Primitive Archer

Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: burtonridr on December 01, 2019, 04:11:03 pm

Title: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 01, 2019, 04:11:03 pm
What do you guys think? I've been looking at this thing for days and need a second set of eyes, but I think I about got it.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: TimBo on December 01, 2019, 05:14:06 pm
That second photo is a bit funny since it is not directly from the side.  What sort of wood and backing are you using?  I hate to comment too much on the tiller, although it does seem to me that the bottom limb is bending a bit more than the top about a third of the way from the tip (the bottom third in this case).  Maybe that top outer third is a bit stiff?  My tillering eye is pretty rusty right now...
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: SLIMBOB on December 01, 2019, 05:27:43 pm
I cant comment much on the tiller as it looks a little different from pic to pic.  What I can offer is a way for you to check it.  While braced, take measurements along one limb at some intervals (every 4-5 inches as an example). Now compare those measurements to the same locations on the other limb while braced.  Bottom limb for me will typically be a tad stiffer than the top.  With that information adjust as needed until the measurements are the same (or close).  Lastly, check the bend with a straight edge while braced and while drawn to say 15 inches.  The gap will tell the story. 
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: George Tsoukalas on December 01, 2019, 05:51:02 pm
Looks good. Very nice. Jawge
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Pat B on December 01, 2019, 05:55:03 pm
I think it looks good also.   :OK
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Eric Krewson on December 01, 2019, 06:09:52 pm
The top limb has a very even bend the whole length. The bottom limb is a little stiff for the last foot and bending more just before that stiff foot or so.

Again pictures can distort things and I could be wrong, put a tillering gizmo on that bottom limb and see what it says.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: DC on December 01, 2019, 06:51:22 pm
It looks good to me too. The only thing I can suggest is turning the bow upside down and taking another picture. Then compare the pictures. So many times I've seen pictures of bows that look like the bottom limb is bending more. If you take another picture and now the top limb is bending more you know that limb is weak. If the bottom limb still looks weak then it's bow cant, camera lens or some other thing.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Deerhunter21 on December 01, 2019, 06:55:36 pm
+1 DC
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burchett.donald on December 01, 2019, 09:38:58 pm
I'm liking the fade movement in the upper...Looks nice, maybe a touch more on the lower fade...
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 01, 2019, 10:23:50 pm
Thanks guys,sounds like i need to shave a little more off the outer third of the lower limb.  :OK...

But before i do i will get a pic with the bow flipped at full draw like dc suggested.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Hawkdancer on December 01, 2019, 10:59:09 pm
Very carefully! :BB
Hawkdancer
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: George Tsoukalas on December 02, 2019, 12:10:13 pm
I like the lower limb a bit stiffer. Jawge
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 01:25:50 pm
I like the lower limb a bit stiffer. Jawge

Why do you like the lower limbs a little stiffer?


Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: bushboy on December 02, 2019, 02:52:30 pm
Nice work.it would be much easier to judge the tiller if you nocked and arrow and held the bow with a loose grip
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 02:55:12 pm
Nice work.it would be much easier to judge the tiller if you nocked and arrow and held the bow with a loose grip

I will do that tonight  :OK


I had a tight grip at the time trying to push the bottom out/keep the handle vertical, but thinking about it now I wonder if the reason the bottom wants to rotate towards me is because the bottom limb is still to stiff?
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 08:44:05 pm
Ok here are a few more pics, first is right side up, second is upside down.

*For some reason today when I shot the bow it has a vibration now, it didnt yesterday   :o.... The only thing I did to it was let it sit strung over night to stretch the new string, I unstrung this morning, took it apart and put it back together.... Not sure what to think.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Deerhunter21 on December 02, 2019, 09:27:43 pm
I feel like theirs something off  :-\
I cant see it!  >:( well wait for someone better than me!
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: TimBo on December 02, 2019, 09:57:35 pm
Are the limbs the same length? How does the balance feel each way (normal and flipped)? At this point I would go by how it feels and shoots, since it looks like you are at, or close to, full draw.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 10:13:43 pm
Ok, stuck the gizmo on it and made about an average of 10 scrapping strokes with a knife in about 3 spots on each limb.

As for how it feels, it feels good and balanced, draw feels nice, just dealing with string vibration  :-\

I think the tiller looks better, on the lower limb I mostly took scraps just on the fade side of the mid limb. See new pics, first pic right side up, second pic upside down.

BTW, I think part of the optical illusion on that lower limb that keeps throwing me off (and maybe others) is the fading into a thicker outter limb the last 6 inches near the knock. If you focus purely on the back of the bow, the bend is more consistent.... I dunno maybe its just me?
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 10:21:21 pm
Are the limbs the same length? How does the balance feel each way (normal and flipped)? At this point I would go by how it feels and shoots, since it looks like you are at, or close to, full draw.

Limbs are identical in length, feels good when drawing. Did just notice while really focusing on it that one of the string loops was kinda clicking/bumping something at a slight draw. I flipped the string over and it went away, didnt cure the vibration unfortunately. 
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 02, 2019, 11:03:58 pm
I think I got it figured out... there was(maybe even still is slightly) a little whip tiller on the lower limb, I took about 20 strokes off the inner 2/3 of the bottom limb and now the whole limb checks out better with the gizmo.

