Primitive Archer
Main Discussion Area => Bows => Topic started by: 5up3rm4n on February 19, 2020, 09:04:48 pm
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Hello all...I've been looking at all your posts and finally decided to register and just got my approval. I am a COMPLETE newbie to bow making but I feel i have a base understanding of the craft. I just harvested an HHB sapling with a base diameter of 2.5". I know, it may be too narrow but after counting its tightly compressed rings, its 20 years old. Should i leave it alone and use it as a walking stick, or take a chance on turning it into my first bow? It does have a few knots but i believe I could pull off a "training blank" from it.
Anyway, hello from the North :)
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Welcome to PA. 2.5" HHB could make a hunting weight bow(45#+). You should at least split or saw it in half lengthwise and seal the ends. Sometimes, a stave that small will draw up in reflex and twist as it dries. What I do, I usually saw a pole this size in half lengthwise, bind the 2 halves back together with spacers between for good air circulation and set them aside to dry.
Good luck with your first attempt and don't forget to ask questions and post pics of your process or problems.
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Thanks! will do! ;D its 62.5" long. i will post a pic.
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Here is the stave. I harvested it yesterday afternoon. i brought it indoors to dry. Any suggestions, i am wide open. I will split it tomorrow.
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I'm gonna move this to "BOWS" so you will get more input.
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I would look for a better stave.
ps I was just up your way a few days ago on a day hike.
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I’d give it a try. Rather than split the stave down the middle I’d orient it so the fewest knots will be on the back. Then I’d leave the handle section full diameter and draw knife or hatchet the belly down to rough bow dimensions. Leave the bark on the handle and the back and seal everything else and bring it inside. Don’t put it by a hot fire or stove until it’s stopped losing weight. High heat now would probably ruin it at this point. Seal with shellac or 50% water diluted wood glue. You may be able to start working it in a month. Just track its weight loss and don’t touch it until it stops losing weight.
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Welcome aboard! The folks here have a wealth of knowledge, as you noticed. Remember to take lots of pictures and post. No pics, it didn't happen (lol)! Ask questions, the only dumb question is the one you don't ask! Be patient, and use good tools. What provence are you in, there's a lot of north up there?
Hawkdancer
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Hello!!!! and welcome to PA!!!!
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I think all those knots will come back and bite you. Id go look for a knotless sapling.
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That looks to be challenging for a first stave. If you want to try it anyway, I would do as hoosierf suggests. Splitting them when they are that small can be tricky. But putting that one aside and looking for a really clean sapling is probably a better bet.
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I’d give it a try. Rather than split the stave down the middle I’d orient it so the fewest knots will be on the back. Then I’d leave the handle section full diameter and draw knife or hatchet the belly down to rough bow dimensions. Leave the bark on the handle and the back and seal everything else and bring it inside. Don’t put it by a hot fire or stove until it’s stopped losing weight. High heat now would probably ruin it at this point. Seal with shellac or 50% water diluted wood glue. You may be able to start working it in a month. Just track its weight loss and don’t touch it until it stops losing weight.
That's what I'd do too. But I'd also clamp the stave into the form to prevent twisting while drying.
And one more suggestion: I'm a beginner as well and my biggest mistake to bow making is- i have never enough dry staves. Get more staves. So I can make 2 bows in year and one of them is fail :D. There is never to much staves. I have been smarter on this year....
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Well. I am in central Ontario, near the southern point of georgian bay. I decided, that the sapling will make a great walking stick, so I will go out and get some new wood. There is PLENTY of HHB saplings near me so i will find 3 or 4 a bit larger and clearer than the one I posted. I truly appreciate the insights though and they will be key in making my first bow...patience is something i do have. My house is kept around 69-71°F and RH is roughly 35-45%, i have a shed but no workspace so i will have to keep them indoors...is this suffiecient temp and rh?
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Welcome. You'll be in good hands here. I agree with PatM and PearlDrums. Get yourself a better stave to start with. You'll thank yourself later. Find something that is pipe straight and knot free. try to find one that's a little longer too so you know you'll have enough to work with. Cut it at 72" and then you can make just about anything with it. You can always trim it down later to suit your design. If you can find one with a little more diameter you'll be better off, though 2.5" is enough to make a bow with. If you get a little larger diameter you wont have as much crown on the back which will help out your bow a bit. Good luck and ask lots of questions.
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Well. I am in central Ontario, near the southern point of georgian bay. I decided, that the sapling will make a great walking stick, so I will go out and get some new wood. There is PLENTY of HHB saplings near me so i will find 3 or 4 a bit larger and clearer than the one I posted. I truly appreciate the insights though and they will be key in making my first bow...patience is something i do have. My house is kept around 69-71°F and RH is roughly 35-45%, i have a shed but no workspace so i will have to keep them indoors...is this suffiecient temp and rh?
I've never even seen HHB but I leave all my staves outside(protected)for a couple of months and then bring them in. Wood loses moisture quite fast for the first bit so if you can slow that down some it minimises checking.
