Alternative ways of putting horn bows together

[JW_Halverson]

The thinly veiled insults and name calling is supporting my suspicions.

Trust me when I tell you this, you DON'T wanna go there, son.

[Yooper Bowyer]

JW, I think your quote format got a little mixed up.

Hanibal, you can question what, why, and how these guys do what they do; they are very generous with information, but if you want to be an upstanding member of this community do not tell them they are wrong unless you can give some evidence for why you are right.  Look up this guy's posts and see what to say clear of. 

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=19816

This is the thread where he really fluffed feathers.  You can disagree, but you have to be respectful.  People here are proud of their work.

http://www.primitivearcher.com/smf/index.php/topic,69664.msg978142.html#msg978142

[AndrewS]

@Hanibal

have a look: https://www.archerylibrary.com/books/faris-elmer/arab-archery/

or if you are more scientific: https://www.archerylibrary.com/books/hickman/archery-the-technical-side/hickman/a-new-bow-of-radical-design-construction-and-performance/

[bownarra]

InnerSmile,

To the point of your inquiry, I don’t recall or have never read anything regarding tack secured horn plates.  My experience in horn bows is, however, limited.  I would be interested in seeing examples of this, perhaps you can post those?

Seeing as how you are new to the forum with few posts and are diving down an esoteric rabbit hole it doesn’t seem simple minded to question your intentions or perspective, at all.  It seems, instead, properly justified.

You write “This archery stuff...”.  That does come across as though you have very limited personal experience.  But, perhaps I am wrong. If so, please, post some of your work so the community can gain insight into your background and intention.

You are proposing that someone ought to pursue a tack driven project.  You thereby ask for someone else’s time and effort.  With sincerity, do you have intentions to work at answering this question for yourself?  If so, I am confident that the forum will do its level best to support your efforts to illustrate a more refined and intelligent approach to the craft.

Sincerely,

Stephen Parnell


What a beautifully written post, I may not be able to write as eloquently as above but I certainly appreciate it
A lot of these 'controversial' posts are written by bots....not a real person in sight. The way the posts are written usually gives them away....

[Yooper Bowyer]

I don't think bots are an issue here because each member is hand screened, and PA is an obscure language anyway.

[BowEd]

Most times I ignore these non self proven statements by those anxious to participate on this forum but just plain too lazy to try.
I don't pride myself on being appeasing to those with attitudes.
There's way too much bad info and assumptions spread around on this forum from 1 time attempts never solved,second or third hand plagerized info or theorists that think this can be all solved on paper.It's good to keep records of designs,length,width,degree of reflex,types of wood and composites etc.You still gotta pull shavings and bend wood to really know.The problem solving most times is kept in your head.
This is a bow making learning site.Bow building is problem solving 101.Come in with an honest,sincere,serious attitude to learn.Check your attitude out at the door.Sometimes you get advice you don't want to hear.
Once you make enough bows the language of those is not obscure.

[Gimlis Ghost]

Well looks like there is some disagreement going on, which I have no part of.
I've whittled out a few bows in the past and I'm here to learn as much as possible.
That said awhile back I ran across an excerpt from a historians paper on ancient bows. He mentioned a African/Egyptian bow made from two horns spliced at the middle by a wooden grip.
Yesterday I ran across this image.



I'm figuring a sturdy grip with tapered ends might work to join these horns, which I believe are hollow for several inches at least.
I suspect these long narrow horns would take to being soaked and bent very nicely to get a proper recurved shape.

Don't know the size of this species but there are or were several very large species of antelope with extremely long horns, some very straight.
No doubt African trophy horns of any sort are getting harder to come by but antique sets show up now and then grandfathered in.

I remember a scene in a very old sand and sandal film, can't remember which one, where preparing for a war Greek craftsmen were placing soaked rams horn bows on drying racks with pins similar to belaying pins to give them a recurve shape. How historically accurate that might have been is anybody's guess.
It occurred to me then that the horns must have been spliced at the grips in some manner.

Glue should hold it well enough but the tension of the string itself can hold a modern light takedown bow together.

[JW_Halverson]

Famously, gemsbock horns have been used to make a bow like you describe. There was a photo of one in one of the Bowyers Bibles.

[Gimlis Ghost]

Famously, gemsbock horns have been used to make a bow like you describe. There was a photo of one in one of the Bowyers Bibles.

Cool, I'll try to find an image of that one.
Apparently the Gemsbok has been introduced into New Mexico, in one specific area where they won't upset the natural order.
It would be really nice to recreate one of those ancient designs. They appear to predate all the other horn and sinew bows at least in Egypt.
The females have long slender horns while the males have thicker horns better suited for battle. My guess is the female horns would be best choice for bow limbs. The horns can be as much as 33 inches long.
If I had one I'd rather have it with a fairly light draw weight but snappy enough for a fairly high velocity.

I'd leave it unglued but the grip ends bedded closely and the opening of the horns hooped with a decorative metal ring to avoid splitting. Then it would make for a compact takedown.

[bownarra]

Those bows certainly look cool....but unfortunately they are dogs to shoot.....The best use for those horns is to glue them to a wooden core and sinew back it

[Gimlis Ghost]

Those bows certainly look cool....but unfortunately they are dogs to shoot.....The best use for those horns is to glue them to a wooden core and sinew back it

Apparently I didn't exactly rediscover a lost art. I googled up quite a few gemsbok bow builds, and they follow my ideas almost exactly.
It is a chore getting these to shoot well but its been done.
All bending is done with dry heat rather than soaking, 300 degrees F is recommended with any higher resulting in destruction of the horn.
The outer surface is scraped  down back and belly to get the limbs to draw smoothly and tiller without excessive stacking.
The best of these I've seen on another board turned out fantastic. Sinew wrapping the first few inches at the base prevents splitting. Its best to forget making a takedown, though it has been done. Unless securely glued and pinned recoil can increase likelihood of cracking even if the bases are tightly wrapped.
Maximum draw length before the limbs stack to the point they can't be drawn further seems to be short, but if done up properly a 26+ DL can be achieved if the horns are long enough.

PS
Somewhere it was mentioned that a company was using pressed horn. I have a near century old antique pistol with highly decorative grip panels I'd found odd looking because they had damage from being chewed on by tiny insects.so they weren't likely to be synthetic. I looked into it and found these grips were made using steamed and compressed goat horn. The result looked like molded gutta percha or plastic but much more durable. IIRC the Belgian manufacturer of these pistols imported these grips from Turkey.