Author Topic: loony rants  (Read 10570 times)

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Offline loon

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loony rants
« on: May 26, 2017, 11:39:01 pm »
About D97... I don't know why there isn't a cheaper competitor already. A lower density, lower strength HMPE (with the same strength/weight ratio - I don't know if it's really possible) could actually be better? It'd make a lighter string for the same thickness...? I think fast flight is overkill in terms of strength and one gets best performance with skinny strings, and since they're stretchier they're a bit less harmful on the bow? at least if the loops aren't too thin. But I think it'd be better to just have a thicker string with thinner serving..
But I'm sure the bowstring companies know a lot more about that than I do.  )-w(

At least D-97 seems like the cheapest HMPE bowstring material compared to all the competitors, and it's really good anyway.

Offline willie

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2017, 01:46:22 am »
Quote
But I'm sure the bowstring companies know a lot more about that than I do

A fair assumption, but doesn't mean their product offerings are optimized for what you want to do.

a lower density product with the same strength/ weight ratio? wouldn't you just need more to do the same job?

Looking for a product with a higher strength/weight ratio? Hmmm

Quote
and since they're stretchier
not necessarily, and there are some vectrans that offer even less stretch.


Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2017, 05:15:27 am »
a lower density product with the same strength/ weight ratio? wouldn't you just need more to do the same job?

It'd give a thicker string for the same weight, which'd be nicer on the fingers. even though one could just do thick serving.. I guess thicker would look nicer. And such a product may end up being less expensive..

Maybe mixing plant fiber with d-97 would give a similar result

Offline bubby

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2017, 11:03:27 am »
Why in the world would u mix plant fibre with d97, this makes no sense
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2017, 04:55:59 pm »
if it has lower density, and I recall someone mixing FF and linen in the flight bows forum???, but yeah it's totally pointless compared to just using thicker serving/padding loops
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 06:59:16 pm by loon »

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2017, 07:09:12 pm »
I have this picture of a Miwok style sinew backed cedar bow that someone made... 39" long? 46#@24"!? 24"? That means I could get 32" out of a 52" long bow of that design, width, draw weight? It's got such a nice looking bend. Hopefully it's not too overstressed. Reverse image search didn't work. Guess I'll look for it in the forums later.





This bow has a pleasing width taper. It just still seems like it could still be unstable. I don't know why they went with narrower inner limbs now...
« Last Edit: May 29, 2017, 07:21:09 pm by loon »

Offline bubby

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2017, 11:53:49 pm »
Loon if you are planning ona 32" draw on a 52" bow you better get started building bows, going to need a bunch under your belt to get to that level😉
failure is an option, everyone fails, it's how you handle it that matters.
The few the proud the 27🏹

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2017, 07:51:04 pm »
true

Just got a 100.5" long, 2 3/8" wide and just over 3/4" thick hard maple board with mediocre grain. I could either make two 50" modoc style (bendy pyramid) bows? or a 56" one. or just a 74" D bow. Or even longer. I dunno. I think I'd want 26" out of a short bow and 32" out of a longer one. 35-40# from a short, 40-60# out of a long bow. the grain is wavy so it could make a character bow...

so. 74"ntn, 1 3/8" max width, 60#@32" D bow vs
56"ntn, 40#@26", 2 3/8" max width, slight bendy handle pyramid

Finals week is next week. Then I graduate and will hopefully have some time to make bows..


edit: Well... a shorter bow would be more strained, so I think I should go with a long D bow, and get a better hickory board later for a paddle bow. Dunno if I could get 60#@32"...

56/26 ~= 2.154, but the bow'd be wider
76/32 ~= 2.375

Problem would be putting that thing on the car when I have to move away... it'd be easier with a 56" bow :p but I think it should be fine either way.

And I already broke a lamp with a 72" bow once... always seem to bang those things everywhere, which is not a problem with my short bows

But I still want one. Yeah. Fairly certain I'll just make a 76" long D bow.

May do the width taper tomorrow with a bandsaw.










« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 05:05:57 am by loon »

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2017, 02:07:40 pm »
mostly concerned about it being quartersawn, and grain violations through the bow.. (ie not the sides but back to belly/belly to back)

Offline PEARL DRUMS

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2017, 03:51:12 pm »
Here are some fun numbers to compare and ponder.

1/4# of D97 has about 1675 feet on it - per BCY site - $23.00 1/8# avg
1/4# of B50 has about 1075 feet on it - per BCY site - $13.00 1/8# avg

D97 needs 6-10 strands - 8 is most common
B55 needs no less than 12 and most often 14-16 strands

Which costs more per string?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 04:04:23 pm by PEARL DRUMS »
Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.

Online bjrogg

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2017, 03:58:35 pm »
Very interesting numbers there Pearl.
Bjrogg
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Offline Danzn Bar

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2017, 06:07:53 pm »
Here are some fun numbers to compare and ponder.

1/4# of D97 has about 1675 feet on it - per BCY site - $23.00 1/8# avg
1/4# of B50 has about 1075 feet on it - per BCY site - $13.00 1/8# avg

D97 needs 6-10 strands - 8 is most common
B55 needs no less than 12 and most often 14-16 strands

Which costs more per string?
Hummmmmmm.......let me guess.
DBar
Integrity is doing the right thing when no one is looking

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2017, 08:15:43 pm »
Here are some fun numbers to compare and ponder.

1/4# of D97 has about 1675 feet on it - per BCY site - $23.00 1/8# avg
1/4# of B50 has about 1075 feet on it - per BCY site - $13.00 1/8# avg

D97 needs 6-10 strands - 8 is most common
B55 needs no less than 12 and most often 14-16 strands

Which costs more per string?
Assuming 6ft long strands,

6*8/1675 * 23
6*12/1075 * 13

D97 string: 66 cents
B55 string: 88 cents

Nice.

I was complaining over nothing. there's nothing wrong with thin strings with thicker serving and padded loops. Guess the title is accurate  :laugh:

I made poplar tepeliks and... got the maple board cut to length. Well, at least I decided what design I'm gonna do.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2017, 08:21:49 pm by loon »

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2017, 03:57:34 am »
With maple, is 3/4" thickness at the handle too thin for a 76"ntn bow, 1 3/8" wide at the handle, 60#@32"?

Offline loon

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Re: loony rants
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2017, 07:10:22 am »
Considering whether or not i should use the rather poor hemp twine for crafts for a bow backing. Maybe linen canvas would be better. In TBB(4 I think) I didn't see if they use titebond or just hide glue for the plant fiber backings... they make it sound like it works really awesome. almost like a primitive thing with fiberglass backing-like effects. i think i should just be careful not to overpower the maple belly