Author Topic: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)  (Read 2354 times)

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Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 With VIDEO)
« Reply #30 on: January 25, 2019, 08:02:14 am »
Hey all. Got some time together got this little guy horned and scraped to the exact dimensions of the original bow. The cross section is kind of between the gallion and squashed rectangle cross section that seemed to be most common. So, the bow essentially has a slightly trapped back.

Below is linked a video of it going to 25" on the tiller. I pulled it to 26" afterwards where it hit 90lbs. It was bolt straight from the get go and now has just shy of 1" string follow. I only needed to scrap the inner/mid limb of the right limb to get balance and this is what it looks like now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0Qz4l4cJ9s

You'll notice that I have duct tape on one limb. That is actually duct tape with a piece of paper under it so it doesn't stick to the bow and leave residue. It is basically a catcher bandage if that spot decides to pop. It is not on there tight but simply a loose band to catch whatever wood might pop off. To my surprise the second growth spot has not budged. I haven't heard a peep and upon inspection there is no gaps observed. Granted I did soak it in CA glue before scraping off rasp marks. So i wonder if that is doing the job or if there is more sound wood than I thought.

Overall I am happy with the progress but also worried. I still have at least 3 inches but preferably 5 inches to go on the tiller. You'll notice the tiller is a bit elliptical. This makes me think the original bow probably was designed for a draw length of between 28-30". You'd think if such a short bow was meant for 31-32" it would bend more in the section of a circle, more in the handle. Maybe I underestimate yew :P. I still have inches for the belly to pop and/or just have the bow blow overall because of its short length. I did burnish the back in hopes of adding some distance.

Just wanted to update everyone. Thank you for watching!

Offline DC

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #31 on: January 25, 2019, 08:26:50 am »
It looks great and so does your shop. Be careful removing wood now. When I got my warbow to that point it seemed that rubbing my hand down it would cost me a pound or two.
Vancouver Island
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Offline meanewood

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #32 on: January 25, 2019, 12:02:20 pm »
Glad to hear things are going well.

That's quite a wide block on your tiller and I can see it's curved but is it curved enough to not interfere with the bend?

When you draw the bow, only a 5-6cm area of your hand is resisting the pull!

If That block swivels, I'd turn it around for less surface area.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2019, 12:06:10 pm by meanewood »

Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #33 on: January 26, 2019, 08:59:39 am »
DC: Thank you. Yeah I'm only going to remove wood for tiller faults. So hopefully none more but we'll see. I'm wanting to see what the bow on Mary Rose would've potentially hit in terms of draw weight. Yeah 1mm too much and you can totally miss your goal draw weight. I know the feeling. I bet this thing will lose 5lbs alone in set if it makes it as far as I want.

meanewood: It is a wide block but so far the wings have not come close to interfering with bend on any of my bows. I suppose a small plains bow it could be a problem. It's so big because a slightly smaller one I had before split right off and contributed to a broken bow. So, I made it chunkier and turned the grain parallel. It could probably stand to lose a little size though I agree.

Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #34 on: January 26, 2019, 07:33:55 pm »
Video: https://youtu.be/D_LvEcqdu-A
Here it is drawn to 28"
Picture also of it at 28": https://imgur.com/I1yY0TZ

Shortly after I pulled it to 29". It's still in one piece! So for the sake of science at 29" it weighed 99lbs. I've only shaved off a tenth of a mm here and there to round out the tiller. So, with the one inch shorter original bow at 29" it would maybe reach 103-105lbs. It is an interesting finding to think even the smallest bow on the ship was round abouts 100lbs probably. Any tiller critiques are welcome. I think I will shoot it at 29" for a bit and then see about those last 2 inches. Do you guys think it has a chance at 31"?

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #35 on: January 26, 2019, 10:50:53 pm »
2" of extra draw is only 2/3" of actual tip movement... it probably be fine.
Del
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Offline DC

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #36 on: January 27, 2019, 06:36:01 am »
You can probably take the tape off now ;) Can we have a picture of the "spot" now it's done?
Vancouver Island
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Offline WillS

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #37 on: January 27, 2019, 09:39:38 am »
In general, the further you pull a bow the more the middle wants to bend.  That means if you've got an elliptical tiller a few inches less than your ideal draw length you're almost certainly safe, provided the limbs are bending well and you have no danger areas.  You'll just end up with a more circular tiller.

