Author Topic: Dogwwoods  (Read 464 times)

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Offline Beadman

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Dogwwoods
« on: September 02, 2017, 08:10:39 am »
Seems every few years I need to replenish some dogwood arrows.I just really like them as an arrow shaft.Arrow making is'nt my most favorite thing to do but when in the mood to do it I gotta strike while the mood is hot.I finalize reduce them with a speed drill in a vise with reduced grit paper using a grain weight scale and a spine tester checking them.Starting with 36 grit all the way down to 220 grit.Before that from prestraightening and nubbin sanding I just scrape the bark off with a knife or I use a meat cleaver.Onto the work bench and full length reduce evenly with a 6" block of 2"by4" with 36 grit paper.It gets me in the ball park.Tedious laborous process but worth the effort.It's ok to take a few minor wiggles out during that process.Does'nt hurt the final product.
From left to right 2 future bundles of seven close to dimensions but not finished yet.I like to let them season as long as I can in a straight bundle.
Then some finished field tip arrows and some broad head arrows.Really like to full length taper these.Usually 5/16" to 11/32" or 23/64".They shoot great.
Up top my aladin lamp with a straightener for the kinks I got from someone on the PA here in a trade or a gift.Thank you very much!Seems over the years I'm shooting a little lower poundage bows so these came in at 30" long TTT @ 550 to 580 grain with 145 grain field tips or broad heads @ 50 to 55 spine using FF string @ a 28" draw.4.25" long feathers/5 degree helical/5/8" at their tallest point.Balance point on these is 4" ahead of or towards the tip of center then.


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I should show this tool too.A sizer from an elk antler.Helps to get in to the ball park.Not all dogwoods are naturally tapered so with the more parallel shaft in the speed drill I sand 1/3 out from nock and back.Then out 2/3rds' and back then out full length to the tip and back and establish my taper.Then it's just a matter of taking material off overall to your spine weight you want.Just like tapering a lamination for a laminated bow.This all is just my way that I like.None of this is written in stone and made other ways too.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2017, 12:27:58 pm by Beadman »
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed

Online DC

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2017, 09:10:54 am »
Very nice set! I'll have to step up my game. :D
Vancouver Island

Offline Aaron H

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #2 on: September 02, 2017, 09:55:45 am »
Thanks for the insight Ed.  So you clamp your drill in a vise with a shaft chucked in the drill?  Do you have anything supporting the opposite end while sanding?

Btw, I have one of those straighteners also, they work great.
But those who put their trust in the Lord will find new strength. They will soar high on wings like eagles...     Isaiah 40:31

Offline Beadman

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #3 on: September 02, 2017, 01:54:37 pm »
Aaron....I start with 32"shafts when they go in the chuck of the drill.Make sure the shaft is in the chuck as far as it can.The fat or tip end goes in there.By then 3/8" or a scooch less in diameter to fit.I clamp the handle of the screw gun securely in the vice.I support the other end with my hand that has sand paper in it starting at the nock end kind of wrapping and pinching the shaft.Usually 4 layers thick so it has some stiffness and body.I push the button on it's highest speed on the screw gun with my left hand and sand with my right hand.
I know people are gonna say oh it goes flippy floppy but for me it does'nt.Not at full speed.It can get floppy when it is'nt in the chuck far enough.A person just adjusts accordingly.It's not that hard to do.One thing it might help to wear a glove.It can get hot.Not always though.
Was that you Aaron that gave me that straightener?
It can seem that perfection is a disease at times[a communical one] or an obsession you might call it especially on a site like this called the primitive archer.I tell ya though if the natives had these tools they would of used them.I'm sure it would of made life easier for them.Bottom lime is they are made from natural materials yet in my mind.Although I'm not experiencing the total effect of the process using modern tools.Seems I lose or break arrows so much I've learned to do it easier.I do understand the things that need to be on a good arrow though even in a primitive situation.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2017, 06:47:31 am by Beadman »
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed

Offline Aaron H

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2017, 02:29:07 pm »
Thanks for the explanation Ed. You didn't get the straightener from me, I just saw similar ones watching a few Korean arrow making videos, and then copied theirs.
But those who put their trust in the Lord will find new strength. They will soar high on wings like eagles...     Isaiah 40:31

Online DC

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2017, 04:32:05 pm »
I include one more power tool. You have to watch it or the spine goes away very quickly.
Vancouver Island

Offline Beadman

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2017, 07:46:45 pm »
Ahhhh yes!!!!!.Crafty way DC.Yes I keep checking them on a spiner but after a while a person gets a feel for it.I think I got more control over it my way though in that I don't get them under spined.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2017, 07:50:07 pm by Beadman »
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed

