide. Skin coon warm if you can but chill it good before scrapping it. The knife will bite into the fat and meat better when it's cold. Very messy if fat is warm.
Also belly is much thinner on most animals and be careful around teats very easy to cut through them.
Bjrogg
Yes Robin helped out a bit with some camera shots after chores this morning.Good points BJ,that's correct.There are ways to make things easier and less messy for yourself.A rubber apron is nice to have around and a towel or rags too.I was never one to freeze whole coon in a freezer.I always skinned immediately after killing when it's the easiest.Skinned out coon in the fat takes less room in the freezer too till a person can get to them to flesh/frame or flesh/tan later.
Fall and winter coon have quite a bit of fat so it still is marginally messy,but that's when the fur is at it's best.When doing these things the goal of a tanned hide and things to be made need to be kept in mind.This is a sow coon so teats are a bit larger than boar coons.Since this coon I knew was going to be ripped up the belly the concern was minmal,but if I was to be putting coon up for the fur sale being careful would be more of a concern.Keeping the hide flat and taught on a smooth surface without any folds avoids any holes.Your right most all animals skins are thinner on the belly so there is a learning curve for that for first time fleshers.Less pressure is needed to flesh those areas.Thickest areas are on the back side of neck and spine.
It's a learning curve for anyone who wants to do this will learn.Techniques using a fleshing knife correspond with techniques using a draw knife.Only in reverse.I push to flesh and pull to chase rings.My fleshing knife is actually rather dull the middle 10" with the outside 2" on either end sharpened for grissly areas like the back of the neck.Just like my draw knife actually,but would'nt reccomend using a draw knife for a flesher.My draw knifes' edge is slightly convex and my fleshers' edge is slightly concave.
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Got the recipe, but the rest of the pics went to limbo! What book is the from, btw?
Hawkdancer
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Got the recipe, but the rest of the pics went to limbo! What book is the from, btw?
Hawkdancer
The book was written by Phyliss Hobson called "Tan Your Hide"/Garden Way Publishing,Charlotte,Vermont.Other tanning methods shown are bark tanning,vegetable tanning,chrome tanning,alum carbolic acid,sulphuric,and acid oil, chemical wise.Also snake skin & indian buckskin.There are many other books out there really.This one is pretty straight forward and easy to digest.It's for sale on Amazon for $11.00.Pretty cheap I'd say too for the amount of knowledge gotten.
(http://i.imgur.com/pH462Su.jpg) (https://imgur.com/pH462Su)
Too bad the pics disappeared.They were transferred from Imgur site.I see them here on this thread.
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I can see all the pictures.
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Got the pictures this time - they take a while to load. Good thread, thanks for the info. I see a "run" coming on that book! Lol!
Hawkdancer
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That's good.It's good to see an interest in this.In a way that I hope I can convey the same sort of enjoyment I get from it.Pic of just the two chemicals used.
(https://i.imgur.com/gauKxU0.jpg)
Van Dykes Taxidermy supply can be a source for the aluminum sulfate.I bought a 50 pound bag quite a few years ago from a local supplier myself.Keep it in a 5 gallon pail nowadays sealed.Might have 15 to 20 pounds left I suppose.It's hardened and clumpy now so I just bust it up with a hammer and screen it fine with a window screen.Pickling salt can be gotten from a grocery store.
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Ed I believe that's probably what I'm using to. I got what Van Dykes calls Lutan kit. I think it's aluminum but not sure. It looks like that. With this kit you pickle in water with salt and safety acid to lower ph level between 1 and 2 for at least 72 hours. If I understand right you just massage in the pickling salt and don't use a pickling bath right?
Thanks
Bjrogg
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I'm definitely keeping track of this one. Very nice tan along Ed! We have needed something like this on here for a long time. Well done!
Patrick
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Thanks Pat.I see many on here talk about wanting too or have hides etc. so this is just 1 easy quick way of doing it.The picture in a persons' mind of the finished product needs to be kept there because sewing etc. comes next too,but I've always felt rewarded from the effort.
BJ...I'm pretty sure the pickling gets done as the tanning is being done.There are many other successful methods of tanning out there.Even a paste made to apply to the flesh side without a bath.The formula is 2 pounds of pickling salt with 1 pound of aluminum siufate.Like most bath tans progress of penetration is checked with the edge sliver cutting test.I usually test where it's thickest.Then I know it's done every where else.I trim lip/eye/and ears of material to thin those areas too since mounting it is not the goal either.I keep the bath temperature at room temperature around 70 F.I would'nt go below 65 F or above 75 F.The colder the bath the longer it will take,which means more soaking time.Something I try to avoid.I don't like it too warm either.