Don't forget that smallest and shortest are two different things - there are SMALLER bows on the ship, but not SHORTER.  Yours won't be the lightest by a long way, as some of them were longer and smaller, making them quite a bit less heavy.  Also, using American timber will give you slightly inaccurate results and then you have to work out whether the American timber yours is made from is good, average or bad for its species and so on.  That's why it's virtually impossible to pigeonhole the MR bows into a weight range.  It's also why personally I prefer to always copy one specific bow when I'm making a Mary Rose replica instead of falling into the trap of making "a Mary Rose style bow" because the ever changing results are so interesting.  The fact that the same dimensions applied to timber from the same tree can give me 130lb, 140lb and 180lb shows that nicely.

Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #38 on: January 28, 2019, 06:30:19 am »
Del the Cat: Thank you much. I've always wondered how much tip travel actually happened per inch of draw length. Sounds good.

DC:  ;D You're probably right. I will have pics up after work tonight or tomorrow morning.

WillS: Thank you. Yeah it seems still decently elliptical at 29" so hopefully it'll manage to include the handle in the last 2"... and not blow. ;) Interesting. I did not know there were narrower bows on the ship in terms of girth. Well, just as there are drastic differences from piece to piece of English, Italian, or other European yew, I imagine there are some major discrepancies between pieces of American yew. I've seen that in action for sure. I bet there's a good deal of overlap between the two species but I agree with your point. Taxus brevifolia tends to be slightly lower in SG to Taxus bacatta. This piece in specific is by appearance very good. It has chocolate brown heartwood and an average ring count of 65-75 rpi. But in actual performance on the tree it seems to be taking set and rebounding just about the same as the two 40rpi staves I've worked with previously. Its harder to cut with a scraper than other yew I've worked but doesn't feel exceptionally more dense, but definitely not less. I know these are kind of qualitative markers and not hard numbers, but it is something. It's the best we can do versus going back in time before the wreck and using the bows before they sank  :D.

Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #39 on: January 29, 2019, 04:43:10 am »
DC: https://imgur.com/Ibn0MiL   and    https://imgur.com/wdTVF6G   Here are the pictures of the limb spot after making it to 29". I shot it at 29" yesterday and it was a wonderfully smooth shooter. I will try to get it back to 31" though because I will definitely accidentally overdraw it since I'm not used to anchoring at 29".

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #40 on: January 29, 2019, 05:49:51 am »
That should be ok as it is near the neutral plane so neither under tension nor compression. :)
Looking good :)

Del
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Offline DC

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #41 on: January 29, 2019, 07:15:31 am »
Thanks for the pictures. It still makes me do a little double take. it will probably be fine but if it does break I'd bet a dollar that it breaks there. One side looks fine but the other is a bit iffy. I guess it just depends on how deep the iffy stuff goes. It could be skin deep or it could go 7/8 of the way through. It looks gorgeous and bends beautifully though. Good job!
Vancouver Island
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Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #42 on: January 29, 2019, 08:46:25 am »
https://imgur.com/ejpBDPg

IT MADE IT! Boy it takes some juevos to bring a bow you're not so sure about to full draw. I pulled it to 31.5" on the tree for safety and here it is at my full 31" anchor in the hand. At 31" on the tree it weighed in at 109#. I can't wait to shoot it in and then get a finish on it. It's in the teens Fahrenheit and dry here so definitely not good self bow weather. But this weekend hopefully a shoot video will be upon us. I am very thankful to any and all of you who contributed in this thread. It is a great feeling to have the bow you envisioned in the stave make it to real life.

In regards to previous comments- DelCat: I see what you are saying. I think It would've been most scary had I reduced sap and it ended up in the tension plane. Thank you very much for your help. It shall leave a beautiful two tone effect in the bow.

DC: No problem. Imgur helps streamline it while keeping good quality pics. Yeah It's still spooky to look at and we truly can't call it a bow till its been shot through at 31" but its appearance hasn't changed at all since the beginning. Thank you very much for your advice and compliments. I'm trying to dial in the proper tiller in terms of round arc and elliptical through every bow I make. I think the fact that this one didn't blow is a show of improvement. 

Offline Del the cat

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #43 on: February 11, 2019, 09:03:35 am »
Looks good :)
Most important thing in a Yew warbow is decent sapwood.
I had some wood from a log that had been lying on the ground, First Warbow blew, but it did have a big knot... second exploded.... third one, I sawed off the sapwood and glued on a strip of yew sapwood from my secret stash  ;D . This one didn't blow... same heart wood, decent sapwood.
Del
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Offline peacefullymadewarbows

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Re: Second growth yew question. (UPDATE #3 WITH VIDEO)
« Reply #44 on: February 19, 2019, 10:36:09 am »
Man that must've been a tough laminating job having to get those two pieces to marry well. Yeah I enjoy a good sap heart barrier both to look at and also the feeling of reassurance it won't blow. Just got this one it tru oiled and polished so hopefully will make finished post soon. Thanks again Del.