Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Horn Bows => Topic started by: Jakesnyder on September 16, 2018, 12:46:30 pm
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I have been fascinated with these composite bows. Just wondering how I get started in making one? I've been looking at horns online to buy. Does it matter what animals they are from? Buffalo or antalope or sheep?
I'm an intermediate Bowyer at selfbows, short bows and have made a couple sinew backed bows.
So if someone can help me get started. Should I start with a wood horn and sinew composite or just horn and sinew?
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I found some buffalo semi polished horns for like $30 a piece. They are 22in long. Also I live inwestern pa. My sinew backed bows shoot just fine so I'm guessing humidity wont be a problem? .
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The thing that stalled my horn bow build was finding perfect wood for the core, so, sourcing the core wood might be the next step; if you can't find any then that might help you decide on horn and sinew or wood/horn/sinew...
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So what would be a good core wood? Is there certain types of horn that are better than others? Why would one add a wood core? More power? Is just horn and sinew ok?
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Ithink it has something to do with the wood core adding a lot of draw weight by raising the neutral planes without adding all that much weight.
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Will bamboo make a good core? Anyone use buffalo horn?
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I started one about 5 bows back but devoleped a fetish for angular bows , but a good source for info is Adam Korpowicz , Turkish Ottoman bows it's a top notch book I have read it at least 5 times and planing on reading it again very detailed , but my choice of horn is water buffolow & core is sugar maple , but BowEd on here has used gemsbok horn with great success I would stay away from any processed or polished horn , I would highly recomend the above book it covers every thing on these bows in great detail ! You guys are making me want to get back to it...lol
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Where can I get some horn? Does anyone know of anywhere I can get some?
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James Parker, Huntworthy Products is a sponsor and has everything you need to make a horn composite bow. James has made just about any style you can think of.
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I picked up some semi processed WB slats from James a while back I dont know if he is still doing them I also picked up some raw un processed WB slats out of China off the big auction site longer ones are getting harder to come by but found some, I have 2 more other bows to finish up but planning on getting back to this build this winter ! Gemsbok horn is easier to find long horns !
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Horn
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I'm wanting to start with native american style. I have one of Jim hamm's book where he describes a 1 in wide handle fading to 3/4in nocks. Does anyone know of some books describing the process for na style bows
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The only book I have seen any coverage of that type bow is Reginald Laubins book Native American Archery and its not supper detailed in build info but interesting read there used to be a guy around here that made severale of them but havent seen him post in a while.
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Does hickory make a good core?
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Yep go to the threads below Bowed or Beadman has made 6 ot 7 I lost count...lol out of hickory I prefer maple in all lam bows with three or more lams , he also has some great hands on formulas for sinew & horn draw weight all bows draw weight are a sum of the thickness , width ,taper, length and reflex of the limbs for given materials you could probably figure out your native bow with his formulas but like said Adams book is really a great place to start, I use it for other style bows too , with any bow of different materials the first is always guess work just part of the game !
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If I use a wood core do I taper it in thickness? Does the horn get tapered? I think I red somewhere that I should tiller out the wood core part way then add the horns to it. Is this correct?
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Yes for your type if you go & look at Eds hickory horn bow builds he exsplains it in detail it would answer your questions , every bow is different as stated above , you would do your self a favor reading his builds or Adams book !
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Jakesnyder....I can relate to your fascination to composite bows.The bows I posted made out of hickory have longer working limbs than your actual turkish horn bows.A lightweight type war bow so to speak and I use them for durable hunting bows.They perform very well storing energy with immense amount of early draw weight and are fun to make and shoot.You would learn a lot about all phases of working and making horn bows.
The turkish horn bows core is not tapered as much.They have shorter working areas on their limbs.I used ironwood as a core on one of those.Good cores[stay away from pins and knots/irregular grain] are required of course as well as the other components also because of extreme profiles on all these bows.You will find that out along your journey making them.Adams' book is a gem of information.
If you have trouble acquiring horn PM me as I have sources.
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The only downside I can see with these bows is the immense time investment for a guy like me with only a couple hours here & there they really take a commitment , but the composite long bows or the native composites are doable with limited time !
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Did the native Americans use a wood core or just horn and sinew?
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How much heat can horn take? When do you know if horn has had too much heat?
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I can only speake to dry heat , I know some use boiling water or I have seen oil used to, I'm assuming your talking for straitening the horn when horn gets thinner it bends fairly easy with minimal amounts of heat, In the pics when straitening I used a laser thermometer and never broke 110 F but used less where needed for very short periods of time it bends easy and little heat is needed I also at times wrapped the horn strips in a electric blanket before heating and bending one of the techniques in Adams book , to much heat and you can ruin the horn compretion qualitys !
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Horn
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Would it be better to double up my gemsbok lams to make around 1/4" thick lams or add a hickory core to my 1/8" lams?
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1/8" thick horn can give you a 50 60 pound bow with enough sinew of 1/8" finished thickness or more and a wood core of 1/4" thick midlimb.1/8" finished thickness horn midlimb is enough to do well in compression work on that.With a starting width of 1 and 3/8" wide at the fades starting width.
I think bubby on here made a very nice looking NA style bow something like your talking about.
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Is hide glue strong enough to hold gemsbok horns together if I doubled them up. I'm thinking to get them completely smooth and flat they will be a little under 1/8"thick.
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This is what I'm talking about
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I've never done that before and would be very leary about trying it too.Butt joints are reccommended but to me only in the non working portions of the bow.The handle or tips.That can depend on how extreme of reflex you would put the bow in too.Still I would'nt reccommend to try that.
Hide glue is a strong enough glue but if the butt joint fails it won't make any difference whether the rest stays together.You've sinewed bows before hav'nt you?and or tillered bows from extreme reflex?
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Yes I have sinewed 2 osage shortbows.
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That could potentially work Jake, but I would probably take the safer route and just make a shorter bow using the horn you have. 2-3mm (.080 -.120") is a little thin but could still produce a decent weight bow if you keep your core wood a little thicker, say maybe 4-5mm, and get a good 4mm thick layer of sinew on it. If you kept your length under 130cm, then you would be fine.
Also keep the core and horn as wide as possible through the bending areas.
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I'm having trouble acquiring sheep horn for a horn and sinew only bow. Can someone with more experience PM me maybe with a Ebay link of a horn that looks like it would be a good candidate? How can you tell the thickness of the horn? What about the type of sheep it is off of? I tryed contacting james parker and couldn't get ahold of him. If someone could help I'd appreciate it.
I dont want to spend 500 on some horns that I cant make into a bow. Thanks.