I've never experienced problems down the road later from slippage of hair or bugs etc. with this tan.As many know hair slippage is something that a person will see right away even before tanning.Fat burning the hide is what I call it.Irreversible!!!.It can happen even before drying the hide or freezing it.I would'nt reccomend tanning a hide showing that.It won't be saved by tanning or pickling or freezing it.For tanning I don't reccomend drying the hide onto a frame first either.Even if fleshed well before drying.Especially fattier hides like coon or bear unless tumbled very well in a tumbler with cob grit or toweled very well.Degreasing and relaxant type chemicals need to be used most times in a soaking bath then loosen the leather for proper penetration of chemicals tanning.I prefer to freeze/thaw/and flesh/salt and tan.
The way I see it what salt does is that every hair follicle sets in a pocket of oil type substance or surrounded by it.Salt will help dry that up and constrict or shrink around that hair follicle to hold it in.
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Great show Ed (-P I'll try not to ask to many questions but I'm always interested in the different ways people tan hides. Might be more than one way to skin a cat but there's also more than one way to tan it.
Thanks again and my daughter in law just gave me that book.
Bjrogg
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BJ...It's good to ask about the details.Many times I overlook or take them as known info or for granted that can make a difference in a nice piece of fur or a failure or rags.I will do my best to leave no stone unturned.It takes time under good mentors to learn how to handle fur properly to avoid problems.Many things get covered saying that.How to skin/flesh/dry/store properly prior to tanning are very important too.In my younger days I hung around fur sheds a lot.Coon hunted continuously then got into buckskinning so with me it was a continual long term exposure learning process,but I'm sure there are things about tanning different ways that I hav'nt tried that I could be enlightened about.
I am lucky to have a first cousin who is a taxidermist/artist and an authority on hide reclamation though but rarely ask questions from him.He will send most all his capes/hides to a tannery.Except birds and fish of course.He himself has no desire to brain tan.I love it.I think he feels it's too much work and the primitive side/desire in him does not abide.
That's why for all general uses though this aluminum sulfate/pickling salt tan is a safe/cheap/durable/low physical effort/nontoxic way anyone can get good results from.
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I brought the salted hide into a warmer enviornment and after 2 days now it has drained considerably.I thnk the salt has done it's work well enough.I have shaken off excess salt and gotten a pail full of luke warm water to rinse and clean the fur and hide good.I rinsed it a good 3 times to be sure I had all blood and dirt removed.
(https://i.imgur.com/G2PV9nv.jpg)
I then got myself another pail of luke warm water with a fair amount of dawn dish washing soap in it.I made sure I washed every part of the hide.I then rinsed the soap out with another 2 rinses of fresh clean water.
(https://i.imgur.com/W3f6o1C.jpg)
I then mixed my 1 pound of aluminum sulfate into a gallon of warm water making sure it was dissolved.Then in another bucket I dissolved my 2 pounds of pickling salt pouring the 2 together into one bucket leaving me with around a good 4 gallons of tanning water in the bucket.I put the hide in and swirled it around some making sure all parts are exposed.I will reposition and stir the hide at least 3 times a day now.I will wait now a few days and check with a sliver cutting test to see the chemicals progress.It looks a little cloudy but that's ok.
(https://i.imgur.com/9pi9X86.jpg)
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I have always been curious about alum tans, thanks for sharing... I was up late last night and googled, "what's neetsfoot oil made from?" You may already know? But seems in the old days it was from rendered cows feet and shin bones, now a days from lard... highly refined I'm guessing.. I know it worked great on the old baseball gloves. Lol.
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Yes...Your right it has been used to rejuvinate leather.There's 2 kinds out there or used to be anyway.1 is neats foot oil compound and the other 1 is 100% neats foot oil.Your right I think it's made from hoofs.I buy the 100% stuff.
The likeable thing about it is that it can be emulsified with water at a warm state to be rubbed into the leather as it is drying and a person is stretching to soften the leather.Being careful to not use too much oil.1 to 1 ratio is plenty.I hate over oiled tanned hides,but I don't like dry flinty hides either.