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That would be fine for a few months in the winter but bugs will gobble up HHB left outside once the weather breaks.
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Never thought of bugs. We don't have bugs, except for a few mosquitoes.
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Welcome,
I'm still messing up my first staves myself, here in northern Vermont. Cut a HHB first, got maybe 4 staves out of it... they're all a little twisted, with a few knots, but a lot cleaner than yours - which looks mighty challenging. I also cut about 6 staves worth of northern white ash; found some knots and made some mistakes that will be challenging, but still working on a couple of those. No heated shop, so pretty much laying off for another month or so.
Not that I have much at all in the way of experience, but at my stage I agree with the suggestions to look for the very cleanest stave material you have access to. It's hard enough with those!
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That looks to be challenging for a first stave. If you want to try it anyway, I would do as hoosierf suggests. Splitting them when they are that small can be tricky. But putting that one aside and looking for a really clean sapling is probably a better bet.
get one with a clean back and go for a bit bigger diameter 5"- 6" maybe. if you look in a thick stand of saplings, you stand a better chance of finding one where there are fewer knots on the back, as branches die off sooner in shadier locations and the pin knots will have grown over.
get a couple of staves drying and you can decide later which one to start on first. most folks have learned from trial and error, so there is no harm in getting some practice in before starting on your best stave
there are ways to reduce your stave to near bow dimensions to shorten drying times and you can even pratice tillering with a board while you wait on your stave to dry.
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Welcome Muskoka,
Im also from Canada Armstrong BC I use alot of Hawthorn the twist is what gives me the most difficulty (runoff) leave your knots a little proud. I rough out my sapling staves like yours I dont split many I use mostly a hatchet starting with belly then to the profile. Next draw-knife and a farriers rasp with sapling bows I get alot done with the rasp using both sides. The Hawthorn here if its anything like HHB I dont know but it take corrections good except maybe a sideways bend mid limb or tips but can be done with maybe a few applications. Man I would give your stave a go its so straight, Ask questions, go slow I have a hard time doing watch out for knots in your profile. And good luck
chcuk
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Thanks everyone...I think I feel like a coin in mid toss...lol...should I or shouldn't I?...I have the itch and one half of my brain says "its good practice, maybe it will turn out reasonably" then the other half says"ya, but your practicing on something that wont bear fruit... why waste your time?" I think I will try and clean it off, so I can see what I actually have under the bark. Nothing to aggressive though. I wont nick the wood. Then I will decide. I still need to go grab a few more lengths, none-the-less, for future projects so maybe this will whet my appetite further. I saw a few maple saplings near the HHB saplings. Its almost all sugar maples...how do they rate for material?
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Sugar maple makes a good bow. One of the best of the maples given it's hardness and density. I haven't used it personally but I've heard good things. HHB is high quality bow wood though, without a doubt. Good luck and have fun.
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Great to hear! No shortage of staves for me then. Also, where can i read about bow string making in the forum?
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Not sure if there's a step by step here on the site. Here's a video I made on making a flemish loop string. We're not supposed to put active links on here so just close the spaces I made in the address ht tps: //www .youtube.com/watch?v=9EwkEwP8CSQ&t=4s
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good video. so i striped the staff down and sure as you all said, way to knotty for use as a blank...its now a wonderful walking stick. im going out tomorrow to harvest a few new staves
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Good vid!
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Thanks everyone...I think I feel like a coin in mid toss...lol...should I or shouldn't I?...I have the itch and one half of my brain says "its good practice, maybe it will turn out reasonably" then the other half says"ya, but your practicing on something that wont bear fruit... why waste your time?"
if you're short on walking stick well ...do a walking stick
I'd follow the voices whispering in your head. try your hand at that wood
try to tiller at your best. do all the errors that everyone made and start learning
if you'll end with firewood you'll have at least gained some experience
you'll have to wait for the other good staves to season aniway
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I say go for you. These branches I had to cut off didn’t stop me from trying lol. This one came out about 40lb @ 23”. I have drawn it out to 25. I did have about 3” of natural deflex. No speed demon but it shoots an arrow and I learned some things from it.
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best advice I ever got as a noob is that it is just a stick. If it breaks, it was just a stick. don't worry about wasted time and don't fall in love until it shoots. Enjoy the process.
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well then, looks like i am going to try my hand at a bow. ;D
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Well...hhb staves were a no go...way to curved and knotty. So, now i am going to do something different...picked up a piece of red oak with some awesome grain lines. its 3/4" and the grain is parallel linearly. im going to build up the handle with a piece of itself and I dont want to back it...suggestions on dimensions?
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SHHHHHHH!!!! keep your voice down! if ANYONE asks.... you didn't get this from me.......
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Welcome, Joe.
I've made a number of sapling bows.
Check out my site.
http://traditionalarchery101.com/saplingbow.html
Jawge
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SHHHHHHH!!!! keep your voice down! if ANYONE asks.... you didn't get this from me.......
Lol. Mums the word... ::)
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so my draw is 28" and I'm hoping to be around 50-50#...so far so good.