Online DC

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2017, 09:25:42 pm »
I've found that spinning them against the belt sander can get them quite hot. If you go directly from the sander to the spiner the 2# weight is sometimes enough to bend the arrow. The heat will also weaken the spine so you get a false reading if you do it right away. I get them in the ball park this way and then use a knife as a scraper to arrive at the right spine. Thanks Pappy for the scraper idea. I did this with one of the three I just posted. When I was bare shafting it was hitting nock right so I would shoot it, if it was nock right I would take off a few scrapes and then shoot it again. It was cool watching the the flight straighten a bit each time. Worked a treat.
Vancouver Island

Offline bjrogg

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2017, 03:48:05 am »
Nice shafts and arrows Ed. I really like my shoot arrows too. They are a lot more work and more matinace, but they have their advantages to. I usually use Red Osier but I collected some vibernium and another ornamental shrub that may even
Be in the same family that look promising. Haven't had time to try them yet.
Good Luck hunting with them

DC I'm glad you tried bareshafting, it just really opened my eyes when I first tried it. It is so neat to watch how you can make a arrow that flies sideways straighten itself out by changing its spine.
Bjrogg
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Offline Beadman

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #9 on: September 03, 2017, 08:22:59 am »
BJ....By maintenance I presume you mean straightening?I've had that happen in the past but to be honest the last few batches have stayed straight.I think because they are from older shoots and I let them season a long time straightened.
I seal them with gasket lacquer also.
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed

Offline bjrogg

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2017, 09:26:04 am »
BJ....By maintenance I presume you mean straightening?I've had that happen in the past but to be honest the last few batches have stayed straight.I think because they are from older shoots and I let them season a long time straightened.
I seal them with gasket lacquer also.
Yes Ed, I mean straightening. I have some that stay good and some that don't. I've noticed that they don't seem to like sitting on my truck dash in the hot sun, or really high humidity maybe. It seems like they keep their shape better for me during winter. It seems strange that some of my straightest harvested shoots seem to make me the most trouble. I have some I've been drying straightened and zip tide to broom handles. My previous ones weren't this straight during drying, hopefully this will help, haven't made one from them yet.
Bjrogg
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Online DC

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2017, 10:59:43 am »
I wonder if the some good, some bad relates to how much you had to heat it to straighten it. The straightest ones would have had the least amount of heating during straightening and they give you the most trouble.
Vancouver Island

Offline Beadman

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2017, 03:10:25 pm »
I wonder if the some good, some bad relates to how much you had to heat it to straighten it. The straightest ones would have had the least amount of heating during straightening and they give you the most trouble.
DC.....That could very well be.I've found too though trying to get them perfectly straight can be an excersize in frustration with some of their corkscrew shapes so they are shot just as they are surprisingly accurate too yet.To me wood has a memory so leaving them season a long time[3 months minimum/3 years better/good average of 6 months] I think helps also.
BJ ....I store my shafts in the quiver on end or in card board carpet tubes.Never laying sideways.I think the stuff mine are made out of are gray flowering dogwood.I know when exposed to a wet enviornment such as over night in the dewy grass they can warp some yet.
On a side note those long v grooves heated I've heard help to keep them straight.Never actually experimented with it though.Rolling them on a hot surface such as a wide topped wood stove with a wide weighted board I've heard works too. Seems I get around 1 to 1.5 hours into each one to make a shaft from harvesting to finish just as is.
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed

Offline bjrogg

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2017, 04:34:30 pm »
I've never tried the grooves either Ed. Yup I'd like to have a nice flat top woodstove for straightening shafts. The old wood cookstove we had when I was a lighter would be great.
Bjrogg
A hot cup of coffee and a beautiful sunrise

Offline Beadman

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Re: Dogwwoods
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2017, 05:08:54 pm »
BJ....I've seen what I think is a slick way of putting grooves on these in a piece of wood that has the point of a hardened nail sticking out in the hole then the shaft pulled through the hole.That would work great for parallel width shafts.
Since I've made these lately I have to replenish the stock of shafts to give them time to season.Bundles of 6 around 1 for a total of 7.Staying away from shoots with too much of a kink on them.Wrapping them onto a broom stick handle is a good idea too.Along the way 3 multiflora rose shafts on the left looked too good to pass up too.I straighten/wrap,straighten/wrap,straighten/wrap these a few times while green every other day.Then just let them dry and season.I probably won't think about making arrow shafts from these till next fall.



Seems no matter what type of shoot shafts I harvest I do it the same way whether they be hazel/sourwood/or even bamboo if I had it growing here.The list of shoot shaft material is quite a few.Ocean spray/viburnum/and honey suckle to name a few more,of which I've never made any shafts from though yet.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2017, 05:21:40 pm by Beadman »
You got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything.
Ed