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Glad you don't mind all my questions Ed. You are so right about all the details and a difference between a good hide and trash. I think that's one thing that scares people away from trying this. It does take a considerable amount of time and effort to do this. If you try it and end up with a less than perfect hide you are less likely to try it again. I lost the fur around the ears on my first red fox. It took me a long time to get up the nerve to try tanning another one.
Your neetsfoot sounds very similar to the softening oil in my Lutan kit. After I took Yogi out of tanning bath I let him drain off real good then mixed oil 2 part hot water to one part oil and massaged into leather. It always feels oily until it starts to dry and you break the hide. Then it's soft and white if everything works right.
Bjrogg
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Well it's been 3 days.I did my sliver cutting test from along the edge of the face of the coon[a thicker area leatherwise] and it was white clean through.Otherwise it would look translucent like.Looks to be done.I rinsed it again a few times in clear water,then mixed up a good cup of borax into 3 to 4 gallons of water and put the hide in that for a good 8 to 10 hours.Took it out and rinsed it again a few times in clear water.I usually whiplash as much of the excess water off the hair and hide and let it drip a couple hours.I now put it onto a sheet of wood flesh side down with a slow fan blowing over it against the grain of the hair till the hair is good and dry.I will then flip it over flesh side up to get the flesh side started to drying and eventually working it soft as it dries.At this stage I will check periodically to be sure it does'nt dry out too fast.
(https://i.imgur.com/mHBFJdK.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/qWpHCGR.jpg)
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Great tan along Ed.
Thank you for posting.
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I'm coming in late but all good. This is good detail and great pics. Thanks for all the work.
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Looks great Ed. Just curious if you ever put them on a stretcher for drying and breaking? I usually case skin mine and put them on stretchers while drying. It seems as they dry and shrink it helps break hide. I still take them off stretchers for additional breaking but it seems to help. Would be harder to do with belly split though.
Bjrogg
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BJ...I've tanned cased skins this same way too before but never put them on a stretcher to dry.I can see how it could work for you though.Without any hand work done to them I don't think just putting them on a stretcher softens them.Actually for me they are easier to soften opened up split.
Well I checked back when I started this hide from a raw or green state.Exactly a week and it's done.I soften them breaking and stretching wise as it dries every half hour or so.
(https://i.imgur.com/aDahWjK.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/lB7nj4k.jpg)
Some clumsy skinning holes I fix with a baseball stitch while wet before stretching.You cannot see the stitch line from the hair side.
(https://i.imgur.com/jeNVAeE.jpg)
Well that's it.It is'nt a tan that gets as soft as my brain tan I don't think but it definitely will serve the purpose for a number projects.
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Awesome! Thanks for sharing
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Ed
Great thread, wish I had started reading this earlier. Just boarded a coon couple of days ago. I assume this will work with beaver as well?
Prices are such that finding different things to do with the fur and the cost of a failure at this time doesn't cost much. I have blankets and some kits in the freezer skinned not fleshed. I think this would be a fun test trying to tan some of those hides. Any ideas that might be different for a beaver would be appreciated.
Thanks.
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Ed,
Can a person do more than one hide at a time in the same water/solution at the same time? Would you recommend that or is the work load such that you would only be able to stay up with one hide at a time?
How does it work on Mink? Price on them is such that it would be a good use for some good mink. Do the percentages of ingredients change according to the size of the hides? I think I should probably find the book and purchase it for some good reading.
Thanks
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DV IN MN....Beaver will be even thicker yet than coon but it is doable.Flesh them really well while skinning if you can.Otherwise you'll need to flesh it too.
There's no reason not to tan more than one hide at a time if you got em.Your thinner hides will get done first allowing time for you to get them all done.Mink work well too.They'll get done first.
1 pound of aluminum sulfate & 2 pounds of salt will do a deer or a couple of coon in less than a week.For beaver I'd use 2 pounds of aluminum sulfate & 4 pounds of pickling salt to be done in a week.
Do the sliver test to see.
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Thanks Ed. Yea I plan to flesh all the hides regardless. Well maybe would have sold the beavers green. Price difference this year kind makes the extra work to flesh and board the beaver less then break even. Did you tan the otter in the other post same way as the coon?
Is there any issue with how long a hide is in the freezer, provided you fold it properly and avoid freezer burn? I have a hold over that I was looking at sending away to be tanned. Very large otter.
