Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: johnminnitt on December 13, 2018, 02:46:19 pm
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I have always thought of malming as basically the sort of heat and resin treatment that Marc StLouis advocates so eleoquently.
However I came across, on Youtube, a suggestion that some beneficial effect (though, I assume, less) can be got through the application of resin and solvent (Pine resin and turpentine in this case) to the belly without the high-temperature heat treatment, in that the resin still penetrates the near-surface cells of the belly wood and sets, somewhat hardening it.
Has anyone heard of this, or even tried it, might it work or really be not much more than a varnish?
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I've not heard this but I also doubt it would be effective. The terp/pitch would only be absorbed a small amount on cold wood and I can't see how that would increase compression. Poly spray would be similar, I'd think.
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Haven’t tried it but isn’t burnishing also reported have a similar benefit?
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Using penetrating resinous finishes is common in the flyrod building community to increase compression resistance and waterproofing.
You certainly can get stuff to soak into wood cold with a suitable solvent carrier but typically you would use heat or pressure to do so.
Might as well go for maximum effect.
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Using penetrating resinous finishes is common in the flyrod building community to increase compression resistance and waterproofing.
You certainly can get stuff to soak into wood cold with a suitable solvent carrier but typically you would use heat or pressure to do so.
Might as well go for maximum effect.
That makes me think of using heat and then dousing it with swell lock. I will try that on my next to see if it does anything. Hmmmm
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Using penetrating resinous finishes is common in the flyrod building community to increase compression resistance and waterproofing.
You certainly can get stuff to soak into wood cold with a suitable solvent carrier but typically you would use heat or pressure to do so.
Might as well go for maximum effect.
Do you think moderate heat (eg hairdryer) would help penetration, rather than the full-on wood-altering roasting?
Obviously it wouldn't be as effective as the whole treatment, I just have aesthetic hesitations about the browning, especially with yew which I like in its normal colour.
Thanks anyway to all who have responded.
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John, I've never heard of that process before but it sounds interesting. If you try it, let us know how it works.
I think any application of heat would speed the process.
Jawge
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I agree with George. Even a little heat will help the solution penetrate into the wood and if nothing else it will seal the wood a bit better.
O(n hickory and other whitewood bows, if I don't want to stain or dye the wood I will hand rub in oil with finely ground charcoal into the bow. The heat from the friction of hand rubbing helps it penetrate and cuts the "mighty white" appearance of the wood.
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jfyi, none of the standard dictionaries I checked include the word "malming." Is it another term somebody just decided to make up?
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...or fat fingers typing on a smart phone.
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All words and terms are made up.
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I know that when used on a limb right after the heat-treating it is drawn into the wood quite a ways. I've seen this by heating up a limb after it has been tillered, especially so on a white-wood like Elm. You can see the resins come up to the surface of the wood.
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All words and terms are made up.
Absotively corright!
Del :)
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jfyi, none of the standard dictionaries I checked include the word "malming." Is it another term somebody just decided to make up?
I read somewhere (sorry, don't recall where, so it could be twaddle), that it is a Norwegian word, originally something to do with damaging pine trees in such a way that they produce more resin in the wood which makes the wood stronger.
As I say, I can't guarantee the accuracy of this, are there any Norwegian members out there?
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All words and terms are made up.
OK. to avoid the peanuts, I should have noted that the "made up word" is not commonly recognized yet, and that I was unable to find a definition. I had an editor tell me that the language grows from the bottom--people who don't know the correct word just choose another or make one up. That seems ever so common on forums.
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All words and terms are made up.
OK. to avoid the peanuts, I should have noted that the "made up word" is not commonly recognized yet, and that I was unable to find a definition. I had an editor tell me that the language grows from the bottom--people who don't know the correct word just choose another or make one up. That seems ever so common on forums.
What was that other word that you got all belligerated about?
Oh yeah, it was power lam.
