Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Flight Bows => Topic started by: DC on February 13, 2019, 03:43:00 pm

Title: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 13, 2019, 03:43:00 pm
How thick does the vellum have to be? My son has some in his stash of stuff. He says it's a little thicker than writing paper. Will that work? I just want to try an arrow or two and the minimum I can buy is 25 sheets, enough to make fletching for a small army.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Aaron H on February 13, 2019, 04:47:03 pm
I've never looked at any up close, but from the pictures I have have seen, they seem pretty thick.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Aaron H on February 14, 2019, 06:11:13 am
You may have seen these before...
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: JNystrom on February 14, 2019, 02:57:03 pm
Of course you want it to be as thin as possible, but rigid at the same time.

Some rawhide's are somehow harder and make thinner fletchings, so i would prefer those. My friend tanned his own deer hide and ended up with superior fletchings.
I just measured my arrows and those had 0,5mm thick (1/50 of an inch) goat hide fletching. With good, stiff hide you might be able to lose as much as half of the thickness... i think.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: PatM on February 16, 2019, 08:20:06 am
Does he have real vellum or the fake stuff?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Badger on February 16, 2019, 09:25:54 am
  A couple of years ago i took some water buffalo horn to a water jet cutter and he sliced it up in .008 thin strips for fletching. Very stiff like razor blades and still primitive. I have never tried them yet.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 16, 2019, 09:48:30 am
Does he have real vellum or the fake stuff?
That I'm not sure of, but if it's just a little thicker than paper it's probably too thin isn't it?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: PatM on February 16, 2019, 01:22:19 pm
  It would depend on how stiff it is per  thickness.   But if it's not real vellum then there's probably dozens of other materials that would match it.

 Not sure if you're trying to be authentic or just experimenting with solid fletching material.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 16, 2019, 02:59:18 pm
I'm just experimenting but I would prefer natural stuff. I've been eyeing those PET plastic cookie/cake trays. Same kind of stuff that pop/soda bottles are made from. It's recyclable, does that count toward natural ;D ;D
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 16, 2019, 03:44:30 pm
DC -

I believe they “sized” it with shellac . . . but I can’t find the reference.

regard,

Scyth
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: willie on February 16, 2019, 04:03:17 pm
Don,

drafting paper comes in various finishes, one is called "vellum"
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 16, 2019, 05:43:19 pm
My son does calligraphy and illumination. I just don't think he would cheap out on the writing surface but I'm still waiting to hear from him.
A couple of questions. If you're using stiff fletchings, is it advisable to wear a glove? I shoot off my hand and the fletch rarely hits me but the idea of something rigid  going by my hand gives me the willies(sorry Willie ;D)
Also with the rigid fletching almost on the nock, how do you get your fingers around the string?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 16, 2019, 06:48:23 pm
DC -

Note : the alignment fletching vs. the alignment nock . . . and a
thumb-ring  resolve the problem of how to fit the fletching to the fingers.

regards,

Scyth
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 16, 2019, 06:59:18 pm
Another question. I thought that the fletch would be in a groove but your shafts are wrapped in sinew first. Do you just butt the fletch up to the sinew and hide glue it?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 16, 2019, 07:03:22 pm
Another question. I thought that the fletch would be in a groove but your shafts are wrapped in sinew first. Do you just butt the fletch up to the sinew and hide glue it?

Yup.

Scyth
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 16, 2019, 07:10:24 pm


. . . here is how you shape the shaft & the nock . . .


regards,

Scyth
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: PatM on February 17, 2019, 05:52:08 am
You would be wise  to set the arrows up for your style of shooting.    Also vellum is rawhide.  You can just use some thin hard rawhide and sand it to your desired thickness.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: JNystrom on February 17, 2019, 06:08:02 am
What Pat said.

I have a hard time believing the fletchings will stay on the shaft if there is no groove or the vellum is not split to widen the base. I use the groove method with superglue and it works well.
But sure, turks did sinew bind the nock before fletching. However, did they split the base to widen the glue surface?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 17, 2019, 10:16:07 am
Turkish flight arrows . . .

http://margo.student.utwente.nl/sagi/artikel/turkish/


regards

Scyth

Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 17, 2019, 07:39:26 pm
Does he have real vellum or the fake stuff?

It's real calf hide. He's going to send me some. If it's too thin maybe I can laminate a couple of pieces. I do have a piece of rawhide that BowEd sent me. It's about .060" thick so I would have to sand it.
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 20, 2019, 10:32:47 pm
Aha !

Got the reference . . .

“The Turkish arrow from Okcu Bekir uses Ahari (traditional Turkish calligrapher's paper... "of ahar").  It is only used for Menzil/Flight arrows.

Ahari is paper brushed with an egg++ mixture, then when dry; burnished.  This material may reduce the parasitic drag. ”


regards,

Scyth
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: stuckinthemud on February 25, 2019, 02:49:20 pm
Scyth, thanks for posting that paper,  do you agree the original arrows' nocks were 3 piece assemblies - I can't imagine that gluing the 'blades' of the nock was strong enough, even with the sinew wrapping, it seems from your photo that you carve the nocks directly into the end of the arrow shaft. They are very,very nice work, most inspirational!
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: DC on February 28, 2019, 06:00:09 pm
I got the vellum. It's .008"(.2mm). It's fairly stiff. Do you think I should laminate two pieces together?
Title: Re: Vellum fletching
Post by: Scyth on February 28, 2019, 08:40:07 pm
I got the vellum. It's .008"(.2mm). It's fairly stiff. Do you think I should laminate two pieces together?

DC -

I wouldn’t . . .

the lighter the better (glue is HEAVY).

regards,

Scyth