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Great thread Ed and nice hide. I agree just putting hides on stretchers without further hand work won't soften them. I put them on wooden stretchers with belly stick and back stick stretching as much as I can while their wet. Then as they dry I "poke" hide with my thumb and see if it turns white. When it's ready I poke with thumb or hammer handle all over doing a good amount of softening right on stretchers. Works great for muskrats and mink and fox. Coon need some extra work back of neck but it still helps most areas.
DV IN MN like Ed said Beaver are more work if you want a really soft hide but not impossible. I've done quite a few mink using similar method to Ed's and they work well also fox and muskrat. For mink I always remove "saddle" while pelt is green yet. This really helps make softening hide easier.
Bjrogg
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DV IN MN....A hide rolled up flesh side to flesh side in a plastic bag should keep for a number of years without freezer burn.I've found that out before.I did tan the otter to the same way.Seems fur prices are down because fur is a luxury/bad relations with Russia and China etc. the reasons why.Economies bad in Russia etc. too.Seems China bought a lot of the otter/Russia a lot of the coon in the past.Oh well anyway I enjoy making stuff out of them.Have fun with your hides.Sounds like good projects to look forward to.Those beaver are nice but a lot of work all around from trapping them to tanning them.I used to just hoop them after tanning bringing them with me to rendezvous's.Just an idea.It takes a good 13' willow to make a hoop big enough to hold a blanket beaver.
(https://i.imgur.com/5IGcFkM.jpg)
BJ....I enjoyed your bear hide tanning post.I used to use wire stretchers for my coon and wood with belly wedge for coyote and fox but went to wood on the coon too.It made them feel and look thicker overall.After all presentation is the key to good prices.I just went ahead and made my own wood stretchers for the coon too.Never regretted it.I never was much of a trapper.My Dad was.I mostly hunted.
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I've enjoyed this post to Ed. I much prefer wood stretchers to wire although I do use wire for rats. It is all about presenting a hide and with wood you can skin slightly different and pin more fur on back. I usually just use belly board for air dried hides but for softening tanned hide I like to stretch them as much as I can before they dry and then a little more as they do.
Love your Beaver hoop I don't have any around my trapping area. Probably a good thing. I've always wanted to do the hoop thing with a huge rat. Their not nearly as much work.
Bjrogg
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Ed,
Love the displays. Thanks for the info. We will see time permitting, I will get a new selfbow made this summer and a couple of hides tanned. Probably should work on some opossum first to get the hang of it. Thin skinned critters shouldn't take long for them.
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Very nice job!! Thanks for. Sharing.
I trap a few beaver every year for local farmers... this year I'm on number 6 with a few weeks of season yet... darn things ate about a 1/2 acre of corn in one river bottom field. I make them into hoops like yours to give or trade.. I usually just flesh , cream tan then stretch till dry. They are a tad stiff but works good for hoops. Also have a few muskrats and will probably get more before it's over. Might try making a hat?
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Love to see a hat build along (-P
Bjrogg
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Sometime I will BJ.Not a whole lot to it though.A couple of 4" bands of hide fur the go around your head comfortably.Then an egg shaped top the same circumference.Face and tail optional.Mounty style ear flaps optional too....Ha Ha Ha.Just a lot of hand sewing is all.Takes me 4 to 5 hours.About the length of an average snow storm...Ha Ha Ha.
At one time I had a surging sewing machine for fur sewing.Then the hat would only take 45 minutes to make.Sold the machine though.Just got a slave sweat shop singer from a band suit making factory that'll sew 5 to 6 layers of canvas easily now.A little heavier duty is all that means.Kinda cool machine though.It's got it's own oil pan that circulates oil through the machine.No need to oil it by hand any.
I've got a nice Viking zig zag sewing machine for sale here too that I don't need any more.
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I was thinking the same bjrogg. We're not in any hurry Bow...we'll maybe I don't know ? I hate searching the webs".".........
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Now you guys are trying to have fun with me.
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DV IN MN & BJ.......Here's some prepared hoops for hooping future beavers.If you look close you'll see a 1/2" rerod hoop I used wrapping the fresh willow saplings onto it to dry to get the almost perfect round shape.I even hooped a woodchuck once.An egg shaped hoop just tying the ends of the sapling at a 45 degree usually was the way it was done in the old days I'm sure.After making these I went on a terror and made many different sized hoops out of willow.
(https://i.imgur.com/3f5BcgT.jpg)