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At least belligerated is logical and follows rules of construction. I can be gusted with that one. The other one you are thinking of may the use of the noun gift as a verb. Now I've even seen people use "gifter" to mean one who transfers a thing to another person by "gifting" it. Such people are not gifted.
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...and while were at it...why use telephone-speak on a computer.
"jfyi"...come on, Jim. You're better that that. :)
Jawge
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Methinks, we have a bit of confusion going on here! The topic is "malming", which may well be a term in a language other than English, (which is a bastard language anyway) meaning to infuse oils and resin into wood, heated or not. Google the darned term and specify Norwegian and see if there is a hit! It may well be in an unabridged dictionary if it has crept into English at all. Some of us have a bit more exposure to advanced learning, but who the hell cares! - the focus here should be primitive skills! We don't really need a pp contest! Btw, I will match advanced learning credits and degrees with anyone and be in the upper percentages, and I try to learn something new every day!
Hawkdancer
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Hi all together,
the correct term would be "mælming" and is norwegian.
Once used to protect and harden skis it is also used in bow making.
Natural resin and a solvent are worked into the wood by heat over hours.
The temperature is supposed to be not as high as used in roasting the belly of a bow.
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Just out of interest I have remembered where I heard about this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EyorVGyXnk
There's not much about it in the (very discursive) video, but there is an interesting comment by someone called Ulf Ullring (who sounds like he comes from the right part of the world. (If he is behind a pseudonym on here my apologies to him). I will quote a bit of it, I hope it doesn't contravene any copyright or anything
"Malming is in Scandinavia a way to make a pine tree all heartwood before you cut it. It is done by damaging the tree a couple of years or more before you cut it. "Malm" means "heartwood" in all the Scandinavian languages. Wikipedia says: "Ore-pine (Norwegian: malmfuru; Swedish: malmfura; Danish: malmfyr; Icelandic: málmfura) is a cured pinewood used extensively in the Middle Ages in the construction of Scandinavian stave churches. Ore-pine is the heartwood of prepared old-growth mountain pines; the trees had their branches removed and were left to stand, the tree resins bleeding upward and out through the cut branches and thus making the heartwood more resinous. The resultant ore-pine is much more resistant to rot and decay, as evidenced by stave churches surviving from the 12th and 13th centuries.[1][2]" Malm-wood are valuable because it is very rot resistant. It also becomes more dense and heavy. I have made skis of pine with much malm, and remember it didn't take a bend as well as pine with less malm. The tip after being boiled for some time, bent and then dried in the form, still wanted to straighten when it was removed from the form. But a canoe paddle I made from malm is very springy and durable, and after 40 years doesn't show a single crack. In the old bow building tradition of boreal Scandinavia (and Asia), where the classic good bow woods does not grow, composite bows where made of pine reaction wood on the compression side"
Whether adding resin and solvent afterwards can have a similar effect I will see.
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Using penetrating resinous finishes is common in the flyrod building community to increase compression resistance and waterproofing.
You certainly can get stuff to soak into wood cold with a suitable solvent carrier but typically you would use heat or pressure to do so.
Might as well go for maximum effect.
Do you think moderate heat (eg hairdryer) would help penetration, rather than the full-on wood-altering roasting?
Obviously it wouldn't be as effective as the whole treatment, I just have aesthetic hesitations about the browning, especially with yew which I like in its normal colour.
Thanks anyway to all who have responded.
You can get Yew quite hot before it browns noticeably. Light yew just looks like dark yew until you get above 300°f.
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[/quote]
language grows from the bottom--people who don't know the correct word just choose another or make one up.
[/quote]Does that mean that language is becoming more dumbed down?
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Well now that the word meaning is established we just need to get Jim to approve and we're good to add it to the lexicon.
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Interesting thought, in all areas. ;) :) Sorry guys I am the guilty party of being gifted, I am so ashamed ;) But I barely got through English anyway.
Pappy