What do you guys think?

first pic right side up, second pic upside down.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: SLIMBOB on December 03, 2019, 06:52:42 am
That looks good to me.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: bjrogg on December 03, 2019, 07:05:05 am
I'm thinking that's looking good. Assuming nothing strange going on with unbraced profile.
Bjrogg
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: DC on December 03, 2019, 10:48:12 am
Here's a overlay/reverse image. It's really hard to see the bow against the white garage door. but look carefully. I did this with Gimp, a free download. It takes a little fiddling but it shows some stuff.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 03, 2019, 11:04:13 am
Here's a overlay/reverse image. It's really hard to see the bow against the white garage door. but look carefully. I did this with Gimp, a free download. It takes a little fiddling but it shows some stuff.

That is a great idea!! I never thought of that.

I'm not sure what to think, but it looks to me like the bottom limb still has slightly more bending right about where the string silencer is at? What do you guys think?.... I'm really not sure if I should mess with it anymore or not? It seem very close to me. If you were to remove a little more on the bottom limb, where would you focus?
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: DC on December 03, 2019, 11:13:13 am
I think I would make the stiff limb be the bottom limb(if you can) and call it done.
 
Take the picture with a grain of salt. When I flip the pictures I try to line up the tips but I'm not sure that's right. Maybe I should be making the handle level. The still picture shows some but it's better when you can slide one layer around. A darker background helps a lot.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 03, 2019, 12:45:45 pm
Lucky for me the stiff limb is the bottom limb already  :)


Thanks for all the input everyone, I think I will call it good enough and move on to finish work.... And trying to reduce the string noise  :OK
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: PaSteve on December 03, 2019, 04:45:42 pm
Bow looks really nice. Good job on your tiller.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 03, 2019, 10:05:39 pm
Thanks pasteve :OK
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: bradsmith2010 on December 03, 2019, 10:31:39 pm
The string noise is not effecting performance,,.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 04, 2019, 10:21:34 am
The string noise is not effecting performance,,.

No, its just a nuisance. Part of what excited me was how quite the bow was when I had it strung with the nylon mason line during tillering. It just felt so good to shoot and it was absolutely silent. Now its like shooting a guitar lol. I'm trying different things and its getting a little better with slight modifications. Part of it might be in the handle(it is a take down, going to add cork between the risers), maybe part of it is in the knock design(going to wrap the string with yarn), maybe its because before it was littered with course rasp marks all over(not much I can do here), maybe its because the string doesnt stretch like the nylon one did(might add a few more twists to the string), maybe a combination of limb profile and wood type, maybe heavier arrows might help, I have no idea lol, but man it irks me!

Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: DC on December 04, 2019, 11:11:57 am
Do you use a bracer when you're shooting? I found once that the string was vibrating against the bracer. I had chased that noise for a couple of days and 1/4" increase in brace height fixed it. Just a wild chance :D
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: bradsmith2010 on December 04, 2019, 11:21:39 am
A string silencer,,,will help..also fast fligh is quieter as well
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: burtonridr on December 04, 2019, 11:32:08 am
Do you use a bracer when you're shooting? I found once that the string was vibrating against the bracer. I had chased that noise for a couple of days and 1/4" increase in brace height fixed it. Just a wild chance :D

I wear a bracer sometimes, but with this bow recently I have been shooting bare arm at a block in the garage. Having a long sleeve shirt or something for the string to hit actually helps stop/muffle the vibration.

All the noise is in the string humming, like plucking a guitar, it will hum for a few seconds after the shot. String silencers have helped, they seem to muffle it a little. I put on on each end about 12" from the nocks.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Eric Krewson on December 05, 2019, 08:03:46 am
Silencers work the best if they are 1/3 down the limb length from the tip. B-50 is fairly quiet, fast flight has an annoying twang. I put fur silencers on my bows just to keep from hearing that twang.
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Arrowind on December 05, 2019, 07:03:36 pm
Looks like a good shooter!  As for the noise.  I didn't read every post word for word so if someone already said this forgive me.  If you haven't already done this try different brace heights.  I have a bow that makes a good bit of noise when braced around 6.5 inches but when braced at 7 or a tad more it quiets right down.   Cool bow dude!  Looks like the tiller pretty darn good to me. 
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Arrowind on December 05, 2019, 07:06:27 pm
Looks like a good shooter!  As for the noise.  I didn't read every post word for word so if someone already said this forgive me.  If you haven't already done this try different brace heights.  I have a bow that makes a good bit of noise when braced around 6.5 inches but when braced at 7 or a tad more it quiets right down.   Cool bow dude!  Looks like the tiller pretty darn good to me.

Oh haha!  i just read DC's post.    ;D    :OK
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: George Tsoukalas on December 08, 2019, 01:41:51 pm
I like the lower limb  a little stiffer because I feel as though it is under more strain.

What kind of noise are you hearing on release?

A very loud  thwacking noise is indicative of and arrow that is over spined or a brace height that is too low. I like the brace height 7-7.5 inches from string to the back of the bow.

Jawge
Title: Re: Tiller Check Please : )
Post by: Woodely on December 08, 2019, 02:57:39 pm
Silencers work the best if they are 1/3 down the limb length from the tip. B-50 is fairly quiet, fast flight has an annoying twang. I put fur silencers on my bows just to keep from hearing that twang.
"B-50 is fairly quiet, fast flight has an annoying twang."   +2  .  And there is a give and take with both materials, B-50 may stretch but is quiet.